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Jwz: Google's pseudonym support "obvious bullshit"

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Re: Jwz: Google's pseudonym support "obvious bullshit"

#11

Post by joebadmo »

blahedo wrote: post #6
joebadmo wrote: post #3

I'll bet they still require you to register with your "real" name, but then they'll graciously allow you to have a linked nickname or two, I agree, and I think this is probably the right thing for them to do. (Well, probably stop kicking people off, too.) And I think they're probably doing this in an attempt to allow people to better represent themselves in the ways that they choose, and more in line with how they ca…

> > meaning they're still fully prepared to roll over on you > I'm not sure what the suggestion is here. They should be prepared to flout the law? Why would you draw that inference? JWZ seems to be presuming the opposite, i.e. that Google plans to comply with the law---and since they will have carefully collected legal names to go with every account, they can be maximally helpful to the authoritarian governments who…

I meant what was his suggestion to correct this. That they should flout the law?

This one. Or at least, if not "any of the information", maybe not gather all of the information. Permit users to associate their account with their established pseudonym and provide exactly as many RL details as they feel comfortable providing.

Use a fake but real sounding name. Then use a pseudonym attached to it. Then provide exactly as many RL details as you feel comfortable. Why does it matter that the pseudonym is somehow canonical?

Re: Jwz: Google's pseudonym support "obvious bullshit"

#12

Post by joshma »

I'm sick of these posts. What I got out of the article was "I think I know how Google should design its product, and thus I deem decisions not in agreement to be total bullshit."

Personally, I prefer to respect the work they've put into the product and to accept that they may have insights deeper than mine. It's evident from Google's announcement that they see more complex issues around pseudonyms, and I will form an opinion after I see their changes. I do not understand this attitude of "Fuck those guys" - so much anger over a social network!

Re: Jwz: Google's pseudonym support "obvious bullshit"

#13

Post by loopdoend »

If Google still requires you to use your real name to register but allows you to show only a pseudonym, the problem ceases to exist because there is no one able to rat you out.

That is, unless they write an algorithm that checks for "Dear realname" in your emails and compares it to your purported name & pseudonym. Yuck.

Re: Jwz: Google's pseudonym support "obvious bullshit"

#14

Post by justina1 »

joshma wrote: post #12

I'm sick of these posts. What I got out of the article was "I think I know how Google should design its product, and thus I deem decisions not in agreement to be total bullshit." Personally, I prefer to respect the work they've put into the product and to accept that they may have insights deeper than mine. It's evident from Google's announcement that they see more complex issues around pseudonyms, and I will form an…

This.

Thoughtful analysis is far more useful than these sensationalist rants.

Re: Jwz: Google's pseudonym support "obvious bullshit"

#15

Post by mikeryan »

TomOfTTB wrote: post #2

I think he's missing a distinction here. There's people's right not to have their name associated with stuff in public. Either because they've established a pseudonym they want to be associated with or they want to speak freely without risking harm to their career, family, etc... That's what I consider pseudonymity and that might take a while to implement. Then there's straight up privacy. That's what he's talking ab…

I think he understands the distinction perfectly.

He's saying you can't have true Psuedonimity (as you, and Google define it) without complete privacy. If someone can scratch the surface of your psuedonym and find your real name then there's no real point.

Re: Jwz: Google's pseudonym support "obvious bullshit"

#16

Post by TomOfTTB »

blahedo wrote: post #4
TomOfTTB wrote: post #2

I think he's missing a distinction here. There's people's right not to have their name associated with stuff in public. Either because they've established a pseudonym they want to be associated with or they want to speak freely without risking harm to their career, family, etc... That's what I consider pseudonymity and that might take a while to implement. Then there's straight up privacy. That's what he's talking ab…

> That's what I consider pseudonymity But that's not what pretty much everyone pushing pseudonymity in this fight considers pseudonymity, so your distinction is not very helpful.

Was there a vote I was unaware of?

(Sorry, the unflinching confidence in your statement made the snarkyness irresistible to me)

I realize there's a spectrum to every debate and it's sometimes hard to know where the fringe is. But I have to assume most people realize Google has the right to know who they are providing a service to.

Again, I see the distinction here between Google knowing your name (which I think they have the right to do) and Google using your name to build a whole database on you (which I don't support). But these are all privacy issues.

Pseudonymity is about how you present yourself to the community at large and to the best of my knowledge it always has been. For example, Samuel Clemens published under Mark Twain but his publisher paid Samuel Clemens.

Re: Jwz: Google's pseudonym support "obvious bullshit"

#17

Post by rhizome »

joshma wrote: post #12

I'm sick of these posts. What I got out of the article was "I think I know how Google should design its product, and thus I deem decisions not in agreement to be total bullshit." Personally, I prefer to respect the work they've put into the product and to accept that they may have insights deeper than mine. It's evident from Google's announcement that they see more complex issues around pseudonyms, and I will form an…

Why do you think they're hiding these "deeper insights," do they think we're too stupid to understand?

Re: Jwz: Google's pseudonym support "obvious bullshit"

#18

Post by TomOfTTB »

mikeryan wrote: post #15
TomOfTTB wrote: post #2

I think he's missing a distinction here. There's people's right not to have their name associated with stuff in public. Either because they've established a pseudonym they want to be associated with or they want to speak freely without risking harm to their career, family, etc... That's what I consider pseudonymity and that might take a while to implement. Then there's straight up privacy. That's what he's talking ab…

I think he understands the distinction perfectly. He's saying you can't have true Psuedonimity (as you, and Google define it) without complete privacy. If someone can scratch the surface of your psuedonym and find your real name then there's no real point.

If Google knows your name but allows you to post under a pseudonym then how can someone scratch the surface and find out your real name (unless they work for Google)? That's like saying you can't post an anonymous blog because the web provider knows your real name.

Re: Jwz: Google's pseudonym support "obvious bullshit"

#19

Post by mikeryan »

TomOfTTB wrote: post #18
mikeryan wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think he understands the distinction perfectly. He's saying you can't have true Psuedonimity (as you, and Google define it) without complete privacy. If someone can scratch the surface of your psuedonym and find your real name then there's no real point.

If Google knows your name but allows you to post under a pseudonym then how can someone scratch the surface and find out your real name (unless they work for Google)? That's like saying you can't post an anonymous blog because the web provider knows your real name.

then how can someone scratch the surface and find out your real name

A subpoena will do it.

Re: Jwz: Google's pseudonym support "obvious bullshit"

#20

Post by TomOfTTB »

mindstab wrote: post #7

Everyone is also missing the bigger point that Google's idea of a valid real name is incredibly north american and anglo centric. There are plenty of cases of people using their real names, be in European, or African or what ever and google still kicking them off. Google's policies do not work, and are verging on racist. I know some people who would be better off using a fake anglo name than their real name to keep u…

I don't know. I think it's two different issues. One is an issue of policy the other is an issue of incompetence in implementing a policy.
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