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You're Not Losing Fat Because You're Eating Too Damn Much (2016)

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Re: You're Not Losing Fat Because You're Eating Too Damn Much (2016)

#301

Post by commandlinefan »

xurukefi wrote: post #278
jimmydoreornot wrote: post #232

While correct and useful advice for some people, this advice is useless for many (I suspect most) overweight and obese people. I'm on the border of overweight/obese. I can lose weight if I focus on losing weight. I've dropped from 100kg to 74kg and back. I've gone back down to 91kg and back. How? Eating less, of course. By counting calories. But here is the problem. Anything below 95kg and my body and mind is hyper a…

It's genetics. I think it's called the set point theory. You're genetically programmed to keep a certain body fat percentage. Anything below (or above) that set point and you're body will regulate your appetite with hormones. You can manipulate this set point with things like diet or exercise, but there is only so much you can do. If you're genetically programmed to keep a body fat percentage of 25% for example you'r…

You’re being downvoted, but as a genetically lean guy, I believe you’re right. I’ve never been particularly health conscious, but I’ve always been in “decent” shape - I eat the same things fat people eat, it just doesn’t stick to me for whatever cosmically unfair reason. Fat parents have fat kids - a fat five-year-old isn’t fat because he ate too much ice cream, it’s because he’s genetically predisposed to be.

Re: You're Not Losing Fat Because You're Eating Too Damn Much (2016)

#302

Post by jimmydoreornot »

xurukefi wrote: post #278
jimmydoreornot wrote: post #232

While correct and useful advice for some people, this advice is useless for many (I suspect most) overweight and obese people. I'm on the border of overweight/obese. I can lose weight if I focus on losing weight. I've dropped from 100kg to 74kg and back. I've gone back down to 91kg and back. How? Eating less, of course. By counting calories. But here is the problem. Anything below 95kg and my body and mind is hyper a…

It's genetics. I think it's called the set point theory. You're genetically programmed to keep a certain body fat percentage. Anything below (or above) that set point and you're body will regulate your appetite with hormones. You can manipulate this set point with things like diet or exercise, but there is only so much you can do. If you're genetically programmed to keep a body fat percentage of 25% for example you'r…

I suspect something like that is going on. It is pretty clear to me that there is a strong genetic component. We know the hunger system is very complicated. It's the reason we still don't have a weight loss pill. If you decrease hunger along one channel, the other channels ramp up to compensate.

But there also may be other components that we can do something about. For example, perhaps the bacteria in my gut are causing half of my hunger, insisting that I eat bread (because they want it, not I). And if I starve them out on a zero carb diet, I can break free of the excess hunger.

Hope springs eternal.

Re: You're Not Losing Fat Because You're Eating Too Damn Much (2016)

#303

Post by codefreeordie »

stef25 wrote: post #236
codefreeordie wrote: post #177

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exercise is tricky. If you do no exercise at all, you get really sluggish and tired all the time as your metabolism slows down, which then requires further caloric restriction. This works (especially, it seems, in a time/place that feels like winter, as the cold and darkness coupled with the lethargy seems like it maybe downregulates hunger), but it's really hard because now you have to barely eat at all. If you exer…

I started intermittent fasting, basically eating nothing between dinner at 8PM and lunch the next day at 1PM. The most striking thing is that I eat much less for lunch than I usually do, I'm full very quickly. And the effect continues throughout the day (smaller dinners, less / no snacking) Had to give up coffee in the mornings because of the milk I put in it and the fact I can't just have coffee on an empty stomach.…

During lockdown, I ended up adopting roughly that eating schedule unintentionally -- just because my routine didn't have a "breakfast" gap.

It did not work for me at all, I gained SO MUCH weight, because by lunchtime I was ravenous and couldn't stop myself from eating way, way, way more than I would have if I split between breakfast and lunch. I mean, it was also a stressful time, so it's hard to compare, but I put on 20 pounds in a few months, after having been stable weight for 5-6 years.

