Yandex data center in Finland loses power due to contract termination • Hacker News Board

Re: Yandex data center in Finland loses power due to contract termination

#131

Post by ivan_gammel » Wed, May 04, 2022, 9:55 AM UTC

watwut wrote: post #112

ivan_gammel wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While all that you said is true regarding the current situation, 2000s were a different story regarding economics. Putin's pocket oligarchs did not have the same amount of influence and in that period of time plenty of new independent businesses were created, some of which became large companies. Yes, some of those are now being taken over by state, but again, that's not what was happening in 2000s. In 2000s Russia o…

The large ones were not independent in anything but the name long before being taken over by state. All the Oligarchs or larger businesses had to cooperate. Ukrainian Maidan was 2014. And it happened only after years of Russia trying to buy and influence Ukrainian politics. It was Orange revolution that happened in 2004. Putin became acting president in 1999 - that gives us like 5 years before 2004. Also, afaik, jour…

I'm glad that you know some history, but I'm not sure what are you arguing with. Economic growth of 2000s did happen and it was a pretty liberal time back then.

>The large ones were not independent in anything but the name long before being taken over by state.

Let's take a few concrete examples of really big companies: VKontakte, Wildberries and Magnit. How exactly Putin and his gang exercised the control over them before acquisition (Wildberries still belongs to the founder)?

Re: Yandex data center in Finland loses power due to contract termination

#132

Post by ThrustVectoring » Wed, May 04, 2022, 9:56 AM UTC

> If the situation so requires, we would have to replace waste heat mainly with Russian natural gas and light fuel oil.

Why wouldn't this just be using the electricity freed up by not powering the data center? Thermodynamically, the data center is just a resistive load, so assuming the electrical distribution system can handle the load, it should be a drop-in replacement.

Re: Yandex data center in Finland loses power due to contract termination

#133

Post by the-lazy-guy » Wed, May 04, 2022, 9:57 AM UTC

petre wrote: post #40

ivan_gammel wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In his first term he delivered a number of useful economic reforms with a team of liberal economists. Taxes, land ownership, banking, bankruptcy etc. The economic block in the government remains very professional and impartial even now. The only thing Russia really needed to become a normal state was to reform judicial branch, police and security services.

It went from a post Soviet klepto capiltalist society to crony feudalism. Those are Putin's reforms . Every big business is controlled by Putin's mafia: Rosneft, Gazprom, Sberbank, VK, Yandex, etc. It mirrors Russia during Ivan the Terrible's rule quite well. Feudalism has no place in the 21st centrury.

I can't speak for other companies mentioned (for most of them Russian government is the biggest shareholder, so I think you are right), but Yandex is not and has never been controlled by people close to Putin. I would like to see examples of this control, if you have any.

Though Yandex has to follow government regulations (especially in its media department), a lot of which are obviously biased.

Re: Yandex data center in Finland loses power due to contract termination

#134

Post by watwut » Wed, May 04, 2022, 9:57 AM UTC

skissane wrote: post #116

verytrivial wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh, they knew. They were just being casually traitorous.

I don't think I'm a "Russian shill", but honestly I was sceptical about suggestions that Russia would launch a wholesale invasion of Ukraine until it actually happened. I thought Putin was just bluffing and sabre-rattling. Given how the war has been going for Russia, I suspect Putin now wishes that people like me had been right.

You are not someone expected to look at what is happening in foreign country. As in, you are not expected to read their journals, you are not expected to follow detailed news about what is happening there. You are not expected to have detailed knowledge of what that country does abroad either.

When we talk about people who actively tried to sway public opinion or actively tried to influence politics, the expectations are different.

Re: Yandex data center in Finland loses power due to contract termination

#135

Post by Delk » Wed, May 04, 2022, 10:00 AM UTC

vardump wrote: post #93

can16358p wrote: post #75

> at a current price of €2.175 per 1 liter What? €2175 per liter of diesel? Am I missing something? /edit: nvm I misinterpreted decimal point as a thousands seperator.

A very reasonable misunderstanding, because that's exactly how 2.175 would be interpret in Finland. As 2175. In Finland, comma is the decimal separator.

Technically, I'm not sure most people in Finland would interpret 2.175 as 2175 because the dot isn't generally used as a thousands separator either. If you want a thousands separator, it's usually just a single space. "2.175" would be just a weird bunch of numbers as the dot isn't generally used as any kind of a number separator.

