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$3B in Bitcoin was sold in a last-ditch attempt to save UST from collapse

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Re: $3B in Bitcoin was sold in a last-ditch attempt to save UST from collapse

#131

Post by emerongi »

eric_cc wrote: post #75
shkkmo wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Too many people falsely equate "Bitcoin === Crypto".. or "a fan of bitcoin is a fan of all crypto". > So I'd bounce this back to you: How is Luna's Ponzi crash NOT good for bitcoin? Doesn't the first line answer the second?

> Doesn't the first line answer the second? To be clear, you're suggesting: "because people are uneducated about bitcoin and crypto, when one project fails they will incorrectly connect it to bitcoin. And that's bad for Bitcoin." These events are great opportunities to educate ignorant people. > 0 such ignorant people will learn more about bitcoin and why it's not like crypto like Luna. Greater education is extremely…

Most people investing in crypto just want to put in $1 and take out $2. Trying to educate people about cryptocoins is practically a waste of time at this point - they just don't care. Events like these are bad for Bitcoin on a pure value basis, for anyone invested in Bitcoin.

That's just my opinion, though.

Re: $3B in Bitcoin was sold in a last-ditch attempt to save UST from collapse

#132

Post by NovemberWhiskey »

vmception wrote: post #21
joosters wrote: post #4

"Sold" It's hard to show that they really sold these coins. Certainly, the LFG transferred the coins to some different exchanges. But did they truly sell them? If I was running a dodgy ponzi scheme and saw it collapsing catastrophically, I don't think I'd be throwing good money after bad trying to futilely patch it up. Much better to stash the remaining assets away somewhere and personally cash out later on. Also, “I…

> Also, “In a sense, the market is going to take that as kind of bullish.” - a.k.a. the standard 'this is good for bitcoin' quote, applicable whatever the news is! Yes all weekend I had been wondering and cautious based on how much bitcoin was left to sell! Its just a commodity, supply can be faster than demand, specifically when one whale is expected to flood the market Terra Luna rallied 500x (50,000%) off the lows…

>Terra Luna rallied 500x (50,000%) off the lows.

The patient is alive! There may no longer be a head attached to the body; but - look! - the little finger is twitching.

Re: $3B in Bitcoin was sold in a last-ditch attempt to save UST from collapse

#133

Post by eric_cc »

NovemberWhiskey wrote: post #127
eric_cc wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. There is still 1 BTC in this scenerio. When you choose to deposit your 1 BTC you've lost custody of it and somebody else has gained possession of it. All you have is a promise that you'll get it back - which is not === BTC.

You'll have to explain how that's usefully different from the fiat context.

First you'll have to explain to me why you would give somebody your bitcoin and allow them to give it to somebody else!

Re: $3B in Bitcoin was sold in a last-ditch attempt to save UST from collapse

#134

Post by chaostheory »

matheusmoreira wrote: post #109
eric_cc wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

LUNA minted trillions of brand new tokens within the span of a day or so rendering the token worthless. This is due to the way LUNA was tied to the algorithmic stablecoin UST. It was a true ponzi. BTC's max supply is capped and the release schedule of new coins is fixed and predictable. There is no possible way that trillions of new bitcoins could suddenly be created.

> There is no possible way that trillions of new bitcoins could suddenly be created. There absolutely is: fractional reserve banking. Exchanges are already operating that way. They offer loans, savings accounts and everything.

Not a fan of Bitcoin, but you’re confusing Robinhood synthetic IOUs with Bitcoin. They are not the same thing.

Re: $3B in Bitcoin was sold in a last-ditch attempt to save UST from collapse

#135

Post by dfdaffg423rag »

jpmattia wrote: post #115
dfdaffg423rag wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think anyone's going around using shares of Citibank stock as currency, are they? Because that's one of the many criteria that need to be true for that comparison to make any sense. Blows my mind because stablecoins could be so easy-- hold some cash and hold some US treasuries. Pocket the interest. Become rich.

> hold some cash and hold some US treasuries. Pocket the interest. Become rich. Not getting what you're saying here: Only banks should have that privilege?

I'm saying, if you're making a US dollar backed stablecoin, you could do it with minimal risk and still profit handsomely by just holding US treasuries.

Instead, we have stablecoins backed by all sorts of things like commercial paper in cryptocurrency exchanges.

Re: $3B in Bitcoin was sold in a last-ditch attempt to save UST from collapse

#136

Post by matheusmoreira »

eric_cc wrote: post #124
matheusmoreira wrote: post #120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure they can. You deposit 1 BTC, they loan it out to someone else. Boom, 2 BTC.

No. There is still 1 BTC in this scenerio. When you choose to deposit your 1 BTC you've lost custody of it and somebody else has gained possession of it. All you have is a promise that you'll get it back - which is not === BTC.

You said what happened to Luna can't happen to BTC because the BTC supply is capped. It's not. The inability to mine new BTC doesn't actually matter. The pseudobanks we call exchanges are still able to introduce numberless BTC into circulation through loans. The result is inflation and possibly market crashes in case of defaults. Really no different from what Tether and every other bank is doing.

I've written more detailed posts about this:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31375366

Re: $3B in Bitcoin was sold in a last-ditch attempt to save UST from collapse

#137

Post by slv77 »

foobiekr wrote: post #123
lamontcg wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> “In a sense, the market is going to take that as kind of bullish.” I mean everything is a bit oversold right now on negative emotions, both in the crypto space and in the stock markets. There's probably going to be a positive bounce just because markets don't move in straight lines. There is always the chance that something else explodes due to stress tomorrow and hits the headlines and crypto and/or stocks start m…

By what metric are things oversold? Valuations are still crazy by most perspectives, price/earnings, debt/revenue, etc. etc. etc. Expect more losses.

Even if nobody is bullish on the fundamentals there will still be short sellers looking to cover short positions which can drive markets up.

One of the benefits of allowing shorting of stocks is that it provides liquidity even in the worst of times.

Re: $3B in Bitcoin was sold in a last-ditch attempt to save UST from collapse

#138

Post by NovemberWhiskey »

eric_cc wrote: post #133
NovemberWhiskey wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You'll have to explain how that's usefully different from the fiat context.

First you'll have to explain to me why you would give somebody your bitcoin and allow them to give it to somebody else!

... because they promise to give you back one BTC plus something else of value?

Re: $3B in Bitcoin was sold in a last-ditch attempt to save UST from collapse

#140

Post by gamblor956 »

tempnow987 wrote: post #114
dlubarov wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The 20% interest was just a short-term user acquisition scheme, funded by some of the initial LUNA tokens. I don't think anyone claimed that it was sustainable. A Ponzi would be if Anchor used users' deposits to pay out the 20% rewards, which isn't what happened here.

A ponzi is if there is not actual asset backing the ponzi "values". Ie, the "stablecoin" will not actually hold value. Wasn't Cashberry or something like this? Russian based? Ultimately no assets behind it, so when the music stopped they couldn't redeem the values.

No, a ponzi scheme is very specifically defined as an "investment fraud that pays existing investors with funds collected from new investors." (https://www.investor.gov/introduction-investing/investing-ba...)

A common part of the scheme is to promise high returns with little to no risk.

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