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Total Commander forced to stop letting you install APKs

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51–60 of 92 posts

Re: Total Commander forced to stop letting you install APKs

#51
post #12

I'm confused, I thought the ability to install apps outside of Play is supported by the OS. In fact there's a permissions dialog that pops up when an app tries to install another app. This is critical functionality for, say, the FDroid app store, as well as the browser, which is how most people would acquire FDroid. Seems like a bad omen.

Basically google doesn't allow app store competitors on their own app store.

Selectively, at least

If you're mozilla or google then it's fine to publish apps that can download apks from a very convenient interface indeed. If you're total commander, well...

Re: Total Commander forced to stop letting you install APKs

#52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this something that only happens with some banks? I have GrapheneOS on my Pixel 6 with F-droid, and the banking app of ABN AMRO from the Play store just works.

In my experience the ING NL app also works perfectly fine on rooted devices. You can usually apply a working Magisk Hide plugin relatively easily for apps that don't support it. I suspect that some banks use a whitelist rather than a blacklist for certain phones.

Some also check for other signals indicating root - for example, if Samsung Knox shows up as enabled in the build properties, but accessing it fails with an exception, the phone was rooted at least once (even if you re-flash an official firmware and re-lock the bootloader, the Knox Secure Enclave stays dead).

Tricking out these detections is a nightmare.

Re: Total Commander forced to stop letting you install APKs

#53
post #23

From a security standpoint, it seems something like this being vetted on the app store is safer than forcing users to download from a browser. I wonder if this is specifically about anti-competitiveness, or placating governmental censors, or something else.

From a security standpoint, it would be better if no apps could be installed at all. I've hidden the store on my grandma's device before because she was quite likely to just tap anything, shiny or no.

(Every time I'd visit, she'd have managed to turn the carefully laid out homescreen to "simple mode" and she couldn't find half her apps because they were now either on the second screen or off the homescreen altogether. The only logical way to change this setting is long press on an empty area, look around, and press the button with the "simple" keyword. I suppose her thought process was: simple? That sounds good for me! And then not connecting this action to that her OS now looks completely different and just trying to keep using it as if everything is normal.)

But security doesn't come in absolutes and this should absolutely not be enforced as a general policy for everyone. It feels like limiting where people can drive because some roads are more dangerous than others (some have trees, others have distracting ads, imagine we'd let just anyone go anywhere!), and the road owner can legally decide where you can go because all destinations you could possibly want are are on someone else's road (where someone else is a single entity)

Re: Total Commander forced to stop letting you install APKs

#55
post #6

> As mentioned previously, your app (APK versions 1031, 1032, 1033, 1034, 1035 and 1036) causes users to download or install applications from unknown sources outside of Google Play. Google Chrome can download APKs from sources outside of Google Play. By that logic Chrome should also be removed from the play store. Any antitrust lawyers want to chime in? Why isn't this illegal?

Will this have any implications for f-droid?

No. F-droid isn't on the play store as far as I can see. You go to their site, download the APK yourself, and install it manually. It's outside the scope of Google's Play store rules.

Re: Total Commander forced to stop letting you install APKs

#57
post #14

Might as well get an iPhone at that point. The fragmentation rate is slight enough to provide for excellent jailbreak support.

Definitely not. It can still theoretically be forked if it gets bad enough and the right people get motivated enough. No reason to jump from the frying pan into the fire.

What can be forked? Android isn't blocking anything, Play Store and Total Commander are closed source.

Re: Total Commander forced to stop letting you install APKs

#58
post #6

> As mentioned previously, your app (APK versions 1031, 1032, 1033, 1034, 1035 and 1036) causes users to download or install applications from unknown sources outside of Google Play. Google Chrome can download APKs from sources outside of Google Play. By that logic Chrome should also be removed from the play store. Any antitrust lawyers want to chime in? Why isn't this illegal?

> Any antitrust lawyers want to chime in? Why isn't this illegal? It's unlikely to meet an antitrust threshold because it's a single example of incompetence rather than policy - the Google Play store developer guidelines and agreements do permit this functionality, it's just that there is no functioning review process when people cock up. You would probably have to demonstrate that it was a systemic problem before yo…

It's cold strategic calculation masquerading as an honest policy. They are boiling frogs.

Re: Total Commander forced to stop letting you install APKs

#59
post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, but f-droid et al cannot update in the background. That's a problem.

I consider that a good feature. I decline about half the updates. Some of those "simple" family tools have had "updates" that add nagging and attempts to get you to upgrade to a paid premium version.

Being able to selectively turn auto-updates off is a feature. Not having a choice is not a feature.

Re: Total Commander forced to stop letting you install APKs

#60

I'm confused, I thought the ability to install apps outside of Play is supported by the OS. In fact there's a permissions dialog that pops up when an app tries to install another app. This is critical functionality for, say, the FDroid app store, as well as the browser, which is how most people would acquire FDroid. Seems like a bad omen.

> I'm confused, I thought the ability to install apps outside of Play is supported by the OS. It is. What this is doing is forbidding apps that can install other apps from being in the Play store. Basically, if Total Commander wanted to give the finger to Google and refuse to remove the function, Google would remove them from the Play store, meaning you'd likely have to either use your browser to find and download th…

But what if Google says your browser isn't allowed? Then you'd have to use ADB.
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