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How Russian Tycoon Yuri Milner Bought His Way Into Silicon Valley

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Re: How Russian Tycoon Yuri Milner Bought His Way Into Silicon Valley

#91

Post by [deleted] »

DilipJ wrote: post #62
pg wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let me be more precise. When I said the situation was not as simple as his comment implied, I meant that even if Yuri's money was tainted in some way, it was being used as a counterweight to another bad thing.

"The reason VCs don't like Yuri is that he is disturbing the cosy world they formerly inhabited by offering more founder friendly terms." I greatly respect and admire you pg, and god knows you're far more intelligent than I am, but surely you can't be so naive as to think that Milner is doing what he is doing out of some altruism for founders? He is spending outlandish amounts on startups for the same reason Abramovi…

[deleted]

Re: How Russian Tycoon Yuri Milner Bought His Way Into Silicon Valley

#92

Post by sunnydaynow »

DilipJ wrote: post #62
pg wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let me be more precise. When I said the situation was not as simple as his comment implied, I meant that even if Yuri's money was tainted in some way, it was being used as a counterweight to another bad thing.

"The reason VCs don't like Yuri is that he is disturbing the cosy world they formerly inhabited by offering more founder friendly terms." I greatly respect and admire you pg, and god knows you're far more intelligent than I am, but surely you can't be so naive as to think that Milner is doing what he is doing out of some altruism for founders? He is spending outlandish amounts on startups for the same reason Abramovi…

I wish I could upvote this 100 times. It summarizes my impression very well. And - if Yuri earned his money honestly like e. g. pg or the Google guys - it would by easy for Yuri to publish a blog post outlining the details.

Re: How Russian Tycoon Yuri Milner Bought His Way Into Silicon Valley

#94

Post by JanezStupar »

guard-of-terra wrote: post #90
JanezStupar wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed it is. Upon my realization that I should try harder to disqualify you, Edit timer has already passed. So I will offer my clarification here. This notion, that somehow in Eastern Block everybody had their basic needs covered in an egalitarian fashion while in Western Capitalism, to get any kind of (fair?) treatment one better be lined with cash is sorely mistaken. In reality Eastern Block was very much as your…

An interesting description, but how does it contradict with things I said earlier in the thread? More specifically: that he might not care about wealth as something one buys with money .

Not sure if serious...

We are talking extremely corrupt societies here. Saying that one does not need money at all - would imply that this someone is a member of top of the top of a corrupt regime, thus having anything one would desire available at mere whim (due to sheer terror one's position instills in others).

But for everybody else - money (or another medium of exchange) is essential to get basic services or indeed keep ones liberty or life intact.

What you are saying is that Gang Lords have no need for money, since they will get everything they desire on a whim, while civil people need to trade and barter to get goods and services that they require.

Thus you are painting Yuri as an ascet who deals with insane amounts of money out of sheer joy of helping rich Russian magnates increase their holdings. However according to you he has no other (especially) material goals for himself.

Re: How Russian Tycoon Yuri Milner Bought His Way Into Silicon Valley

#95

Post by guard-of-terra »

JanezStupar wrote: post #94
guard-of-terra wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

An interesting description, but how does it contradict with things I said earlier in the thread? More specifically: that he might not care about wealth as something one buys with money .

Not sure if serious... We are talking extremely corrupt societies here. Saying that one does not need money at all - would imply that this someone is a member of top of the top of a corrupt regime, thus having anything one would desire available at mere whim (due to sheer terror one's position instills in others). But for everybody else - money (or another medium of exchange) is essential to get basic services or ind…

I can't agree about late USSR being "extremelly correct society". It wasn't on the whole, not much more than current USA is one (I should agree that I probably not qualified to appraise the latter).

I don't say he is an ascet. I'm just saying that he isn't motivated by being able to buy a huge house or a shiny car. And he probably wasn't, never in his life. They just come organically because of other, real things he achieve.

Re: How Russian Tycoon Yuri Milner Bought His Way Into Silicon Valley

#96

Post by jorgeortiz85 »

DilipJ wrote: post #62
pg wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Let me be more precise. When I said the situation was not as simple as his comment implied, I meant that even if Yuri's money was tainted in some way, it was being used as a counterweight to another bad thing.

"The reason VCs don't like Yuri is that he is disturbing the cosy world they formerly inhabited by offering more founder friendly terms." I greatly respect and admire you pg, and god knows you're far more intelligent than I am, but surely you can't be so naive as to think that Milner is doing what he is doing out of some altruism for founders? He is spending outlandish amounts on startups for the same reason Abramovi…

Pg is implying that Yuri's LPs are no more questionable than the LPs of the top VC firms in the Valley. They've all taken dubious money.

