281–290 of 492 posts
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As I don't think Linux on an m1 Mac is going to be viable in the near term - I don't think it's all that relevant as a Linux workstation?
It does seem fairly usable already. I'd say it's going to be viable as a primary workstation sooner than later, but things like polished GPU drivers will take more time. There are other ARM machines as well, that run Linux more easily, but those aren't as high-performance yet.
Based on all the comments on HN about how great Thinkpads are supposed to be with Linux, I bought an X1-Extreme some time ago. From my experience, Linux support for Lenovo devices is terrible. ACPI, power management, and UEFI are consistently causing problems. Grub has an issue with the 4K display, causing it to render at about 1 FPS. The dual-GPU (Intel and nVidia) situation is unworkable under Linux. Suspend on lid…
> Suspend on lid close is unpredictable.
Yeah, same experience here. The worst part is I can't even figure out how to debug this stuff. No idea where things are going wrong. I've gotten as far as dumping ACPI tables and disassembling some of its code but I can't find anything relevant.
What is Windows doing that Linux isn't? It can't be so insanely difficult, can it?
> The dual-GPU (Intel and nVidia) situation is unworkable under Linux.
Yup. Gotta choose one of them, can't use hybrid graphics.
> The battery life under Linux is about half of what you can expect from Windows.
I think it's due to power management issues, especially the dGPU which can't be turned off due to lack of hybrid graphics. On my laptop I got great battery life after disabling the GPU in the firmware settings.
Also, pretty much everything is GPU accelerated nowadays. Even terminal emulators. Kitty for example will cause massive power usage spikes.
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Plastic is made from oil, and has limited recyclability (the polymers degrade so at best you only down cycle). Aluminum is one of the most abundant materials in the earth’s crust, and once refined is basically infinitely recyclable (or so the story goes). Aluminum is also reasonable light and strong, with good thermal properties (if your laptop chassis gets too hot, it has other design issues at this point IMO).
alluminium doesn't grow on trees either. plastic can be (almost) infinitely recycled for industrial use, it's food use that has limited recyclability. also: Macs are very hard to upgrade (sometimes it's impossible to) and become e-trash in a couple of years, while these "plastic" laptops can last a decade before being discarded as junk.
Plastic doesn't grow on trees either. Its production has huge impacts on the environment.
Aluminum is highly and easily recyclable. In fact Apple makes their MacBook enclosures from 100% recycled aluminum. No other computer manufacturer can make the same claim regarding the production of their plastic body notebooks.
The idea that plastic can be infinitely recycled is just that: an idea. The infrastructure for recycling plastic is far more complex than recycling aluminum, as well as essentially non-existent.
Apple computers have a history of having high resell values and long lifespans. You can see the evidence of that just by looking at eBay. And when they do eventually get tossed out that aluminum body can actually be recycled, where the same claim for plastic bodied notebooks cannot be factually made.
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Don't use Grub or any bootloader if you can avoid it. I haven't used Grub in 10 years. Load Linux directly as an EFI executable via the EFISTUB approach. You almost certainly only need to run two or three efibootmgr commands to accomplish this. For most people that means only the "Using UEFI directly" section is relevant. https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/EFISTUB S3 suspend was removed as a default option by many hard…
> Don't use Grub or any bootloader if you can avoid it. I haven't used Grub in 10 years. Load Linux directly as an EFI executable via the EFISTUB approach. I run Windows dual boot, since I need (native) Windows for certain work related tasks. > S3 suspend was removed as a default option by many hardware manufacturers. You will likely need to enter the BIOS to change this. It's on, S3 is not the problem > There is a b…
> I run Windows dual boot, since I need (native) Windows for certain work related tasks.
The windows/efi boot menu can handle dual boot.
But, assuming you want/need secure boot and bitlocker - I'm not sure if there is an easy way to avoid having to type in recovery key on kernel updates :/
Perhaps efi > direct windows and efi > grub > Linux might work? Probably still needs recovery key for bitlocker after grub update? Maybe this is solved now - I don't dual boot any machines w bitlocker right now.
