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U.S. Air Force says it conducted successful hypersonic weapon test

reuters.com

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Re: U.S. Air Force says it conducted successful hypersonic weapon test

#81

Post by cracrecry »

zozin wrote: post #16
cersa8 wrote: post #10

How much of this is hype and boasting about military advances. According to this article hypersonic missiles are far from practical https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/the-physics-and-h...

They are. Chinese and Russian “advances” in hypersonics are pure marketing. The US was testing scramjets in the 1960s. The US has a hypersonic space plane. Alas, the media fell for it and billions are now being spent on “catching up” with our “peer” competitors.

This is not Marketing. This is a real thing.

It is a real thing that they can put a several nukes in one of those and kill the entire population of New York, or London, or Paris in five minutes.

Also it is real that Putin has used exactly that card, that threat as a negotiation tactic, in order to get away with invading a foreign country, in order to compensate for the joke of a country they are.

Putin has specifically said that: that he developed those weapons, that they can be nuclear and no country can neutralize them.

History teaches us that accommodated Societies usually fall under much primitive rules like the Mongols with Genghis Khan, or the Huns, The Romans (against the Greeks), the Germanic tribes(against the Romans), the Arabs(against the Persian and Byzantine empires), the British against the Spanish Empire, the Russians against the Germans and so on.

The US, or UK, France, Poland or Germany just can't ignore it, whenever they like it or not. There is someone out there telling Ukraine is their property or else.

They need to develop a neutralization of those weapons.

A country just can't ignore an Arms race if the adversary follows it, they have to follow as well.

Re: U.S. Air Force says it conducted successful hypersonic weapon test

#82

Post by tablespoon »

greedo wrote: post #73
nimbius wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the missile in TFA only achieved fivefold the speed of sound. Russias Avangard moves at twenty-seven times the speed of sound. thats faster than the re-entry speed for the space shuttle endeavor. it also advertises a newfound maneuverability. Americans under-estimate their adversaries sadly quite often. when the TU95 bear first arrived during the cold war era its specifications were habitually lowballed by analysts u…

The US also overestimates the threats from its potential adversaries quite frequently. The Soviets weren't 10ft tall, and the modern Russian military has been shown to be quite fragile in Ukraine. Perhaps military intelligence is a bit harder than posting on HN.

> The US also overestimates the threats from its potential adversaries quite frequently.

Yeah, for instance, IIRC, the F-15 (at least partially) resulted from a severe over-estimation of the capabilities of the Mig-25.

Re: U.S. Air Force says it conducted successful hypersonic weapon test

#83

Post by robonerd »

gsibble wrote: post #65
kcb wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> US missile defense system, which the US doesn't really even have Uh..Missile defense is a massive part of US Navy doctrine and is pretty much the primary purpose of every Destroyer, Cruiser, and soon Frigate in the Navy at this point. Without a doubt, the Aegis system and THAAD are the direct reason for these developments from China and Russia.

This. We have hundreds of Aegis boats sitting off our coasts waiting for it to rain MIRVs.

> We have hundreds of Aegis boats

113, if you count Japan's, Korea's, and the rest of NATO (with 137 more planned.) These are spread around the world, and only some of them are Aegis BMD. And not all of those will be ready when they're needed. A few dozen Aegis BMD ships off the coast of the US seems plausible.

Besides Aegis, there is THAAD (which only protects a handful of rather small areas) and GMD (which only has a few dozen interceptors.) If China/Russia threw hundreds of missiles at the continental US all at once, it's a good bet that at least some would get through and wreck havoc.

Re: U.S. Air Force says it conducted successful hypersonic weapon test

#84

Post by rad88 »

ritwikgupta wrote: post #70
cersa8 wrote: post #10

How much of this is hype and boasting about military advances. According to this article hypersonic missiles are far from practical https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/the-physics-and-h...

Hypersonics are already being used in warfare today [1][2][3]. They are already practical weapons and gaining parity in offensive and defensive capabilities is critical. [1] https://www.cnn.com/2022/03/22/europe/biden-russia-hypersoni... [2] https://www.defenseone.com/threats/2022/05/russia-has-fired-... [3] https://www.euronews.com/2022/05/10/russia-fires-hypersonic-...