Re: How Russian Tycoon Yuri Milner Bought His Way Into Silicon Valley

#97

Post by JanezStupar »

guard-of-terra wrote: post #95
JanezStupar wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure if serious... We are talking extremely corrupt societies here. Saying that one does not need money at all - would imply that this someone is a member of top of the top of a corrupt regime, thus having anything one would desire available at mere whim (due to sheer terror one's position instills in others). But for everybody else - money (or another medium of exchange) is essential to get basic services or ind…

I can't agree about late USSR being "extremelly correct society". It wasn't on the whole, not much more than current USA is one (I should agree that I probably not qualified to appraise the latter). I don't say he is an ascet. I'm just saying that he isn't motivated by being able to buy a huge house or a shiny car. And he probably wasn't, never in his life. They just come organically because of other, real things he…

I couldn't possibly imagine what people with billions of dollars of assets at their disposal feel like.

What are his motives? Beats me. He may be after a better high, better orgasm, fast cars, eternal life, global domination. Or he may just want to live a tranquil life with Jane Average and make babies and peacefully pass away.

Either way it certainly cannot be inferred from this article.

But comparing Yuri Milner to Perelman is interesting in an ingenious kind of way.

Perelman and Milner are from two completely different faces of Russia. And I'd wager that Perelman's disenchantment has a lot more to do with people like Milner than vice versa.

Re: How Russian Tycoon Yuri Milner Bought His Way Into Silicon Valley

#98

Post by guard-of-terra »

JanezStupar wrote: post #97
guard-of-terra wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't agree about late USSR being "extremelly correct society". It wasn't on the whole, not much more than current USA is one (I should agree that I probably not qualified to appraise the latter). I don't say he is an ascet. I'm just saying that he isn't motivated by being able to buy a huge house or a shiny car. And he probably wasn't, never in his life. They just come organically because of other, real things he…

I couldn't possibly imagine what people with billions of dollars of assets at their disposal feel like. What are his motives? Beats me. He may be after a better high, better orgasm, fast cars, eternal life, global domination. Or he may just want to live a tranquil life with Jane Average and make babies and peacefully pass away. Either way it certainly cannot be inferred from this article. But comparing Yuri Milner to…

They are very close age; Both had jewish parents; Which were part of soviet intellectual elite/science. I can guess that the environment in which they both were raised is nearly the same.

Perelman's disenchantment is caused by his mathematical institute stupid old professors who didn't care about math as a science (i.e. way to figure out new things), only focused on art of reiterating same things over and over again. Which led him to think that the official math scientific community is dead. He said it in interviews.

It does not seem to have anything with "people like Milner".

Re: How Russian Tycoon Yuri Milner Bought His Way Into Silicon Valley

#99

Post by peterjs »

pg wrote: post #57
chunkybacon wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually, it would seem to be just as simple as he implies. VCs in the valley care only about money and don't give a hoot about morality. You haven't debated the fact that Milner is linked to the looting of state resources; you've simply said that anyone else would also take his money if they could. Makes all you VCs and Angels in the Valley seem like dogs fighting over a doggie biscuit -- or in this case, the looted…

Let me be more precise. When I said the situation was not as simple as his comment implied, I meant that even if Yuri's money was tainted in some way, it was being used as a counterweight to another bad thing.

“Founder unfriendly conditions” do not compare to the way oligarchs operate and the consequences of their actions.

Much of the authenticity that comes through in your essays is based on being truly committed to the things you talk about. They are often controversial and authoritative (in a good way), but the possible discrepancy between what you say and what you do could easily undermine that authenticity.

Saying that other VCs do not care where their money comes from, does not make sense here. They are not judged as authorities on topics you write about.

Do you disagree with any of these points?

- You can use the profits from investing tainted money for further investments, but the money still stinks.

- The money that came from DST's partners is tainted.

Re: How Russian Tycoon Yuri Milner Bought His Way Into Silicon Valley

#100

Post by nivertech »

nivertech wrote: post #88
pg wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Money laundering = disguising the path money takes. These transactions are extremely traceable. It is equally ridiculous to propose the goal is to get money out of Russia. How does investing in startups make that any easier? If the money can get to a startup in the US, ipso facto it can get out of Russia, to any other investment. I would not be surprised to see such an obviously mistaken comment upvoted on reddit, bu…

I think, what 0x12 is trying to say, that highly-leveraged investments are a great way to launder money: i.e. you may have only 10% in "clean" money, leveraged 10:1 to cover over 90% of "dirty" money. I don't think this is the case with DST. This is just a usual case of envy. I'll take DST money any day. Hell, I'll give 10% of my company to Yuri Milner, any day, even without the investment (this is not a legally bind…

One may think, that early bet on Facebook is not a per-say highly-leveraged, because it must be paid in full cash.

In practice it's such a risky investment, so it should be considered more like an option or outright gamble.

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