I started forcing myself to get up earlier and have a breakfast of around 350ish calories (basically a bowl of cereal or oatmeal or something with milk), and that allowed me to immediately stop the weight gain, because I removed probably 750+ calories of "excess" lunch in exchange. Still struggling to lose what I gained, but I've been stable for 18+ months since I made space for breakfast.

It's really interesting how individual some of this stuff ends up seeming. For example, I have learned that I can not be a stable weight (at any weight, it seems) if I drink sugared drinks with food. It seems that if I have a sugary drink with my food, I actually feel the urge to eat more food in addition to the calories in the drink, leading to a massive downward (well, upward in weight) spiral. I almost completely cut out sugary drinks from my life when I figured this out. (I now have maybe two or three sweet drinks per month on average. I haven't lost any weight this way, but I have regained stability).

I am a firm believer that the real solutions to the obesity epidemic are all going to be around helping people control their hunger sensation (be that with dietary changes, coaching and counselling, routine changes, chemistry or other medical intervention). Learning how much you should eat to be the weight you want to be isn't that hard. Spending about a third of your concentration power at all times to avoid the overpowering urge to raid the pantry, on the other hand, is really hard.

I'm glad you found something that works for you. I'm still working on finding it for myself, though I did manage to stop the bleeding at least.

Re: You're Not Losing Fat Because You're Eating Too Damn Much (2016)

#304

Post by stevebmark »

jimmydoreornot wrote: post #232

While correct and useful advice for some people, this advice is useless for many (I suspect most) overweight and obese people. I'm on the border of overweight/obese. I can lose weight if I focus on losing weight. I've dropped from 100kg to 74kg and back. I've gone back down to 91kg and back. How? Eating less, of course. By counting calories. But here is the problem. Anything below 95kg and my body and mind is hyper a…

Counting calories may not be correct and useful advice for most people. It ignores what the calories do in your body. As an absurd example, sand is very calorically dense, and you'll lose a lot of weight and then die if it's all you eat. Telling people they "eat too much" is usually ineffective, it just makes people feel bad that they can't tolerate hunger.

Ketosis will work (it's very low carb, not zero carb). You (as in you personally) won't be able to do it, you likely lack the willpower, and if you're social, it's difficult to do in a social setting, especially without taking a deep dive into the science to help understand the how and the why.

Re: You're Not Losing Fat Because You're Eating Too Damn Much (2016)

#305

Post by pbhjpbhj »

teolandon wrote: post #261
pirate787 wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure about that. Being overweight is selfish and wasteful in a world where many people don't have enough food to eat.

Eating less candy isn't going to feed anyone in impoverished countries.

If any whole country gave up candy then they'd save a lot in direct cost and even more in related costs (diabetes, etc.) that they could certainly help feed many many people. Sure, the effect of one person not eating candy is easily lost, but I spend a few pounds a month myself on sweets (ie candy, I'm from the UK). I know that money could likely feed someone in a developing nation for a month.

It's so easy to tell ourselves that each small contribution adds to zero, but as someone noted elsewhere in this thread, calculus should tell us enough to be wary of dismissing little bits!

Re: You're Not Losing Fat Because You're Eating Too Damn Much (2016)

#306

Post by Smaug123 »

thepasswordis wrote: post #279
Smaug123 wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I got bad news for you: I know multiple people who lost weight for two months (as anyone can on literally any calorie-restriction diet) but simply couldn't follow it for much longer than that. I myself stopped being keto a couple of days after the evening crying started.

What is the bad news? It sounds like they stopped eating healthy, and got fat as a result of it. Eating a healthy diet for two months doesn't mean you can go back to eating trash and expecting to stay healthy.

Your advice is not actionable. I know several people including myself who were simply unable to action it for longer than the two months that anyone can stick to any diet.

If you are capable of sticking to a diet that literally brings you to tears on a daily basis, then sure, but do realise that you're probably in about the top percentile of willpower. (I imagine you were not in fact brought to tears by this diet, or you wouldn't be recommending it; in which case you may not be aware that it's not a panacea.)

