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Flutter 3

docs.flutter.dev

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Re: Flutter 3

#311

Post by busymom0 »

ttcbj wrote: post #104
the_duke wrote: post #42

Despite many maturity issues in practice Flutter is the only realistic option for true cross platform UIs that run everywhere. Apart from Qt , but the licensing issue is a hindrance. And yes, the web backend isn't ideal, but it will improve over time. I just wish Google had built Flutter on a low level core that isn't tied to Dart, so it would be usable from other languages. Dart isn't horrible and is getting better,…

I have been developing in Flutter for a few years now, and I really enjoy the ecosystem. It is the only mobile development environment I have every really enjoyed using. When I started, flutter worked on mobile, and web support was in beta. Now, my app works on iOS/Android/MacOs/Web. If you are a small developer with limited resources for cross-platform development, its an amazing environment. As for Dart, it is actu…

Is the Web version of Flutter still using canvas? I tried it a while back and it was just a canvas rendering everything. That makes SEO impossible. It's also useless for accessibility/screen readers. Please correct me if I am wrong.

Re: Flutter 3

#312

Post by nmfisher »

NonNefarious wrote: post #214
the_duke wrote: post #42

Despite many maturity issues in practice Flutter is the only realistic option for true cross platform UIs that run everywhere. Apart from Qt , but the licensing issue is a hindrance. And yes, the web backend isn't ideal, but it will improve over time. I just wish Google had built Flutter on a low level core that isn't tied to Dart, so it would be usable from other languages. Dart isn't horrible and is getting better,…

"I just wish Google had built Flutter on a low level core that isn't tied to Dart, so it would be usable from other languages." Exactly. Dart is a deal-breaker. I was tasked with choosing a cross-platform development solution, and rejected Flutter because nobody at my company (including me) knows Dart or has time to learn it. Nor would any contractors we were likely to find know it. After quite a bit of research on o…

I think that's pretty short-sighted. Dart is hardly an esoteric/niche language like Haskell or Futhark, anyone familiar with Java/Javascript/TypeScript should be able to pick it up in a day or so.

Flutter's performance issues, on the other hand, is a separate story.

Re: Flutter 3

#313

Post by busymom0 »

mekkkkkk wrote: post #143
samwillis wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Flutter is the only realistic option for true cross platform UIs that run everywhere. I understand that argument but 100% disagree. The web is the cross platform that runs everywhere (as in in a browser or webview). True it has many issues and some forms of it (electron) are not ideal for some use case but I believe it’s a better platform than flutter in almost every way. You say “true” cross platform and could arg…

I have yet to see a world in which local file access, background services, local notifications, timers, alarms, native media controls, etc, works as well on web as in native apps. A lot of it is there "in theory", but web tech has the achilles heel of only allowing stuff that would be safe to have in a random website that some asshat links you on twitter. Of course this is only relevant if that deeper plumbing into t…

Notifications is the main one which is still missing (at least on iOS, not sure about android). If notifications are possible for websites, then it would make web dev so much better for vast majority of apps.

Local storage already does a lot of needed data storage (though apple has recently made this complicated with their auto delete after certain period). Local file access for uploads is also now possible on iOS using the Files app.

Re: Flutter 3

#314

Post by busymom0 »

nmfisher wrote: post #312
NonNefarious wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"I just wish Google had built Flutter on a low level core that isn't tied to Dart, so it would be usable from other languages." Exactly. Dart is a deal-breaker. I was tasked with choosing a cross-platform development solution, and rejected Flutter because nobody at my company (including me) knows Dart or has time to learn it. Nor would any contractors we were likely to find know it. After quite a bit of research on o…

I think that's pretty short-sighted. Dart is hardly an esoteric/niche language like Haskell or Futhark, anyone familiar with Java/Javascript/TypeScript should be able to pick it up in a day or so. Flutter's performance issues, on the other hand, is a separate story.

