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Everything with a battery should have an off switch

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Re: Everything with a battery should have an off switch

#71

Post by lobochrome »

Nanite wrote: post #4

Examples lying around in my house: Bathroom scale: lovely it powers up when you tap it, but eats up 2 button cells a year for a few dozen uses a year Kitchen scales, bit more use, at least once a day but again 2 button cells a year electronic caliper: Same, eats up 1 button cell a year, just sitting in my toolbox Strangely enough none of our kids toys with batteries seem to suffer from this problem How much extra cos…

Regarding Kitchen Scale:

I recently bought this [1]. It works with friction - you turn the nob once or twice and you're good to go for a couple weigh ins. It feels rather cheap - so let's see if it really lasts. I love the idea though. I wish we had more energy harvesting gadgets like this.

[1]; https://caso-design.de/en/p/caso-kitchen-energy-design-kitch...

Re: Everything with a battery should have an off switch

#72

Post by throwaway049 »

pveierland wrote: post #67

Related to the topic, besides the energy argument and the ability to cycle system state, I'd argue the huge importance of being able to power things off for personal freedom, especially for things with connectivity. We still have the power to shut off devices and largely the ability to block their connectivity (e.g. routing TV ads through a network filter). With 5G and future connectivity, it feels as there will be p…

Great. Now I need to buy a faraday cage to fit my refrigerator.

Re: Everything with a battery should have an off switch

#73

Post by birdman3131 »

Nanite wrote: post #4

Examples lying around in my house: Bathroom scale: lovely it powers up when you tap it, but eats up 2 button cells a year for a few dozen uses a year Kitchen scales, bit more use, at least once a day but again 2 button cells a year electronic caliper: Same, eats up 1 button cell a year, just sitting in my toolbox Strangely enough none of our kids toys with batteries seem to suffer from this problem How much extra cos…

All of those are ones I would argue the best design is to eat a few batteries a year. Calipers need to hold memory specifically.

But more generally most of those are using alkaleak batteries and you really wanna be changing those out on at least a yearly basis. So it actually makes since to let them have a small always on drain. (Some might be using a 2032 lithium but I can almost guarantee at least the calipers are a 357/lr44 alkaline battery.)

Re: Everything with a battery should have an off switch

#74

Post by _trampeltier »

Nanite wrote: post #4

Examples lying around in my house: Bathroom scale: lovely it powers up when you tap it, but eats up 2 button cells a year for a few dozen uses a year Kitchen scales, bit more use, at least once a day but again 2 button cells a year electronic caliper: Same, eats up 1 button cell a year, just sitting in my toolbox Strangely enough none of our kids toys with batteries seem to suffer from this problem How much extra cos…

When started to live in my own appartemen and was the first time sick, I bought a thermometer to measure fever. The second time when I was sick a couple of years later the battery was flat. So I bought an oldschool thermometer without battery to measure fever. I use still the same 20 years later. Of course it does take a bit longer to know your body temperature, but when you are sick, you are not in a hurry anyway.

Re: Everything with a battery should have an off switch

#75

Post by stinos »

lobochrome wrote: post #71
Nanite wrote: post #4

Examples lying around in my house: Bathroom scale: lovely it powers up when you tap it, but eats up 2 button cells a year for a few dozen uses a year Kitchen scales, bit more use, at least once a day but again 2 button cells a year electronic caliper: Same, eats up 1 button cell a year, just sitting in my toolbox Strangely enough none of our kids toys with batteries seem to suffer from this problem How much extra cos…

Regarding Kitchen Scale: I recently bought this [1]. It works with friction - you turn the nob once or twice and you're good to go for a couple weigh ins. It feels rather cheap - so let's see if it really lasts. I love the idea though. I wish we had more energy harvesting gadgets like this. [1]; https://caso-design.de/en/p/caso-kitchen-energy-design-kitch...

Have had a similar model for like 5 years now. No regrets yet. The small effort it takes to power it up by far outweighs all of the disadvantages of a battery.