> Russia is thought to have an HGV in its arsenal.

> ..

> But the Kinzhal, as a variant of the Iskander SRBM, is not an HGV

Re: U.S. Air Force says it conducted successful hypersonic weapon test

#85

Post by rad88 »

dirtyid wrote: post #40
cersa8 wrote: post #10

How much of this is hype and boasting about military advances. According to this article hypersonic missiles are far from practical https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/the-physics-and-h...

Not practical for US who has platforms to hit global targets at much lower costs, i.e. money spent on hypersonic research can build up enough JASSMs to last until WW5. But IMO useful backup if adversaries manage to negate platforms like carriers and long range bombers. Basically, establishing conventional MAD with CONUS Prompt Global Strike using icbm/hypersonics. Flip side is this is massively benefitial to PRC (or…

Honest question, how would you describe MAD as being practical? Bearing in mind that the treaties to maintain it were abandoned, and both sides invest (and act) heavily in rocking the boat?

Re: U.S. Air Force says it conducted successful hypersonic weapon test

#86

Post by FredPret »

SkyMarshal wrote: post #30
HPsquared wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Orbital speeds within the atmosphere, basically. Edit: I suppose that means the vehicle wouldn't need any aerodynamic lift when going at full speed; indeed, to maintain altitude it'd need negative lift.

Barely within the atmosphere, I assume. Mach 20 at commercial jet altitudes would probably melt the aircraft.

Wonder if this would be much of an issue for a missile. It can melt away on the outside to a degree, as long as the payload gets there intact. And it can get anywhere on the planet in an hour, so perhaps a sacrificial shield would work.

Re: U.S. Air Force says it conducted successful hypersonic weapon test

#87

Post by mywittyname »

hammock wrote: post #75
oneoff786 wrote: post #4

I believe most explosives detonate in the air anymore. Is there a speed threshold where the kinetic energy is enough to justify not doing that?

Look up "rods from God." https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kinetic_bombardment https://www.businessinsider.com/air-force-rods-from-god-kine... .

It always baffled me that these weren't named after Zeus.

Re: U.S. Air Force says it conducted successful hypersonic weapon test

#88

Post by rad88 »

greedo wrote: post #74
hdjjhhvvhga wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Moreover, even if Aegis fails to intercept it, the manoeuvre to avoid the intercepting missiles in the terminal phase at hypersonic speeds means a huge miss, at least for conventional warheads.

I don't know of any missiles that have enough situational awareness to attempt to actively avoid an interceptor. They might dispense decoys (like the Iskander does), but a hypersonic cruise missile won't have the appropriate radar to detect an incoming interceptor. It might have an ECM/ECCM package that can tell when it's being targeted by a radar system, but that's about it.

SSSHHHHHHHH we need more atom bombs! Raytheon has what we need!

Re: U.S. Air Force says it conducted successful hypersonic weapon test

#89

Post by staunch »

kcb wrote: post #48
staunch wrote: post #12

My understanding is that Russia and China are building hypersonic glide missile so they can penetrate any US missile defense system, which the US doesn't really even have. And neither does Russia or China have an effective missile defense system that the US needs the capability to defeat. So it seems like an arms race without either side really having advanced to the point of necessitating a further step. Then again,…

> US missile defense system, which the US doesn't really even have Uh..Missile defense is a massive part of US Navy doctrine and is pretty much the primary purpose of every Destroyer, Cruiser, and soon Frigate in the Navy at this point. Without a doubt, the Aegis system and THAAD are the direct reason for these developments from China and Russia.

Sure, but that doctrine is old. And has it not been partially obsoleted by China's advances in missile technology?

My understanding was that our fleets have sufficient defense for a limited attack but that a full scale missile attack by China would quickly overwhelm them.

Re: U.S. Air Force says it conducted successful hypersonic weapon test

#90

Post by oneoff786 »

djmips wrote: post #11
oneoff786 wrote: post #4

I believe most explosives detonate in the air anymore. Is there a speed threshold where the kinetic energy is enough to justify not doing that?

I think there might be a grammar problem in your statement. What did you mean?

https://ygdp.yale.edu/phenomena/positive-anymore

I picked it up from Pennsylvania unintentionally. Not a huge fan of it tbh.

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