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Long-term benzodiazepine use causes synapse loss and cognitive deficits in mice

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Re: Long-term benzodiazepine use causes synapse loss and cognitive deficits in mice

#71

Post by cameronh90 »

natly wrote: post #30
glerk wrote: post #19

Benzos are pretty terrible drugs in general. The physical addiction potential and withdrawal people are going through are enough to dissuade me from touching them. For folks dealing with anxiety, I recommend trying propranolol. It is not as powerful, but sometimes it is enough to achieve the desired effect and the side effects are way less severe.

I recommend working out, it helped me a ton with anxiety. It basically cured it (I don't work out much anymore but a short intense few months of hard workouts seems to have almost removed it from my system years afterwards).

Interestingly working out is a trigger for my anxiety. I'm currently trying graded exposure therapy for exercise, but so far it's not working.

Re: Long-term benzodiazepine use causes synapse loss and cognitive deficits in mice

#72

Post by mtlmtlmtlmtl »

aaaaaaaaaaab wrote: post #50
anonymoushn wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

antipsychotics are horrifying. do therapeutic doses of stimulants cause problems other than heart disease over the long term?

No, long-term stimulant use is totally A-ok! /s

Actually, at therapeutic doses, it is.

Re: Long-term benzodiazepine use causes synapse loss and cognitive deficits in mice

#73

Post by cycomanic »

natly wrote: post #30
glerk wrote: post #19

Benzos are pretty terrible drugs in general. The physical addiction potential and withdrawal people are going through are enough to dissuade me from touching them. For folks dealing with anxiety, I recommend trying propranolol. It is not as powerful, but sometimes it is enough to achieve the desired effect and the side effects are way less severe.

I recommend working out, it helped me a ton with anxiety. It basically cured it (I don't work out much anymore but a short intense few months of hard workouts seems to have almost removed it from my system years afterwards).

Yes, it's unfortunate that exercise is not prescribed more for these issues as there are tons of studies showing the benefits of working out against depression, anxiety etc.. I think we should really be seeing a mechanism where doctors can prescribe time off for exercise to deal with mental or physical issues, without repercussions for the employee. Maybe it's too much of a hope to see that in the US, but at least in Europe.

Re: Long-term benzodiazepine use causes synapse loss and cognitive deficits in mice

#74

Post by SemanticStrengh »

whimsicalism wrote: post #68
SemanticStrengh wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

is that a question? Benzos are not safe despite what many doctor believe. I'm in EU.

they're saying they wouldn't be so easily prescribed in the US

is that a joke? I'd be very surprised if doctors were'nt abusing benzo prescriptions for GAD

Re: Long-term benzodiazepine use causes synapse loss and cognitive deficits in mice

#75

Post by retrac »

SemanticStrengh wrote: post #45

The world of medecine is degenerate. Sustainable, non addictive and non neurotoxic anxiolytics exists: the #1 being opipramol the sigmaergic. emoxypine (which btw cure hangover) and guanfacine are worth mentioning. Maybe beta blockers to some extent. NMDA antagonists such as memantine have side effects but are not neurotoxic to my knowledge and there are milder ones such as mg-lthreonate. afobazole is interesting but…

Anecdotally, I can attest to the surprising efficacy of alpha blockers. I have used prazosin as a sleep aid for the last decade, a few times a month.

There were some limited studies that suggest it is effective in helping sleep quality in people with nightmares and PTSD. Now, I don't have PTSD, but I do have a mind that will not shut off at night, running in useless circles that jolt me back awake. It does nothing for the racing mind, but my body's physiological reaction to my emotional state is lessened. I physically relax, quite literally in smooth muscle activation terms, and apparently that lets me get to sleep.

Beta blockers are probably a bit more heavy duty, but they do appear to be quite effective at treating performance-related anxieties from another small study. Shakes? Chills? Dizziness and blood pressure spikes? From the discussion I had with my psychiatrist, I think the working hypothesis is that treating the physical symptoms of anxiety is an effective intervention here, as the discomforting experiences that the initial anxiety triggers, creates a feedback cycle. (Oh god, now I'm sweating and flushed, everyone's gonna notice...!)

Re: Long-term benzodiazepine use causes synapse loss and cognitive deficits in mice

#76

Post by shepardrtc »

RGamma wrote: post #44
shepardrtc wrote: post #29

I was prescribed benzos because of sleeping issues, but I was also taking phenibut at the same time. After about 3 weeks of using large doses of the benzos every night, I stopped taking them, but a year later I still feel pangs of withdrawal sometimes when I get stressed. It took me another 4 months to get off the phenibut and a month or so after that before my sleep returned to normal. There were months where I mayb…

Doctors prescribe benzos for sleep issues and tell you they are safe? Do you live in the US?

Yes. Some doctors do; some don't. My new doctor was horrified when I told her what I was prescribed. She's young, and she said the first thing they say in medical school nowadays is, "Benzos are bad." My first doctor was much older and clearly from a different era of medical school.

Re: Long-term benzodiazepine use causes synapse loss and cognitive deficits in mice

#77

Post by tptacek »

rhexs wrote: post #51
anonymoushn wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I sort of expect that the psychiatrist spends more time with the patient each month than the pharmacist.

It's sort of a sad indictment of our system, but odds are the pharmacist sees the patient far more than the psychiatrist does.

I have literally never had a discussion with a pharmacist. I drive up, hand them my script through the drawer thingy, and they hand me back my drugs. In fact, in the last couple years, I barely even do that anymore; our doctors just call in our scripts, and we get a text message when it's time to pick them up, and that's that.

The idea that pharmacists have any meaningful diagnostic role in the US is risible.

Re: Long-term benzodiazepine use causes synapse loss and cognitive deficits in mice

#78

Post by 77pt77 »

shepardrtc wrote: post #29

I was prescribed benzos because of sleeping issues, but I was also taking phenibut at the same time. After about 3 weeks of using large doses of the benzos every night, I stopped taking them, but a year later I still feel pangs of withdrawal sometimes when I get stressed. It took me another 4 months to get off the phenibut and a month or so after that before my sleep returned to normal. There were months where I mayb…

Of the common legal drugs, benzos are by far the most dangerous to quit.

And you get addicted in like a week.

Be very careful.

Re: Long-term benzodiazepine use causes synapse loss and cognitive deficits in mice

#79

Post by matheusmoreira »

ldjkfkdsjnv wrote: post #6

The reality is many drugs have long term effects, we just can't see them yet. But if you are close to someone who is a user, over the long run you will notice differences. Sometimes its just that they don't have the same spark. Regardless, 100 years down the line we will look back in horror at the state of pharmaceutical drugs. All it takes is going to a doctor, saying you have anxiety, and the doctor pops out a scri…

Benzodiazepines are not even first line treatments for anxiety though. More like a last resort. They are very useful in aborting panic attacks and that says a lot about the intensity of symptoms necessary to justify their use.

SSRIs and SNRIs have a much better risk/benefit profile. Sertraline in particular is a really effective drug. I don't really understand why other doctors prescribe benzodiazepines so frequently but I'm not doing it.

Re: Long-term benzodiazepine use causes synapse loss and cognitive deficits in mice

#80

Post by dang »

codeulike wrote: post #70

In mice https://twitter.com/justsaysinmice?s=09

Ok, we've inmiced the title above.

I had to add the c-word, though ("causes"). The article uses it several times, so I suppose it's ok for the title. Please let's not repeat the usual "C is not C" business.

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