Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Pedal Me bans staff riders from wearing helmets for safety reasons

bikebiz.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

341–350 of 797 posts

Re: Pedal Me bans staff riders from wearing helmets for safety reasons

#341

Post by Mountain_Skies »

nayuki wrote: post #241

This is very much like: > The name "Tullock's spike" refers to a thought experiment in which Tullock suggested that if governments were serious about reducing road casualties, they should mandate that a sharp spike be installed in the center of each car's steering wheel, to increase the probability that an accident would be fatal to the driver. Tullock's idea was that the normal process of risk compensation would the…

It's a good thought experiment but assumes that everyone has the same ability to assess risk, which isn't true. Not only does the ability to correctly assess risk vary greatly between individuals, it varies greatly over the lifetime of an individual and sometimes even over the course of a day for the same individual.

Re: Pedal Me bans staff riders from wearing helmets for safety reasons

#342

Post by GuB-42 »

dymk wrote: post #289
GuB-42 wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So why not do the reasonable thing and provide passengers with helmets, like they do with motorbike taxi?

Lice

It is a consideration, but there are solutions, like disposable caps. There are also sanitizing sprays. It wouldn't be the first time people share helmets.

Also, the idea is to offer an option. Not to make it mandatory unless legislation require it. If your passengers are more comfortable not wearing them, their choice.

Re: Pedal Me bans staff riders from wearing helmets for safety reasons

#344

Post by alexggordon »

Note, these are not normal bikes. From the article:

> A major cause of head injuries is going over the handlebars, which is not possible with a 3 metre long bike. Another thing that makes us unique is our training systems, maintenance systems, and ability to track poor rider behaviour.

Made me curious what they actually look like[0].

Seeing that, I’d tend to reset my presumptions about wearing helmets with these. There’s definitely going to be a different injury profile with these bikes than the bikes you rode as a kid. Without seeing those injury profiles I’d probably say you can’t really deduce anything from this announcement.

[0] https://www.positive.news/wp-content/uploads/2020/02/Pedal-M...

Re: Pedal Me bans staff riders from wearing helmets for safety reasons

#345

Post by aoeusnth1 »

practice9 wrote: post #315
buildingsramen wrote: post #287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did you read the article? These bikes are 2-3 meters long. There is no chance of this type of injury occurring with them.

Unless Pedal Me provide open-source data on which they based this decision, I don't believe it is based on safety. It's seems like marketing and cost-cutting issue for them. Customer: "Driver is wearing a helmet, and nobody provided helmets for us.. Are we in danger?" Pedal Me: "Say no more.. " Plus it seems they only bought caps & jackets for their drivers previously, no safety gear. Drivers are replaceable, aren't…

Why is a 5 meter long motorized bike with an enclosed cabin street legal?

Re: Pedal Me bans staff riders from wearing helmets for safety reasons

#346

Post by altcognito »

ndsipa_pomu wrote: post #338
spankalee wrote: post #272

I once saw an accident where a cyclist going straight through an intersection was hit by an oncoming truck turning left that was impatient, didn't see the cyclist and gunned it between cars. The cyclist was launched headfirst into the bumper of a car stopped at the light and her helmet loudly cracked in two. She was still hurt, but I'm sure she would have died without that helmet. If some riders choose to not wear a…

It concerns me that there's so many stories of bike helmets cracking in two and allegedly having saved someone's life. Bike helmets are designed to compress under impact and as such, they are very weak under tension, so when you see a helmet split into two, it indicates that it wasn't working as designed. Compressed polystyrene in the helmet would indicate that it was doing its job.

Basically, crumple zones for heads.

If you could demonstrate that the helmet was splitting and taking energy with it maybe you could make an argument for splitting, but it seems unlikely that this is a mode of operation.

Re: Pedal Me bans staff riders from wearing helmets for safety reasons

#347

Post by taeric »

ndsipa_pomu wrote: post #338
spankalee wrote: post #272

I once saw an accident where a cyclist going straight through an intersection was hit by an oncoming truck turning left that was impatient, didn't see the cyclist and gunned it between cars. The cyclist was launched headfirst into the bumper of a car stopped at the light and her helmet loudly cracked in two. She was still hurt, but I'm sure she would have died without that helmet. If some riders choose to not wear a…

It concerns me that there's so many stories of bike helmets cracking in two and allegedly having saved someone's life. Bike helmets are designed to compress under impact and as such, they are very weak under tension, so when you see a helmet split into two, it indicates that it wasn't working as designed. Compressed polystyrene in the helmet would indicate that it was doing its job.

Could be both? Usually it is the outer shell that is cracked and described as split. I could see that happening more on the road style helmets, due to their shapes.

Re: Pedal Me bans staff riders from wearing helmets for safety reasons

#348

Post by dvzk »

darkerside wrote: post #327
allears wrote: post #290

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My bicycle helmet sits on top of my head, and has nothing to do with peripheral vision. Do you wear yours pulled down low over your forehead? If so you're doing it wrong.

The strap makes it more difficult to turn your head if it's properly tight. Probably also will hit your head on the ceiling if you're in a sedan.

I think you've been fitted into the wrong helmet. Do you really think MTB riders have any more difficulty turning their heads? It's not the case. And to back up what the other person said: modern road and XC/enduro MTB helmets do not obstruct peripheral vision unless it also has a non-retractable visor. Even modern full-face helmets limit vision less than you might think.

Re: Pedal Me bans staff riders from wearing helmets for safety reasons

#349

Post by uoaei »

ascar wrote: post #297
sokoloff wrote: post #280

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are also significant legal penalties for being at-fault and injuring/killing a cyclist in the Netherlands as compared to the US.

Can you elaborate? The US has such a high incarceration rate for in European eyes often benign offenses that I find that statement hard to believe even though I don't know the Dutch laws (I'm German). E.g. I can't imagine a Dutch person being incarcerated for injuring a cyclist unless it's on alcohol/drugs. I can totally imagine that for the US though. But I might be totally wrong. Would be really curious for some de…

Cases of potential death do not count as "benign", at least in my book.

Shoplifting and really any property crime that doesn't result in imminent grave harm can be safely considered "benign". Ditto for victimless crimes like drug possession.

Re: Pedal Me bans staff riders from wearing helmets for safety reasons

#350

Post by indymike »

shkkmo wrote: post #210
indymike wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can prove that helmets reduce head injuries both in quantity and severity.

You have the exact same causal issue to untangle. Do safer riders wear helmets or does wear a helmet make you safer as a rider? In reality there are confounds both directions. The effects of helmet wearing are higly contingent based on the geography and demographics.

No, I really don't untangle anything. Safer riders ride safer, but they can and do sometimes have accidents and the road will not check your safety record before impact to see if it should hurt your more or less.

Research on helmets has been ongoing for 40 years, and has even led to ANSI standards for helmet design and protection. The UCI requires hemets in amateur and professional events. This isn't about risk taking behavior, it is simply about if you do have an accident, you won't be killed, turned into a vegetable or concussed when you hit your head.

> The effects of helmet wearing are higly contingent based on the geography and demographics.

I'm pretty sure that hitting your head on Ugandan cement will damage your head roughly the same as American Cement or European cement. S

Additionally, I've never seen any research showing any kind of demographic relationship to severity of head injuries in bicycle accidents. Nor have I once saw research that did anything other than present some statistical noise about distance cars give you based on helmet or not. Close shaves are not accidents or injuries, so even the basis of the research is questionable.

Post reply on HN