Live data from Hacker News

Tech Salaries in 2022: Why the Six Figure Pay Makes Techies Feel Underpaid

toolbox.com

141–150 of 609 posts

Re: Tech Salaries in 2022: Why the Six Figure Pay Makes Techies Feel Underpaid

#141

>the average tech worker’s salary [will] reach $104,566 in the U.S. — a 6.9% increase since 2020, the report found. But inflation is over 11% since 2020. This isn't an increase. The average tech worker is making less than they were 2 years ago according to the Dice salary report. Why do tech workers feel underpaid? Many companies posted record growth and profits over the pandemic, but still give out paltry 3-5% raise…

> ...a 6.9% increase since 2020, the report found. But inflation is over 11% since 2020. This isn't an increase. The I have heard this point made a couple of times recently. Is there any reason why these two values should be the same? It is a point of concern for those on very low incomes who spent all their income and are not able to save anythiny, but if you are on a six figure income and only a portion of that inc…

The main issue is that all of your dollars, even the ones you save, are worth less.

Let's invent our own unit: the "grocery-year" -- one grocery-year represents the amount of money needed to buy one year of groceries.

Now let's say I am making $100k this year, and spending $10k on groceries. My annual salary is ten grocery-years (though I'm saving nine of those).

Let's assume that inflation is 10%, but I get a 5% raise. You're absolutely right that my net income will increase in dollar-terms (i.e. I'll spend $11k on groceries now, but make $105k; a $4k net increase). The issue here is that in actual purchasing power, my salary has gone down: my annual salary is now only 9.54 grocery-years.

Obviously not everything experiences the same rates of inflation, but the idea here is that inflation affects all of your income, not just the income you're spending. Likewise, my actual purchasing power will decrease if my raise doesn't match inflation, regardless of how much actual purchasing I do in a given year.

Re: Tech Salaries in 2022: Why the Six Figure Pay Makes Techies Feel Underpaid

#142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed. If you can land a job at a FAANG (not desirable for me), things are different though, even in Europe.

Nah, I worked at Amazon in Europe - earned about $75k for a position that pays $160k in the US. We europoors are cheap labour for US corporations.

I have colleagues working at AWS, Google and Apple and all making upwards of 250k USD. It’s Switzerland though, not EU.

Re: Tech Salaries in 2022: Why the Six Figure Pay Makes Techies Feel Underpaid

#143
post #10

It also makes us Europeans feel underpaid :) I have 20 years of experience and don't even make six figures. $350000 base pay sounds like a different world.

Our CEO makes 120.000 € a year. Revenue about 2.000.000 € There are employees that make more than him, but no one is close to 200.000 €. Personal is our biggest expense. I earn a decent living and can afford a house and two kids and a stay at home wife in Central Europe with 74.000 € (Project Manager / DevOp / Admin). Cost of living must be insanely high in the U.S. For me, these numbers are so high - I can't imagen…

> I can't imagen what someone would do with all this money.

Either splurge or save.

Re: Tech Salaries in 2022: Why the Six Figure Pay Makes Techies Feel Underpaid

#144
post #10

It also makes us Europeans feel underpaid :) I have 20 years of experience and don't even make six figures. $350000 base pay sounds like a different world.

Exactly my thought when I read the title. I know the cost of living is higher in US but I'm always baffled by how much tech workers make on the other side of the pond. To me it sounds like a dream.

Cost of living in the US is weird. When I am in the US, I don't feel poor as long as I do what 'regular Europeans' are doing. I could go to Whole Foods and pay a small fortune for bread, but as long as I go to Aldi prices are quite European for me. There are many ways to spend lots of money, you can find restaurants where you can spend your weekly income for a family meal, but fast food and fast casual restaurants are not more expensive than in Europe. Houses (outside metropolitan areas) and cars are often ridiculously cheap.

And then there are some things that are just insanely expensive from a European perspective: out-of-pocket medical expenses, college, lawyers, cable TV... makes it very hard to compare.

Re: Tech Salaries in 2022: Why the Six Figure Pay Makes Techies Feel Underpaid

#145

Are six figure salaries an american thing? I see people saying "Entry level jobs are paying up to 60k" which is just crazy money! I have worked for the past 7 years as IT within the UK education sector and expect my salary to be lower than that of industry but I am not even making half that!

I work in an international company and it is very difficult to compare EU to US, our US employees are on average 1.5x more expensive but, with that money they have to pay for more expensive healthcare with poorer coverage, and to get their kids to a good school they need to live in very expensive neighborhoods. For us in the Netherlands school quality is roughly homogeneous and when you get cancer you will never see a bill or suffer financially.

But 30k at 7 years of experience in IT is pretty low if you ask me (we’re talking before tax right?), for us that would be called "modal", about what a nurse or police officer would make?

I work in the Netherlands (large healthcare company) and make about 100k (12 years of experience after my PhD), however, I think my company pays quite well and when applying at other places I'd get about 85-90k? Depending on the company, larger is higher I think.

The way to a higher pay (but higher risk) for me is becoming independent I think. Then I'd probable be able to ask for 150 an hour (as consultant/sw dev). This be fore tax, no pension etc.

