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Apple blocks Pragmatic Programmers' release of iPhone book for developers

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Re: Apple blocks Pragmatic Programmers' release of iPhone book for developers

#51

Post by raganwald »

wayne wrote: post #3

I don't get how this helps Apple. They don't want Android copying their API or something? Guess it doesn't matter as long as the iPhone remains super popular. And man, it sucks to spend all that time writing a book, find a happy publisher, and then not be able to release it cause of this.

it sucks to spend all that time writing a book, find a happy publisher, and then not be able to release it cause of this

Seriously? You get some technology, sign an NDA saying you an't publish a book, write a book any ways, and then it sucks that nothing has changed? What exactly sucks other than the business plan of investing time and energy in the hope that someone else changes their mind about an agreement you signed?

Re: Apple blocks Pragmatic Programmers' release of iPhone book for developers

#52

Post by raganwald »

Harkins wrote: post #48
lux wrote: post #8

It doesn't sound like Apple actually blocked it, just that since they haven't lifted the NDA this can't be published yet, and since they don't seem to be concerned with lifting the NDA they probably won't publish it anytime soon. Additional developer resources, esp. a book from these guys, would be very welcome though...

Your subtle distinction comes down to: it's not that they blocked it, it's that they haven't stopped blocking it. I don't see a reason to treat that significantly differently.

There's no reason to treat them differently, I agree.

The question I have is why we're still talking about old news? I'm searching this story in vain for some aditional bit of information that is actionable in any way.

Re: Apple blocks Pragmatic Programmers' release of iPhone book for developers

#53

Post by jimm »

rbanffy wrote: post #45
wayne wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Serious? That's hard core. This might discourage me from developing for the iPhone, but it's not going to make me buy a Zune over an iPod. :)

That's more or less what I do. Many of my toys are Apple, but I buy my more important stuff elsewhere. As much as I would love to be able to use a Mac for my work, OSX is just not Unix-ish enough for me.

In what ways? I have used OSX at work for years. It is plenty "Unix-ish" for me, and I've been using *nix for twenty-five years.

Re: Apple blocks Pragmatic Programmers' release of iPhone book for developers

#55

Post by bp001 »

raganwald wrote: post #51
wayne wrote: post #3

I don't get how this helps Apple. They don't want Android copying their API or something? Guess it doesn't matter as long as the iPhone remains super popular. And man, it sucks to spend all that time writing a book, find a happy publisher, and then not be able to release it cause of this.

it sucks to spend all that time writing a book, find a happy publisher, and then not be able to release it cause of this Seriously? You get some technology, sign an NDA saying you an't publish a book, write a book any ways, and then it sucks that nothing has changed? What exactly sucks other than the business plan of investing time and energy in the hope that someone else changes their mind about an agreement you sig…

The author did take a risk here, but the risk looked to be minimal upfront. It is amazing to that Apple continues to take this stance with their NDA.

Any artificial barrier that cuts down on developer freedom and productivity will keep developers away from a platform.

Yes, the author made the assumption that Apple understood that a level of openness is required take a platform's popularity to the next level.

Re: Apple blocks Pragmatic Programmers' release of iPhone book for developers

#56

Post by bp001 »

raganwald wrote: post #52
Harkins wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your subtle distinction comes down to: it's not that they blocked it, it's that they haven't stopped blocking it. I don't see a reason to treat that significantly differently.

There's no reason to treat them differently, I agree. The question I have is why we're still talking about old news? I'm searching this story in vain for some aditional bit of information that is actionable in any way.

An NDA being in place is a bit of an abstract concept for people and can seem relatively harmless until you hear of concrete examples of how that has impacted participants.

The reason this example is worthwhile is to aid the decision making process of those who are considering contributing to this platform. People need to fully understand the risks to invested time.

Re: Apple blocks Pragmatic Programmers' release of iPhone book for developers

#57

Post by sovande »

pavelludiq wrote: post #30
mroman wrote: post #5

This is outrageous. That's it, I am going to refrain from purchasing any and all Apple products from here on, am going to encourage others to do the same, and will also refrain from recommending their products to anyone.

Sometimes it feels lonely being an open source advocate, but reading this, there was a smirk on my face, and my first thought was "Told them so". I love it when people suffer for trusting big companies, its like their own fault, big co's are evil by definition, you should know better than to trust them. You con use their products, but trusting them, or even worse, to love them? In the expression "common sense", peopl…

idiot

Re: Apple blocks Pragmatic Programmers' release of iPhone book for developers

#58

Post by sovande »

raganwald wrote: post #50

Apple builds a plantation. Sharecroppers move in, deciding of their own free will that life working for "Massa" is good. A sign at the front gate says, "The first rule of the Apple Plantation is that Sharecroppers do not talk about the Apple Plantation." So the sign is still up and the Pragamatic Programmers are waiting untilt he sign comes down. Interesting, but not a single bit of new information. Must be a slow ne…

Hi Ragnwald didn't you plan on taking a break :)

Re: Apple blocks Pragmatic Programmers' release of iPhone book for developers

#59

Post by mroman »

axod wrote: post #47
mroman wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes I am being serious. Hate fest? Personally, I have simply expressed the decision I have made as a consumer in reaction to actions I find offensive by a company. I am also acting in my own best interests, as I have no interest in purchasing products from a company that engages in the sort of tactics we have been seeing lately. Please do elaborate on how their tactics are safeguarding the best interests of their cus…

Well, good luck finding a company that doesn't use NDA's etc to protect their interests.

Protecting Company Interests (profit) != Stifling Competition

NDA != License to Engage in Abusive Conduct

Re: Apple blocks Pragmatic Programmers' release of iPhone book for developers

#60

Post by raganwald »

bp001 wrote: post #55
raganwald wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

it sucks to spend all that time writing a book, find a happy publisher, and then not be able to release it cause of this Seriously? You get some technology, sign an NDA saying you an't publish a book, write a book any ways, and then it sucks that nothing has changed? What exactly sucks other than the business plan of investing time and energy in the hope that someone else changes their mind about an agreement you sig…

The author did take a risk here, but the risk looked to be minimal upfront. It is amazing to that Apple continues to take this stance with their NDA. Any artificial barrier that cuts down on developer freedom and productivity will keep developers away from a platform. Yes, the author made the assumption that Apple understood that a level of openness is required take a platform's popularity to the next level.

Any artificial barrier that cuts down on developer freedom and productivity will keep developers away from a platform. Yes, the author made the assumption that Apple understood that a level of openness is required take a platform's popularity to the next level.

This is a point I see over and over again. People who are not Apple managers telling Apple what Apple ought to do to run their business successfully.

I appreciate you are being sincere, but as a long-time Apple watcher, I also recall people saying much the same thing about clones, about running Windows, about sticking with OS9, about supporting Java on iPhone, about being bought by Sun, and a great number of other things that Apple chose not to do, or chose to do later, or chose to do and undo and not redo.

You may be right that in some alternate universe Apple would be more successful if you called the shots instead of Steve Jobs.

But if we can return to the point of the post, it is that Steve Jobs is the CEO, Apple is doing what it does rather than what you or I want it to do, and it is foolish to make bets that Apple will reverse one of their positions just because you or I think they ought to do so.

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