Re: You're Not Losing Fat Because You're Eating Too Damn Much (2016)

#307

Post by [deleted] »

aleksiy123 wrote: post #208
SnowHill9902 wrote: post #25

If you squat, deadlift and walk enough, and are generally healthy, you physically won’t be able to eat yourself fat.

Off season bodybuilders are an obvious counter example. Exhibit A. https://d3h9ln6psucegz.cloudfront.net/wp-content/uploads/201...

[deleted]

Re: You're Not Losing Fat Because You're Eating Too Damn Much (2016)

#308

Post by throwuxiytayq »

thepasswordis wrote: post #72

Keto diets are both safe and effective. I have yet to meet somebody following one who didn't lose weight. I feel like this topic is basically resolved. Stop eating carbs.

I like keto because it helps me maintain energy throughout the day, but I need to eat practically non-stop to avoid losing weight while on it. It's crazy.

Re: You're Not Losing Fat Because You're Eating Too Damn Much (2016)

#309

Post by dataflow »

mattlondon wrote: post #274
dataflow wrote: post #152

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There is a very good chance that someone is writing a reply with some suggestion as to how I should eat so that I'm not hungry. Actually I was wanted to ask the opposite: what prevents you from letting yourself go hungry a fraction of the day? You might get a stomachache for a bit, I know, but have you tried and seen any consequences beyond that? Note I'm not suggesting "eat absolutely nothing the whole day", but l…

You could ask the same of someone addicted to smoking or cocaine or whatever. Every fibre of your body is telling you to go eat/smoke/get high etc. It is an all consuming urge that relentlessly interrupts whatever else you are trying to do or think about. You literally cannot stop thinking about your next think you are going to eat. For me, it is not even physical stomach ache as you suggest, it is the mental aspect…

> You could ask the same of someone addicted to smoking or cocaine or whatever.

That comparison with addiction to illicit drugs always perplexes me, because those drugs are clinically known to cause physical addiction to that substance, but that's not the case for (most?) food.

I do get the thing about it completely consuming your brain though (and being doubly painful if your stomach's in pain) even if it's a different phenomenon than drug addiction, so I'm not discounting that at all.

It sounds like this is something you've tried in the past. Have you given your body enough time to adjust when you've tried this? From what I know, when people start to fast (note I'm not suggesting you fast—just cut your portions > 50%), it's way more painful in the beginning (both physically and mentally) than it is, say, 2-3 weeks later. If you haven't tried this, do you think you could give yourself a chance and just tolerate it for (say) 3 weeks? I wonder if having a definite end date to look forward to might make it easier for yourself to convince your brain to tolerate some hunger?

Re: You're Not Losing Fat Because You're Eating Too Damn Much (2016)

#310

Post by Alacart »

csours wrote: post #73

I weigh 350 pounds. I'm very obese. I know this. When I was a teenager, I looked at people who weighed 300+ pounds and though, how do you get that way. Don't you realize that you are gaining weight? Don't you know that you just have to eat less to lose weight? Anyway, now I realize that I am hungry. It never goes away unless I eat a significant amount of food. My body told me to eat, so I ate. It doesn't even take th…

This kind of hunger is what I've felt my whole life too, though my weight is still only in the overweight category. I can eat twice, three times what a normal portion is and still feel like I need to eat. I could easily eat multiple large pizzas by myself with no problem at all. There's a scene from The West Wing where the chief of staff describes his alcoholism and how people would ask him how could he drink so much and still want more. His answer is that he doesn't understand how anybody else could not want more. That it's the best thing in the world. And that's exactly how food feels to me.

A year ago I was diagnosed with ADHD (inattentive) and prescribed a very low dose of Vyvanse (amphetamine based). Suddenly it was gone. I'd want to eat at normal times, I'd eat a normal portion but I could easily walk away or I actually just didn't want more. I asked my wife, is this what other people feel like? It really rocked my world a bit. It's one thing to logically know that people experience reality differently, but I've rarely had such a stark example of it.

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