Re: Tech Salaries in 2022: Why the Six Figure Pay Makes Techies Feel Underpaid

#146
post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

20 years here too, UK, I've finally broken the 6 digit bar but I had to move to contracting. My experience made getting job offers simple, but no one wanted to pay more. I'd often get lowballs with the offer of kudos for working at that tech firm. £95k seems to be the upper limit at this point here for FTEs.

I've seen some remote architech/tech lead roles offering up to £125k, but this is a very recent development.

Those would also be quite uncommon, but I have seen them. Usually for Oracle or someone I wouldnt want to go with. Most tech lead roles I've seen topped out at £90k.

Re: Tech Salaries in 2022: Why the Six Figure Pay Makes Techies Feel Underpaid

#147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The cost of everything else raised as well, so wealthy tech workers also lost purchasing power (especially after the last stock crash).

> I don't understand this opinion. Ok, let me spell it out: you're not special. Nothing about your profession makes you special, you are not somehow better than anyone because you can sit at a computer and write code. It's a skill, a very highly compensated one for now but an incredibly narrow one that happens to be useful a select few corps, sure, but so was were many other things. And if one thing that COVID has ta…

I assume this is a reply to my comment. What you're saying here is right, but I have no idea why you're saying it as I really don't care about being special, at all. Never crossed my mind until now, and nobody ever told me so (except for the other meaning of "special", and that has a lot of truth to it).

And then, even if I thought I was special (I don't), I would still be fully capable of feeling concerned for other less fortunate people while feeling concerned about making less than X times the average.

Anyways, the demand for software engineers increased extremely significantly (multiples of open positions, rates doubled) when Covid started and all remaining companies hopped on the digital transformation trend; and that continues to today.

Every contract I interviewed for since it began, they literally begged me to work for them (previously it felt like we're equals, they were able to say no without fear of not finding anyone else). They don't even ask programming questions anymore, they just try to make their company look like the best place while apologizing profusely for their limited budget. Your characterization of the programmers market seems totally out of loop.

Re: Tech Salaries in 2022: Why the Six Figure Pay Makes Techies Feel Underpaid

#148

A solid article, but it should have commented on single family home prices. If you use the 3x salary rule, a $120k a year techie couldn't afford the median home price in America ($374k). A software engineer in San Francisco would have to make $526k a year in cold hard cash to reasonably afford the median single family home ($1.58 million). Talking about six figure salaries as if they are unquestionably upper-middle c…

Where does 3X salary rule come from?

Also checkout the "rule of 72" if this stuff tickles you. It is also a rough estimate that gets used in place of more complex formulas. (Actually closer to 69/70 but 72 makes things cleaner)

Re: Tech Salaries in 2022: Why the Six Figure Pay Makes Techies Feel Underpaid

#149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be clear, I do quite a bit better than that... I'm not complaining. But using 120k as an example...a person went from making 4x the typical full time salary to 2x the typical full time salary in a very short period.

> To be clear, I do quite a bit better than that... I'm not complaining. But using 120k as an example...a person went from making 4x the typical full time salary to 2x the typical full time salary in a very short period. This is what I will never understand about most established tech people, they see all the widespread misery and poverty in SV and they still have the capacity to feel sorry for themselves for not mak…

> This is what I will never understand about most established tech people, they see all the widespread misery and poverty in SV and they still have the capacity to feel sorry for themselves for not making X times more than 'that other guy.'

As opposed to who exactly? The system is based on greed and maximizing profits/salaries/status/whatever. Are doctors/lawyers/financial people not behaving this way? Some doctors earn around one million USD a year in the U.S, that's money that makes insurance more expensive and unaffordable for everyone.

Re: Tech Salaries in 2022: Why the Six Figure Pay Makes Techies Feel Underpaid

#150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> if fortune 500 CEO pay is up less than 11% on avg since 2020 Yeah well, in reality it's up considerably more. They didn't get to be the 0.1% by accepting sub-inflation pay raises for the last 100+ years. Here is what their actual raises were: 19% in 2021, 16% in 2020, ~14% in 2019 & 2018. Sources below. Meanwhile that's what average hourly wages increased by: 4.7% in 2021, 1.8% in 2020 https://fortune.com/2022/04/0…

Might be pilots or lawyers but generally they are not overpaid but just paid decent.

Over the last 10 years in the US:

Inflation (CPI): 25.2% (2.2% annual increase)

Pilots average wage increase: 67.8% (5.3% annual raise, $118,070 -> $198,190)

Lawyers average wage increase: 13.4% (1.2% annual raise, $130,490 -> $148,030)

A mere 4.1% points difference in their annual pay raises, but it really adds up over the years – pilots started the past decade with lower wages than lawyers, yet ended it much better off. Keeping pace with inflation is extremely important.

https://www.usinflationcalculator.com/

https://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes532011.htm

http://web.archive.org/web/20120526161129/https://www.bls.go...

https://www.bls.gov/oes/current/oes231011.htm

http://web.archive.org/web/20120526012248/https://www.bls.go...

Post reply on HN