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Sweden to Apply for NATO Membership
31–40 of 310 posts
Re: Sweden to Apply for NATO Membership
#32Earlier quoted context omitted.
Which country or countries is India a vassal of?
India is still part of the british empire/commonwealth. They gained independence and left the british empire. A few years later, they rejoined it. They actually claim the british queen as their head of state - even if it is ceremonial only.
The Republic of India definitely does not have the queen as head of state, ceremonial or otherwise.
Re: Sweden to Apply for NATO Membership
#33Earlier quoted context omitted.
If they had to choose, NATO would probably rather have Sweden and Finland in and Turkey out. Here's an interesting thread on Finland's strategic importance: https://twitter.com/tomiahonen/status/1525959053490458624
Possibly but the fact that Turkey has been a NATO member since the 1960s pretty much makes that "wish" irrelevant or at least not ignorable. Seniority does count for something and ignoring it is great way of destroying a organization/treaty.
since 1952
Re: Sweden to Apply for NATO Membership
#34But turks said no.
If they had to choose, NATO would probably rather have Sweden and Finland in and Turkey out. Here's an interesting thread on Finland's strategic importance: https://twitter.com/tomiahonen/status/1525959053490458624
NATO is not just about Russia. To me, suggesting that Sweden is somehow more strategically important than Turkey is foreign policy illiterate.
Turkey brings a military ~30x the size of Sweden, they are actively involved in being a buffer for conflicts in the Middle East, and they have an advanced military manufacturing capability that they have used to supply Ukraine and others with military drones.
They also have substantial more recent conflict experience and partnerships with affiliates throughout MENA.
Even if NATO was about Russia, Turkey is a much more important buffer to Russian ambitions than Sweden is.
I'm not a particular fan of Turkey, but the only reason we would rather have Sweden over Turkey is due to "soft" cultural, christian, western centrism (calling things racism is taboo on HN so I will refrain).
Re: Sweden to Apply for NATO Membership
#35But turks said no.
If they had to choose, NATO would probably rather have Sweden and Finland in and Turkey out. Here's an interesting thread on Finland's strategic importance: https://twitter.com/tomiahonen/status/1525959053490458624
Not at all. If Murmansk's importance causes Finland to be strategic then what about Crimea? Turkey blocks Russia's warm water sea access. Much more important for Turkey to be in NATO than Finland purely on the basis of geography.
Re: Sweden to Apply for NATO Membership
#36Earlier quoted context omitted.
That's not how must treaties work and certainly not how the NATO treaty is written. Maybe you should read it first.
> not how must treaties work and certainly not how the NATO treaty is written Most treaties have termination clauses. The North Atlantic Treaty’s Article 13 provides for voluntary exit [1]. (One could argue Ankara’s SS-4 purchase constitutes an Article 8 violation, though this would be petry.) Treaties are about mutual understanding. If Americans and Czechs would find it unseemly to fight for Turkey’s defence in case…
It doesn't sound like you know what you are talking about and I have no idea what an "SS-4" is.
Re: Sweden to Apply for NATO Membership
#37But turks said no.
Turks are trying to establish some diplomatic bridge with Russia; that's very good. Russian aggression in Ukraine is terrible, but I feel the US are not trying to de-escalate anything. They are in full proxy-war mode.
This can be very dangerous for Europe. France and Germany also would like to have more diplomacy, just like Turkey. Those countries have to live next to Russia - and maintaining a diplomatic relationship with Russia is vital. And this despite the fact that current Russian leadership is basically criminal.
I don't think Sweden and Finland joining NATO is sending a good signal - or it's diplomatically wise. But let's see...
Re: Sweden to Apply for NATO Membership
#38Earlier quoted context omitted.
> not how must treaties work and certainly not how the NATO treaty is written Most treaties have termination clauses. The North Atlantic Treaty’s Article 13 provides for voluntary exit [1]. (One could argue Ankara’s SS-4 purchase constitutes an Article 8 violation, though this would be petry.) Treaties are about mutual understanding. If Americans and Czechs would find it unseemly to fight for Turkey’s defence in case…
It doesn't sound like you know what you are talking about and I have no idea what an "SS-4" is.
> doesn't sound like you know what you are talking about
Okay?
> no idea what an "SS-4" is
Sorry, pre coffee. S-400.
Re: Sweden to Apply for NATO Membership
#39Earlier quoted context omitted.
No. They are the most indepedentest of the independent. They only serve one lunatic dictator and his family. And developed nuclear weapons against the wishes of US, china and russia. Can't get more independent than that. It's a country that literally starved itself to stay independent.
NK exists at the behest of China. China wants a buffer between it and South Korea. If that wish were to change, I'd expect NK to be either gobbled up by China or allowed to rejoin with SK.
> NK exists at the behest of China.
No. China and NK was created with the backing of the soviet union. They were vassals of the soviet union until they decided not to be. Both china and north korea have been independent actors for a while now. Even before the soviet union collapsed.
> China wants a buffer between it and South Korea.
Why would china want a buffer between it and south korea? You mean between china and the US?
> If that wish were to change, I'd expect NK to be either gobbled up by China or allowed to rejoin with SK.
SK is a vassal of the US. You don't "rejoin" a vassal state. It'll be more likely north korea will one day liberate south korea than anything. South korea has a foreign occupation force. North korea doesn't. Think about it.
Re: Sweden to Apply for NATO Membership
#40Earlier quoted context omitted.
Which country or countries is India a vassal of?
India is still part of the british empire/commonwealth. They gained independence and left the british empire. A few years later, they rejoined it. They actually claim the british queen as their head of state - even if it is ceremonial only.
This is false. There is a distinction between the Commonwealth in the broader cultural sense (Commonwealth Games, etc.) and the Commonwealth realm.
The former regions in the British Empire which are now republics, such as India and those in Africa, are not in the Commonwealth realm.