Boquila trifoliolata mimics leaves of an artificial plastic host plant (2021)
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Re: Boquila trifoliolata mimics leaves of an artificial plastic host plant (2021)
#2I found this fascinating!
I have no ability to vet the paper for science I'm afraid, but on an intuitive level, and especially given all the different biological sensing and animal-cleverness results that have been reported in recent years, I would not be at all surprised if the 'vision' hypothesis holds in the end.
Cuttlefish (maybe even perhaps their skin independently of the brain?) can do this type of pattern-sensing and response, so why not plants?
To be able to do this kind of thing only requires slightly a bigger (and perhaps differently-shaped) buffer for information ultimately, right?
Re: Boquila trifoliolata mimics leaves of an artificial plastic host plant (2021)
#3From Wikipedia:
“In a 2022 paper, it was suggested that the plant has some sort of vision using ocelli. This hypothesis was presented on the basis of experiments in which the vine appeared to mimic plastic vines and artificial plants. However, the only control used was the lower leaves on the same plants, with an opaque shelf over them which could have influenced light exposure. The lack of control plants climbing anything apart from the same model of artificial host plant makes it plausible that the observed differences were due to age and light exposure.”
Re: Boquila trifoliolata mimics leaves of an artificial plastic host plant (2021)
#4When it comes to other animals, theres a lot of principled caution about attributing supposedly "human" concepts to apes or orca whales. When it comes to computers, we tend to be exceedingly cautious.
For some reason that principled caution goes out the window once we start talking about plants.
Here on HN I've seen folks equate photoreceptivity to consciousness, chemical exchanges between roots to full fledged "communication", and indulge in open ended musing about the gaia hypothesis. Practically everything is game and there's no telling how seroius people are being or if they're just getting lost in their own metaphors.
Re: Boquila trifoliolata mimics leaves of an artificial plastic host plant (2021)
#5When it comes to other animals, theres a lot of principled caution about attributing supposedly "human" concepts to apes or orca whales. When it comes to computers, we tend to be exceedingly cautious. For some reason that principled caution goes out the window once we start talking about plants. Here on HN I've seen folks equate photoreceptivity to consciousness, chemical exchanges between roots to full fledged "comm…
I don’t think that there is a contradiction since I would not expect the ones who are careful with these ideas on animals and the ones suggesting them for plants to be the same people.
Different people, different ideas.
Re: Boquila trifoliolata mimics leaves of an artificial plastic host plant (2021)
#6From Wikipedia: “In a 2022 paper, it was suggested that the plant has some sort of vision using ocelli. This hypothesis was presented on the basis of experiments in which the vine appeared to mimic plastic vines and artificial plants. However, the only control used was the lower leaves on the same plants, with an opaque shelf over them which could have influenced light exposure. The lack of control plants climbing an…
That seems like a simple hypothesis to test: just do the same setup with the shelves but without the plastic plant. Additional idea: also test with artificial leaves with the same form as a plain Boquila.
Re: Boquila trifoliolata mimics leaves of an artificial plastic host plant (2021)
#7When it comes to other animals, theres a lot of principled caution about attributing supposedly "human" concepts to apes or orca whales. When it comes to computers, we tend to be exceedingly cautious. For some reason that principled caution goes out the window once we start talking about plants. Here on HN I've seen folks equate photoreceptivity to consciousness, chemical exchanges between roots to full fledged "comm…
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plant_communication
See also: bacteria and fungi
Re: Boquila trifoliolata mimics leaves of an artificial plastic host plant (2021)
#8When it comes to other animals, theres a lot of principled caution about attributing supposedly "human" concepts to apes or orca whales. When it comes to computers, we tend to be exceedingly cautious. For some reason that principled caution goes out the window once we start talking about plants. Here on HN I've seen folks equate photoreceptivity to consciousness, chemical exchanges between roots to full fledged "comm…
I don’t think that there is a contradiction since I would not expect the ones who are careful with these ideas on animals and the ones suggesting them for plants to be the same people. Different people, different ideas.
Right, but I was talking about the community level rather than the individual level.
Re: Boquila trifoliolata mimics leaves of an artificial plastic host plant (2021)
#9When it comes to other animals, theres a lot of principled caution about attributing supposedly "human" concepts to apes or orca whales. When it comes to computers, we tend to be exceedingly cautious. For some reason that principled caution goes out the window once we start talking about plants. Here on HN I've seen folks equate photoreceptivity to consciousness, chemical exchanges between roots to full fledged "comm…
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plant_communication See also: bacteria and fungi
I'm aware of this wiki article.
Re: Boquila trifoliolata mimics leaves of an artificial plastic host plant (2021)
#10When it comes to other animals, theres a lot of principled caution about attributing supposedly "human" concepts to apes or orca whales. When it comes to computers, we tend to be exceedingly cautious. For some reason that principled caution goes out the window once we start talking about plants. Here on HN I've seen folks equate photoreceptivity to consciousness, chemical exchanges between roots to full fledged "comm…
"equate photoreceptivity to consciousness" - is this any more than one or two nutters?
"chemical exchanges between roots to full fledged "communication"" - without context it may have been a perfectly reasonable supposition.
"open ended musing about the gaia hypothesis" - hard to tell if it's a few or endemic without examples