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same. i just set up a P14s Gen 2 AMD (with 4k display, ryzen 7 pro 5850u, 48GB ram) and after swapping out the garbage wifi/bluetooth module for an Intel 210 and the NVME for a 980 Pro this machine is excellent with EndeavourOS/KDE (5.17 kernel with AMD p-state support). the only tweaks i've had to make are 1. enabling bluetooth service to autostart (disabled by default by distro for security) 2. installing the amdgp…
I'm touting everywhere how P14s Gen 2 AMD is the best laptop I ever had - performance, portability, silent, ports, battery, keyboard...Even compared to the MBP 14 I'm using now, I'm missing it, and Linux, while I doubt I would miss anything from MBP if I switched back, even though it's objectively great.
I haven't seen even a frankenpad option to transplant an OLED on the P14s Gen 2 AMD
Based on all the comments on HN about how great Thinkpads are supposed to be with Linux, I bought an X1-Extreme some time ago. From my experience, Linux support for Lenovo devices is terrible. ACPI, power management, and UEFI are consistently causing problems. Grub has an issue with the 4K display, causing it to render at about 1 FPS. The dual-GPU (Intel and nVidia) situation is unworkable under Linux. Suspend on lid…
Could not agree more. I was using mac's for a decade prior to buying thinkpad X1E a couple years ago. It's been an absolute disaster and I now loath them. Multiple years after purchase, the only distro I could find that even half works is Fedora.
Docking is worse, even under windows. So the dock was working under linux for a while but as a last week it's completely non-functional, no usb, no display. Under windows, probably 25% of the time the USB devices don't function on startup, and have to be unplugged and plugged back in. I was trying to run a monitor with hdmi and it would half the time not wake up. Switched to display port and it's a little better but still problematic. And if your computer goes to sleep, it's 5-10 minutes of trying to wake and often requires hard power cycle to come back. I had to set the computer to sleep only after 2 hour or so. This is with all firmware and os updates applied.
In the future, will be be selling these hot messes, and moving to a framework laptop. Doubtful I every buy another thinkpad, I have many fond memories of my first couple of IBM based thinkpads those were awesome machines.
I still wonder what could have been if IBM just kept the Thinkpad lines. Those IBM-designed Thinkpads were built like tanks. Industrial. Legendary keyboards. I really miss those machines. I had some of the best coding sessions on them and can’t help but think Thinkpads played a role in creating that experience.
One of my college seniors had one. It was such a beauty with that small yellow light bulb protruding from the top. Absolutely gorgeous experience. I used to want one so much, none of the laptops since have ever enticed me like that, the MacBooks I use since then are nothing compared to that. Computing was so much fun those days (rosy eyed fallacy likely).
> 7-9 hours of typing, browsing and some programming. > 3-4 hours of video/audio conferencing or other CPU intensive tasks. This is one of the primary reasons I can't even consider moving away from an M1 Mac. I used to love ThinkPads but not being able to use the machine for 10+ hours without charger is a dealbreaker in 2022.
say the only laptop that is viable in your opinion is the M1 mac without saying the only laptop that is viable in your opinion is the M1 mac.
seriously though, by those standards, there aren't many laptops that aren't 'dealbreakers'.
7-9 hours of use is actually pretty goog, judging by the broader market.
3-4 hours of intensive use is...arguably on the low end of battery life.
I find it rather peculiar that tech folks think a plastic laptop is good build quality considering what we have from Apple and others. I wish more linux laptops had the build quality and support of macbooks. This isn't a rant from an Apple fan, this is a rant from a laptop fan. ThinkPad's aren't good laptops despite what the guy with the pocket protector says. They are flimsy and feel cheap. They still have 20th cent…
Just for comparison consider fishing rods: - cheap: plastic - decent: aluminium - better: magnesium, carbon,... > they feel cheap You mean they don't feel heavy. Some people confuse that for cheap. Similarly macs look like good engineering, but ...
No. The 2011 MacBook Air was light but rigid. It is still used by my parents 11 years later.
The hinge is still perfect.
I still wonder what could have been if IBM just kept the Thinkpad lines. Those IBM-designed Thinkpads were built like tanks. Industrial. Legendary keyboards. I really miss those machines. I had some of the best coding sessions on them and can’t help but think Thinkpads played a role in creating that experience.
I don't know, I think they would've gone with cheaper and cheaper materials and ended up with pretty much what Lenovo has nowadays. Dell and HP also had great business machines. I'm particularly fond of the Elitebook 8530/8730 - built like tanks, easy to repair, good keyboards, and still so thin for the time (even today, they look and feel good). Quality went downhill ever since - newer models are still pretty good,…