> Flutter's performance issues, on the other hand, is a separate story.

Can you expand on that? I know react native has performance issues but does Flutter have it too? Why?

Re: Flutter 3

#315

Post by nickstinemates »

bowsamic wrote: post #48
nickstinemates wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

who builds desktop applications anymore? it feels weird to say but i am starting to like them again after transitioning to basically 100% thin client/cloud services for the past 15 years.

I’m confused, do you not use desktop apps?

I did in the early days when the web sucked, then dhtml and web2.0 started and I completely swapped. Now I'm starting to again. I like them more the web apps. But no one is making them anymore

Re: Flutter 3

#316

Post by sgammon »

as an early and aggressive adopter of Google tech it was completely infuriating to watch them announce Flutter + Firebase integration as if it was new or interesting.

that should have been working day 1. maybe day 2. flutter has been out for years, and the fact that you can’t successfully use Google software with Google’s other software is starting to be a wart they can’t excuse because of internal build chain differences.

Re: Flutter 3

#317

Post by mekkkkkk »

SemanticStrengh wrote: post #164
mekkkkkk wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have yet to see a world in which local file access, background services, local notifications, timers, alarms, native media controls, etc, works as well on web as in native apps. A lot of it is there "in theory", but web tech has the achilles heel of only allowing stuff that would be safe to have in a random website that some asshat links you on twitter. Of course this is only relevant if that deeper plumbing into t…

You have yet to see a world where people update their beliefs more than once per decades. Hybrid native web apps are trivial, see e.g. Ionic capacitor plugins

I'm well aware of hybrid apps and Ionic. I wouldn't call those solutions properly "web" though. They're basically only using web tech as a presentation layer, and deferring to native plugins to do the heavy lifting when required. Very similar to how Flutter does it.

So if your claim is simply that CSS/HTML/JS is capable of creating good user interfaces, I'm not arguing against it.

Re: Flutter 3

#318

Post by kaba0 »

miohtama wrote: post #240
mekkkkkk wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have yet to see a world in which local file access, background services, local notifications, timers, alarms, native media controls, etc, works as well on web as in native apps. A lot of it is there "in theory", but web tech has the achilles heel of only allowing stuff that would be safe to have in a random website that some asshat links you on twitter. Of course this is only relevant if that deeper plumbing into t…

“Everything” working in a web app is unlikely to happen any time soon. The security model is so different, though less different between mobile and web than mobile and desktop. Also the Apple/Safari ecosystem is the new IE and dragging down some of the innovation. However, I believe it might not matter. 95% apps can be done as web apps today, especially what comes to boring business applications. 5% we can wait for s…

> And Google Docs is already using Canvas based rendering so seems like Flutter canvas based apps might have hope.

Well, isn’t it the Java applets model as you call it as well? But is a colored div that much better of a button?

Though I don’t disagree with you, indeed most apps can be web-based.

Re: Flutter 3

#319

Post by busymom0 »

simulate-me wrote: post #15
ipnon wrote: post #11

I was hoping to see better HTML rendering. Using a single canvas to render web apps was my one turn off. Flutter is the right choice for many apps, but not for apps primarily accessed over the Web.

What’s wrong with using a single canvas? It can be faster. Google Docs and Figma, for example, use canvas rendering

Canvas has accessibility issues for screen readers as well as for SEO purposes.

Re: Flutter 3

#320

Post by ogoffart »

orthecreedence wrote: post #200
Mertax wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the decision of which cross platform technology to use mostly depends on a team's preferred tech stack. C++ -> QT C#/.NET -> MAUI/Blazor JS/Web -> React.Native/Electron Dart -> Flutter This is what I think is holding back Flutter -- that it wasn't built on an incumbent technology. Because Dart doesn't have quite the following, it has to evangelize itself a bit more than the other options.

Rust -> ='[

Rust -> Slint? https://github.com/slint-ui/slint/
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