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Supreme Court has voted to overturn abortion rights, draft opinion shows

politico.com

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Re: Supreme Court has voted to overturn abortion rights, draft opinion shows

#101

Post by autoexec »

cato_the_elder wrote: post #96
autoexec wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many states have already decided they don't care how many women are forced to give birth to their rapists children or die due to medical problems surrounding their pregnancy. Even before this ruling there are places where women's lives have been endangered because accessible clinics were forced to close. No matter what state you are in, being an American citizen should guarantee you certain rights. Not being forced t…

> Many states have already decided they don't care how many women are forced to give birth to their rapists children or die due to medical problems surrounding their pregnancy. I sympathize with the concern about dignity of rape victims, but the second part of your assertion is incorrect: "At present, all states allow the procedure to preserve the life and health of the mother". [1] (That includes even the Texas law…

Not all laws have included such provisions (see for example BMJ 2003;327:1009 which was passed and signed by Bush), and those that do are so vague that it does things like leave doctors at great risk of getting their lives ruined for doing what they think is right for their patient or would make procedures that are medically necessary to save the life of the mother illegal any time it wasn't also an active and immediate emergency (such as in this bill: https://legiscan.com/MS/text/SB2116/id/1846191)

It turns out when lawmakers have even bothered at all to play lip service to protecting the lives of pregnant women they still haven't done a very good job actually making sure they are protected.

Re: Supreme Court has voted to overturn abortion rights, draft opinion shows

#102

Post by [deleted] »

ausbah wrote: post #88
georgia_peach wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Elite lawyers may be cleverer than the peasants, but that does not make them righteous or just. As I've already written, just because the court had taken a leftward tack in the recent past does not guarantee that it will continue to do so. Left or right, it would be best not to have that much power in so few hands. https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2016/03/07/4694780...

I'm not exactly advocating for the power SCOTUS has, there are a whole host of things like the case you pointed out. I speaking more in principle that "mob rule" doesn't end well for those not in the mob

[deleted]

Re: Supreme Court has voted to overturn abortion rights, draft opinion shows

#103

Post by mystique »

drewbug01 wrote: post #93
mystique wrote: post #90

Can someone explain in non-legal way why the court believes an individual has right to decide whether they can wear a mask or not but not whether they can have a medical procedure or not? What's the main difference between these two?

The court has rapidly given itself over to partisanship in the last few years. That framework lends understanding to the seeming contradiction in their decisions.

Sure that may be the case but there is still some argument applied to both decisions. What's the main difference between one vs. the other that makes decision to get a medical procedure not legal but decision to not wear a mask legal?

Re: Supreme Court has voted to overturn abortion rights, draft opinion shows

#104

Post by randomtwiddler »

autoexec wrote: post #98
TrispusAttucks wrote: post #52

FYI: This just takes abortion out of the purview of the federal government and makes it a states issue, as the constitution intended.

You say "just" but the fact is that no matter where in the country you are, being an American citizen should guarantee a person certain rights, such as access to critical medical care, or not being forced to give birth to your rapist's child. Several states have already demonstrated that they don't want their population to have those rights and even before this women's lives were endangered by their attempts to close…

You can't have a right that is also a service. Services are based on voluntary exchange.

Re: Supreme Court has voted to overturn abortion rights, draft opinion shows

#105

Post by klyrs »

triyambakam wrote: post #16
kccoder wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about the dignity of rape victims forced to carry, deliver, and raise the children of their rapists?

Don't most people hold that "two wrongs don't make a right"? In Hindu view abortion no matter the reason, except to save the mother's life, incurs strong negative karma.

Not sure what your comment has to do with a country that forbids the establishment of state religion.

Re: Supreme Court has voted to overturn abortion rights, draft opinion shows

#106

Post by klyrs »

xyzzy4747 wrote: post #5
toomuchtodo wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yikes. Preventing abortions brings unwanted children into the world and pushes abortion underground, where they’ll just be less safe abortions. Do you know how unwanted children are treated? I volunteer as a guardian ad litem for children who need a court appointed advocate, and I support abortion fully having seen the alternative suffering, not to mention anti abortion proponents supporting life right up until birth…

So it’s better for them not to exist? Would be nice to at least give them a chance to live.

"Would be nice" enough that you'd be willing to carry your father's child to term?

Re: Supreme Court has voted to overturn abortion rights, draft opinion shows

#107

Post by spoils19 »

fzeroracer wrote: post #46
TheFreim wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Preventing abortions brings unwanted children into the world and pushes abortion underground, where they’ll just be less safe abortions. If someone believes that abortion is killing an innocent human being, and thus immoral worthy of being illegal, this line of argument won't do anything. It would be like saying, "if we ban murder for hire that will push all of the hitmen under ground!". I understand you don't beli…

I can fully understand why they take the pro-life point of view, and it's wrong. The end result of a pro-life view is what you see happening in this thread: People arguing that birth control should be made illegal. They want to erode freedom of individuals to decide for themselves in favor of their own religious zeal. As toomuchtodo has said, the gap has become impossible to bridge, mainly because any concessions to…

The Constitution makes no reference to abortion, and no such right is implicitly protected by any constitutional provision.

Re: Supreme Court has voted to overturn abortion rights, draft opinion shows

#108

Post by margalabargala »

TrispusAttucks wrote: post #95
t-3 wrote: post #81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

Quoted post unavailable.

The issue is in the definition of "unborn human". Many people don't believe that something without a brain is considered to be a living human, in the same sense that people who are braindead but with a beating heart are considered dead.

The question is, at what point in the unfertilized egg -> fertilized egg -> clump of cells -> developing fetus -> viable infant spectrum does the being take on "humanity"?

Personally I think basing this on neurological activity is a reasonable line to draw.

Re: Supreme Court has voted to overturn abortion rights, draft opinion shows

#110

Post by slenk »

randomtwiddler wrote: post #104
autoexec wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You say "just" but the fact is that no matter where in the country you are, being an American citizen should guarantee a person certain rights, such as access to critical medical care, or not being forced to give birth to your rapist's child. Several states have already demonstrated that they don't want their population to have those rights and even before this women's lives were endangered by their attempts to close…

You can't have a right that is also a service. Services are based on voluntary exchange.

You should have the right to do what you want with your body. Yes vaccines too. And I am vaccinated
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