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Coinbase warns that bankruptcy could wipe out user funds

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Re: Coinbase warns that bankruptcy could wipe out user funds

#181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

> have enough to cover maybe 1-2% of all deposits? When the real stuff hits the fan and the buck breaks, there won't be any FDIC to protect any investment The FDIC "is backed by the full faith and credit of the United States government" [1]. Its reserves (a) provide quick cash in case of limited problems, (b) insulate the Treasury and Congress and (c) hold the FDIC leadership accountable. On account of (c), the FDIC…

> As required by the Federal Deposit Insurance Act, the FDIC Board adopted a Restoration Plan on September 15, 2020, to restore the DIF to at least 1.35 percent by September 30, 2028. The Plan requires the FDIC to update its analysis and projections for the DIF balance and reserve ratio at least semiannually.

https://www.fdic.gov/news/speeches/2021/spjun1521a.html

They can't even keep up with their legally mandated deposit reserve rate of 1.35% but they're going to bail out several failed banks? Come on.

Re: Coinbase warns that bankruptcy could wipe out user funds

#182

Can anyone tell me how to set up a wallet on my Mac in order to get my coins off coinbase. Is there any clear guide on how to do that. Every link on Google seems to be spam or downloading potentially malicious software. It's very fustrating because so many people seem to know how to set up a wallet on their computer/Mac however I cannot for the life of me find a clear wallet to download and move my funds to or a guid…

Disclaimer: I've only done this a couple times and really am not good with this stuff.

After you download the app you mentioned, it's going to sit and grind your CPU for a long time. After that, you can click on the 'Receive' tab. Every field here is optional, but you might want to fill in the label with something like "from Coinbase". Click "Create new receiving address" and a new window will appear with a QR code and some other info. Copy the address. Then in Coinbase, send your Bitcoin to this address.

Again, this is probably a little watered down, but I hope it helps. Hopefully someone more knowledgeable writes up a better explanation.

Re: Coinbase warns that bankruptcy could wipe out user funds

#183

Can anyone tell me how to set up a wallet on my Mac in order to get my coins off coinbase. Is there any clear guide on how to do that. Every link on Google seems to be spam or downloading potentially malicious software. It's very fustrating because so many people seem to know how to set up a wallet on their computer/Mac however I cannot for the life of me find a clear wallet to download and move my funds to or a guid…

If you only hold bitcoin that wallet would work, another popular one is electrum. If you want to store multiple coins in one application then Exodus or Atomic would be two good choices. You're looking for a non-custodial wallet and as always, protect your keys to protect your coins, you are the bank at this point.

It's just bitcoin I'm storing, is that one I've linked to above a non-custodial wallet or a custodial wallet?

Re: Coinbase warns that bankruptcy could wipe out user funds

#185
post #2

Since coinbase isn’t FDIC insured, it makes sense that if coinbase goes bankrupt, the customer currencies will go away as well. And they aren’t SPIC insured in the situations where crypto is a security. It’s funny to see people shocked (SHOCKED!) when crypto doesn’t have the protections of regular banking and investments. That’s why you don’t invest with stuff that isn’t insured. Those aren’t real rates, they are ris…

I do wonder why he's allowed to say on Twitter there is no risk of bankruptcy [0]. While the risk could be minimal and maybe negligible saying "no risk" means zero chance. That can't be true of any company. For a public company ceo to say that, isn't that securities fraud? I guess even if it is fraud and they do get prosecuted by the SEC they'd just get fined for it. And maybe the fine here would be much less than th…

If I was a CEO and saw how few and far between (as well as toothless) the repercussions have been for Elon Musk, I wouldn’t fear tweeting whatever I wanted either.

Re: Coinbase warns that bankruptcy could wipe out user funds

#186
post #175

It’s amusing for someone who works in finance to see the crypto market re-doing the last century of financial scandals and regulations in fast forward. Discovering capital gain taxes, market manipulations, the necessity to separate firm money from client money for brokers…

Seems vaguely similar to how the wild west had to re-do civilization and industrialization in fast forward.

Re: Coinbase warns that bankruptcy could wipe out user funds

#187
post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because if all he had to say was "there is no actual risk", then that's all he would have written, and it fits in less than a single tweet.

Why would anyone just take that as it is?

Because he is the CEO and if he lies about those matters in a public communication he is liable to shareholders. Which is why he doesn't do it.