Before that I installed a switch in the scale we had to erradicate battery drain.

Re: Everything with a battery should have an off switch

#76

Post by kuu »

nickff wrote: post #7
Nanite wrote: post #4

Examples lying around in my house: Bathroom scale: lovely it powers up when you tap it, but eats up 2 button cells a year for a few dozen uses a year Kitchen scales, bit more use, at least once a day but again 2 button cells a year electronic caliper: Same, eats up 1 button cell a year, just sitting in my toolbox Strangely enough none of our kids toys with batteries seem to suffer from this problem How much extra cos…

> ” How much extra cost does a hard on/off switch add to the bill of materials?” BoM cost is not the whole story; a physical switch can greatly complicate an assembly, and may require hand-soldered wires. In addition to those cost-related factors, external switches are usually quite ugly, and getting them right can be very challenging, so it’s much easier to just omit them.

Seriously? Is 2022 and we didn't solve the switch button? I'm sorry but I just don't believe you.

Re: Everything with a battery should have an off switch

#77

Post by onion2k »

can16358p wrote: post #63

While I get the motivation, I'd rather have my Apple devices which have some economic value to be findable using Find My, which can't function with a physical "hard" off switch. I'd rather have Bluetooth use infinitesimal amount of my iPhone/Macbook battery than them being lost/stolen which could be potentially tracked when off with "soft off". But besides some use cases like this, I agree with the post.

I'd rather have my Apple devices which have some economic value to be findable using Find My, which can't function with a physical "hard" off switch.

Why not? I mean obviously they wouldn't be findable if they were off, but that's a feature. Apple could add a physical switch and leave everything else the same. Your devices would function as they do now in "On" mode, but you'd also be able to turn the off properly. Isn't that better?

Re: Everything with a battery should have an off switch

#78

Post by bogantech »

Gibbon1 wrote: post #62
throwmeariver1 wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

foone doesn't like hackernews so I guess OP meant to show "respect" to foone and not link their stuff here.

foone gets harassed when their tweets get linked here.

Is that actually true though?

If one of their threads is interesting enough to show up on HN isn't it also likely to have been retweeted, shared around elsewhere too?

They certainly pop up in my feed constantly due to RT's from other popular tech people on twitter

Re: Everything with a battery should have an off switch

#79

Post by mdp2021 »

pveierland wrote: post #67

Related to the topic, besides the energy argument and the ability to cycle system state, I'd argue the huge importance of being able to power things off for personal freedom, especially for things with connectivity. We still have the power to shut off devices and largely the ability to block their connectivity (e.g. routing TV ads through a network filter). With 5G and future connectivity, it feels as there will be p…

> With 5G and future connectivity, it feels as there will be push towards not being able to block the network access of individual devices, such that a TV or fridge will just speak to its server directly via some XG/IoT network which the user does control, without any user ability to block this communication

How does one ensure that a product is built this way, to avoid it?

I understood that a number of current 5G capable devices - e.g. telephones - can be disconnected the usual way (a button in the (quick)settings that toggles the connection).

Re: Everything with a battery should have an off switch

#80

Post by forgotmypw17 »

Buttons840 wrote: post #17
Nanite wrote: post #4

Examples lying around in my house: Bathroom scale: lovely it powers up when you tap it, but eats up 2 button cells a year for a few dozen uses a year Kitchen scales, bit more use, at least once a day but again 2 button cells a year electronic caliper: Same, eats up 1 button cell a year, just sitting in my toolbox Strangely enough none of our kids toys with batteries seem to suffer from this problem How much extra cos…

Both bathroom and kitchens scales are large enough they can run on AA / AAA batteries and casually go a decade (or more) without replacement. Tangentially: I used to have a 3 button timer, it was a little LCD countdown display and 3 buttons. One button set hours, one minutes, and one starts / stops the countdown timer. I found this timer when I was a kid, used, and the 1 AAA battery it had lasted into adulthood, lite…

i have read that the build quality of batteries has dropped.
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