Re: Yandex data center in Finland loses power due to contract termination

#136

Post by Ciantic » Wed, May 04, 2022, 10:02 AM UTC

riffraff wrote: post #32

fulafel wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Russia and Europe spent a lot of time and invested a lot of faith to building commerce, in both Europe and Russia the prevailing idea was that the interdependency is a force for peace and stability and it seemed to be mostly working for a while. (Also Russia is also a very risky business environment, so hedging...) (Also^2 Yandex is not under sanctions, the current outage doesn't seem to be about sanctions according…

it's worth noting that the whole EU starting from the earlier european communities was built on such an idea that tighter and tighter integration would make war unlikely (and in some cases, unthinkable). While this didn't work out for the Russian relationship, it wasn't a totally stupid plan.

It wasn't totally stupid plan, but it doesn't work if one party ceases to be interested in economics more than other grandiose plans.

The idea that interdependence leads to less wars is very old one. I was reading The Guns of August which tells about beginning of first World War, it refers to book released in 1910 called "the Great Illusion" [1]. I have not read it, but the book became best seller just before first World War, I'll quote from Wikipedia here:

> In The Great Illusion, Angell's primary thesis was, in the words of historian James Joll, that "the economic cost of war was so great that no one could possibly hope to gain by starting a war the consequences of which would be so disastrous." For that reason, a general European war was very unlikely to start, and if it did, it would not last long...

> According to Angell, the economic interdependence between industrial countries would be "the real guarantor of the good behavior of one state to another"...

Economics matter, but if the leadership isn't made of business caring people, or is isolated like it now looks like, then interdependence isn't happening regardless of business ties between companies.

[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Great_Illusion

Re: Yandex data center in Finland loses power due to contract termination

#137

Post by RamRodification » Wed, May 04, 2022, 10:03 AM UTC

dredmorbius wrote: post #110

RamRodification wrote: post #59

RBC calculates that running a 40MW data center on diesel would require 12,000 liters of diesel fuel per hour Holy crap

Checking that out: You have: 40 MWh You want: tonoil * 3.4393809 / 0.29075 You have: 1 tonoil You want: barreloil * 6.8419323 / 0.14615754 You have: 6.84 barrel You want: liter * 1087.4731 / 0.00091956298 So, roughly 1,100 litres of oil per 40 MWh(thermal). The generator is likely ~30% efficient at converting heat to eletricity, so bump that up to 3,700 litres/hour. Even allowing for other inefficiencies, 12,000 litr…

Aren't you missing x3.4393809 on those ~1100 litres?

Re: Yandex data center in Finland loses power due to contract termination

#138

Post by trenchgun » Wed, May 04, 2022, 10:04 AM UTC

ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #3

I would like to know why Yandex though that opening data centers in western counties would be a good idea. Surely they knew that, as a Russian company, if their government ever becomes aggressive, they'll also be targeted by sanctions.

Yandex is not targeted with sanctions. Article is misleading.

Re: Yandex data center in Finland loses power due to contract termination

#139

Post by mantas » Wed, May 04, 2022, 10:08 AM UTC

LudwigNagasena wrote: post #9

mantas wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Arabs could have easily sanctioned US and the rest of West back then. Or maybe people were happy to see Husein go... While in this case the world has a different opinion.

No one can easily sanction the US, even if it invades a country against all UN rules. Countries that opposed the invasion didn’t even leave NATO.

Anything is not possible till the moment it actually happens. I remember when countries with McDonalds attacking each other was impossible.

Re: Yandex data center in Finland loses power due to contract termination

#140

Post by ivan_gammel » Wed, May 04, 2022, 10:10 AM UTC

obscurette wrote: post #106

ivan_gammel wrote: post #85

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While all that you said is true regarding the current situation, 2000s were a different story regarding economics. Putin's pocket oligarchs did not have the same amount of influence and in that period of time plenty of new independent businesses were created, some of which became large companies. Yes, some of those are now being taken over by state, but again, that's not what was happening in 2000s. In 2000s Russia o…

Plentiful 2000s have nothing to do with Putin. These were plentiful regardless of Putin not because of him. It is normal for every society to take a time to adapt with completely new situation. The fact that it was the beginning of 2000s where things started to become much better after the mess of 1990s is true for almost every ex-USSR and Eastern Europe country. But Putin has always been the man he is now – the war…

>It is normal for every society to take a time to adapt with completely new situation.

This is a very generic and abstract statement. If you think that the growth could happen without economic reforms that took place in early 2000s, please explain how exactly could that happen in the aftermath of second Chechen War and economic crisis of 1998.