Re: Coinbase warns that bankruptcy could wipe out user funds

#188
post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only exception I might take to what you're saying is that one of the main reasons for crypto is resistance to central authority, so the emergence of a situation where something like this can happen should be edifying. It's not the first time this has happened; people seem to forget about Mt Gox. These exchanges need to be part of the crypto schema. Crypto theory is so focused on the chain and not the infrastructu…

> The only exception I might take to what you're saying is that one of the main reasons for crypto is resistance to central authority, so the emergence of a situation where something like this can happen should be edifying. Explain. > It's not the first time this has happened; people seem to forget about Mt Gox. False equivalence, MTGOX wasn't a Publically traded company with tons of VC money and lots of institutiona…

> Explain.

I wouldn't read into that comment (of mine) too much. I meant what I said in an abstract sense.

> False equivalence, MTGOX wasn't a Publically traded company with tons of VC money and lots of institutional funds (Ark et al) backing them; Mark embezzled funds and had horrible OPSEC that led to a massive hack. He tried covering this up, Coinbase reporting a massive loss is definitely not the same thing.

Fair enough; good point. They are different. But I do think these intermediary, exchange entities, whatever you want to call them, tend to emerge repeatedly, with their own vulnerabilities, in a way that isn't always fully recognized in a lot of the discussion of cryptocurrency. My sense (which could certainly be wrong) is there's a bit of a gap between blockchain-level issues and macroeconomic theory as it comes up in discussions of cryptocurrency.

> And what exactly is Crypto theory, exactly?

I just meant academic computer science - economic theory about cryptocurrency, like you might have in conference proceedings, academic journal articles, or technical papers openly distributed for critique and discussion. Maybe the sort of thing that might get discussed in formal policy reports by various public and private profit and nonprofit institutions.

> The Infrastructure was meant to be P2P, as noted in the White paper by Satoshi: exchanges are merely a response from the growing Market to cater to the increase in demand,

I think that's part of what I'm getting at. From the very beginning it's been clear to me people generally don't actually want pure cryptocurrency P2P in the sense they don't actually want to store the entire blockchain on their laptop. So these kinds of intermediary structures will emerge.

> and the truth is they still exist. Kraken, Binance, Gemini etc... still exist and will for some time. The number of exchanges isn't the issue in 'Cryoto land,' it's the scams

I don't mean to imply I have a problem with exchanges per se, it's that it would be nice if there was some kind of robustness built in surrounding them. Maybe fraud is inherent to all economic systems (people lose money all the time on traditional stock exchanges and in investment schemes), but it would be nice if there was something like, just say hypothetically, a higher-order layer akin to the FDIC etc (in the absence of the FDIC etc), but distributed or something? I just think these things aren't really well-worked out -- the idea that someone could exchange USD into crypto and then have it disappear because a central entity collapses is going against the grain of what crypto is supposed to prevent.

Re: Coinbase warns that bankruptcy could wipe out user funds

#189

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They just posted a quarterly loss of $430 million.

Okay, but that isn't a liability in an accounting sense, it is a cash flow. Edit: looking at the 10K, other than customer assets (where they have a net holding), they have like $6 billion in cash and equivalents against less than $5 billion of debts and other obligations). So if they shut it all down, there would be funds left over.

On paper, you have and can report a lot of assets. However, many companies go bankrupt with current ratios greater than one with either overinflated or overvalued assets or undervalued or understated debts or some combination. Financial reports a la 10-Ks and 10-Qs are 'boring,' difficult for most people to read, contain specialized jargon, and contain significant lag time where a going concern is, well, a concern. Audits are almost always annual and not quarterly. Disclosures may be required, but they can be broad or nonspecific enough as to delay broader acknowledgement of bankruptcy level problems. I'd take information from financial reports with a bit of salt, even if they are often our best, or only, source of information.

Re: Coinbase warns that bankruptcy could wipe out user funds

#190
post #2

Since coinbase isn’t FDIC insured, it makes sense that if coinbase goes bankrupt, the customer currencies will go away as well. And they aren’t SPIC insured in the situations where crypto is a security. It’s funny to see people shocked (SHOCKED!) when crypto doesn’t have the protections of regular banking and investments. That’s why you don’t invest with stuff that isn’t insured. Those aren’t real rates, they are ris…

What i don't understand is why don't people create their own wallet and keep their funds there? Isn't that the entire purpose? Of course they could still use coinbase as an exchange. But if everyone let's another party "manage" their wallet in what way is it really decentralized...

Would you like to explain to my 70 year old mother that she should install a Chrome extension, transfer her coins to it and expect her not to lose that? Oh and then explain to her that she is going to print out a piece of paper with 12 words on it. That's her backup in case she loses everything...so "Mom, do not lose this piece of paper you're screwed!"

Yes she'll figure that out easily!

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