Live data from Hacker News

Nuclear fusion has encountered a shortage of tritium

wired.co.uk

91–100 of 167 posts

Re: Nuclear fusion has encountered a shortage of tritium

#91

If anyone was wondering if SPARC and ARC care about this, SPARC onsite tritium inventory is planned to be fairly low: just 10 grams (not kg) in this 2018 SPARC paper[0]. I would also speculate that 200 kg/year sounds a little bit too high, although I can't find an ARC paper to corroborate (the magic words you want are "total on-site tritium inventory"). [0] https://www1.psfc.mit.edu/research/alcator/pubs/APS/APS2018/…

[deleted]

Re: Nuclear fusion has encountered a shortage of tritium

#92

Tell that to the Sun. We already have a fusion reactor sufficient to meet all of humanity's energy needs, it's a gravitationally contained fusion reactor with a projected lifetime of at least one billion years, so why not just rely on that? Seems to have done wonders for the biosphere for the last one billion years, hasn't it?

Moreover, if we would really ever become able to produce by nuclear fusion a quantity of energy comparable with the energy received from the Sun, then that would cause by itself a great climate warming, so nuclear fusion is not a solution against it.

If the quantity of energy produced by nuclear fusion would remain negligible in comparison with the solar energy, then there is no need for it.

While on Earth using the nuclear fusion makes little sense, mastering it could enable the exploration and even the colonization of the Solar System.

Re: Nuclear fusion has encountered a shortage of tritium

#93
post #58

> “It would be an absurdity to use dirty fission reactors to fuel ‘clean’ fusion reactors,” This seems like a non-sequitur. If we need to keep around (or even build) a few heavy-water fission plants to enable the fusion industry, what's the problem? The simple phrasing of fission as "dirty" really shows the quotee's biases. You could easily envision a stable energy mix with a few percent of fission, the rest fusion a…

- "a few heavy-water fission plants" It's actually tilted very far in the opposite direction. The ratio is something like 600:1 heavy-water fission to fusion. A mix of 99.8% fission and 0.2% fusion, if your fusion is relying on that as its sole source of tritium. - "Small quantities of tritium are also produced by CANDU-type nuclear reactors—on the order of 100 grams per year for a 600 MW reactor," https://www.iter.o…

Fair enough, perhaps I was oversimplifying with my example. It seems from the OP the plan is to transition to breeding the tritium in fusion reactors, and that we currently have enough fission-produced tritium to plausibly bridge to those fusion-based processes. And the concern is that the fission reactors might shut down before we bootstrap the fusion reactors.

Still, as I said originally, it sounds like keeping our current level of fission reactors around should solve the bootstrapping problem.

Re: Nuclear fusion has encountered a shortage of tritium

#95

Tell that to the Sun. We already have a fusion reactor sufficient to meet all of humanity's energy needs, it's a gravitationally contained fusion reactor with a projected lifetime of at least one billion years, so why not just rely on that? Seems to have done wonders for the biosphere for the last one billion years, hasn't it?

Instead of asking oblique rhetorical questions, you could actually make a meaningful statement.

Fusion reactor research is kind of interesting, I suppose it's making alchemy real in a way. Stars make things like helium and lithium from raw protons and electons and neutrons, apparently. and if humans could master that we could basically solve a lot of matter limitatation problems by just making whatever elements we needed at whatever scale from nothing but hydrogen as the raw material (maybe some helium too). That's basically all sci-fi at present, but who knows.

As far as making fusion reactors to boil hot fluids to drive steam turbine-generators to power the electrical grid... doesn't seem too likely. High-efficiency monocrystalline Si PV panel fabs would be a better investment.

Re: Nuclear fusion has encountered a shortage of tritium

#96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or we could chose a number of WAY safer fission reactors for the same cost and same power output (Pick your favorite Gen IV reactor). We also don't end up creating a literal nuclear weapons manufacturing plant in every nation that wants to use this (since the "fuel" for this reactor is constantly detonating nukes).

Why not Gen III+, these are ready to go whereas most Gen IV reactors are still in the drawing board possibly early prototype phase.

I'm fine with either to be frank. I like that Gen IV reactors should have much cheaper deployment strategies.

Anything is better than the "drop a nuke in the hole" plan. Both Gen III+ and Gen IV reactors can hit the market before all the red tape is cut for prototyping the hole bomb.

Re: Nuclear fusion has encountered a shortage of tritium

#97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No shit. Turns out a daily detonation of a fusion bomb tends to wear on things and when those things fail... you've just detonated a fusion bomb.

They actually want to detonate a H-Bomb every 45 minutes, all day every day. 32 nuclear explosions every day. One does have to appreciate how these guys took anti-proliferation concerns with the nuclear industry and said "fuck it, everyone knows we're only doing this to make bombs, so lets make a shit ton of bombs". No more concerns about terrorists getting their hands on some yellowcake and making a dirty bomb. Now…

And we can expand this out to every nation so everyone gets a nuke factory to keep the lights on. :D

It's so widely impractical.

Re: Nuclear fusion has encountered a shortage of tritium

#98
post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Last week Elon explained that the problem of fusion is that it will be more expensive than solar and wind.

The real question is whether it's more expensive than solar/wind plus the batteries required for dispatchable power. The answer depends on the reactor design, which Elon doesn't know. There are a lot of possibilities, and if the first ones are too expensive, later ones might not be.

True, but that is a moving target.

https://ourworldindata.org/battery-price-decline

Re: Nuclear fusion has encountered a shortage of tritium

#99
post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The same line of reasoning says that we should build conventional light- or heavy-water reactors. The risk is minimal. And they're (a) tested and (b) much cheaper than PACER.

The advantage of a PACER setup is that you get a lot more bang (heh) per kg of uranium than you do out of a fission reactor. But the cost of uranium is not currently a problem with our fission reactors. We do have a problem with radioactive waste, but even that is way more political than it is technical. I wonder which two senators are going to be ok with detonating 32 bombs in their state every day? This isn't the 5…

Future fission reactors both don't need uranium (thorium reactors) and use less of it while waste that isn't radio active for long (breeder reactors).

Re: Nuclear fusion has encountered a shortage of tritium

#100
post #80

ITAR should be shut down. Straight up. It's a complete waste of taxpayer funds taht holds no prospect of producing commercially viable power. Its design constraints were decided decades ago. Since then science and engineering has advanced a lot. I'd love if it fusion became commercially viable but I'm doubtful it ever will. At the least the kind involving fusion atoms in a plasma for all the documented reasons, most…

Well, for all practical purposes, ITER was shut down.

https://www.world-nuclear-news.org/Articles/ITER-tokamak-ass...

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-france-nuclear-fusion/ite...

Post reply on HN