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Bitcoin value falls from above $33 to below $3

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Re: Bitcoin value falls from above $33 to below $3

#91

Post by icebraining »

datasink wrote: post #82
tptacek wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How real is that? Like, I know the site exists, but how many people here know people who have successfully conducted commerce on it? How are they keeping themselves from being exposed?

My understanding is that the real risk is taken by the buyer. The seller can anonymously receive payment, then drop the drug envelope into a random postbox. On the buying end, regardless of Tor and Bitcoin, they still need to have it shipped to a real physical location.

The seller still has to trade the bitcoins for something (either buy something with them, or trade them for $).

Unless they only buy virtual goods, there's a trail to follow.

Re: Bitcoin value falls from above $33 to below $3

#92

Post by DiabloD3 »

VladRussian wrote: post #65
DiabloD3 wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Satoshi's white paper disproves everything you just said. Either your comment is out of ignorance or out of malice. Go read the white paper.

our reading of the same paper seems different (i mean if you did really read it). Well, don't believe me, check this out: http://gawker.com/5805928/the-underground-website-where-you-... "Jeff Garzik, a member of the Bitcoin core development team, says in an email that bitcoin is not as anonymous as the denizens of Silk Road would like to believe. He explains that because all Bitcoin transactions are recorded in a pub…

Thats a misinterpretation of what jgarzik said.

Basically, if the cops grab your box with your Bitcoin crypto keys on it, they know all of your transactions. This is why you need to encrypt your keys if you're doing something illegal.

tl;dr: Nothing ties you to your address but evidence not inside of the chain.

Re: Bitcoin value falls from above $33 to below $3

#93

Post by johnny22 »

Joakal wrote: post #9
rorrr wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Who gives a shit what some famous spammer says about crypto-currency? Plus, how do you ban something like this?

Forbid businesses from accepting the currency due to stability issues. Also use FUD terms such as "deflationary, the exchange rate changes so much, IRS may take a more active role in investigating sudden influx of cash".

how is calling bitcoin deflationary FUD?

Re: Bitcoin value falls from above $33 to below $3

#94

Post by icebraining »

VladRussian wrote: post #65
DiabloD3 wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Satoshi's white paper disproves everything you just said. Either your comment is out of ignorance or out of malice. Go read the white paper.

our reading of the same paper seems different (i mean if you did really read it). Well, don't believe me, check this out: http://gawker.com/5805928/the-underground-website-where-you-... "Jeff Garzik, a member of the Bitcoin core development team, says in an email that bitcoin is not as anonymous as the denizens of Silk Road would like to believe. He explains that because all Bitcoin transactions are recorded in a pub…

You don't even need "sophisticated techniques", you can follow the transactions in http://blockexplorer.com/

ALL transactions, including the receiver and sender addresses are public. They have to be, since the global bitcoin network has to verify and add them to the blockchain.

A full copy of a currency's block chain contains every transaction ever executed in the currency. With this information, one can find out how much value belonged to each address at any point in history.

https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Block_chain

Re: Bitcoin value falls from above $33 to below $3

#95

Post by lwat »

icebraining wrote: post #91
datasink wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My understanding is that the real risk is taken by the buyer. The seller can anonymously receive payment, then drop the drug envelope into a random postbox. On the buying end, regardless of Tor and Bitcoin, they still need to have it shipped to a real physical location.

The seller still has to trade the bitcoins for something (either buy something with them, or trade them for $). Unless they only buy virtual goods, there's a trail to follow.

The seller can easily buy virtual goods, like other e-currencies, and hide his trail that way.

Re: Bitcoin value falls from above $33 to below $3

#96

Post by icebraining »

johnny22 wrote: post #89
jerguismi wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's free market, everyone is free to buy and sell as they wish. It's not a scam since there is the same information to everyone. I'm pretty sure that the early adopters couldn't guess this year's rise in value, and couldn't guess the price drop either. While I believe in bitcoin or cryptocurrencies in the longterm, I'm still pretty sure that bitcoin value will stay very volatile in the coming years. The stability wi…

"It's not a scam since there is the same information to everyone." does this really make something not a scam? As far as i've seen, most people do have access to the information needed to prove something a scam. It doesns't mean they will both find it, and believe it.

In any scam, the scammer promises profits which (s)he knows are a lie. No such thing happens here.

A lottery isn't a scam, even though only a few actually get money out of it. It's just gambling, and so it Bitcoin.

Re: Bitcoin value falls from above $33 to below $3

#97

Post by icebraining »

dpark wrote: post #60
jerguismi wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, I guess that most startups are pyramid scams, since the founders (early adopters) end up controlling massive proportion of the total worth of the company.

If the startup founders create the company specifically to sell a worthless product to investors, then yeah, it's a scam. Also Bitcoin is not a company, any more than US Dollar is.

Only if they say they aren't worthless. Which in this case they don't.

Re: Bitcoin value falls from above $33 to below $3

#98

Post by corysama »

lurch00 wrote: post #19

Bitcoin is essentially a giant pyramid scam. The early adopters have cashed out long ago. As mining gets more and more difficult, less people will cling to the liquid currency. Why trade with a deprecating currency, anonymous or not? The fact that the exchange rate is below the cost of mining should be alarming for many reasons. I'd assume the creator/first adopters do not care, either way.

It is my understanding that Pyramid Scheme was an explicit, stated design feature of Bitcoin. Because the only value of the coins are in the network effects, there would otherwise be very little motivation for early adoption and the idea would have died on the vine. By giving a huge advantage to early movers, the whole system was kick-started.

I expect that the creator already considers the system a success. The goal was not to create an investment vehicle. It was to allow people all over the world to exchange value without corporate or government interference. $30/coin or $3/coin doesn't matter. Either way, it's working.

Re: Bitcoin value falls from above $33 to below $3

#99

Post by icebraining »

lwat wrote: post #95
icebraining wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The seller still has to trade the bitcoins for something (either buy something with them, or trade them for $). Unless they only buy virtual goods, there's a trail to follow.

The seller can easily buy virtual goods, like other e-currencies, and hide his trail that way.

Yes, that's what I said. But on the other hand, the BTC market is still very poor. Besides domains and hosting, what other virtual goods are there to buy?

Re: Bitcoin value falls from above $33 to below $3

#100

Post by adrianwaj »

kellyreid wrote: post #62

good thing I made a bunch of money by trading BC intra-day when it hit mainstream. seriously, did anyone expect this to be a "new paradigm"? it was a fun toy for financially-minded engineers and traders, but I can't say I'm surprised to hear that it's in free-fall. i wonder where the bottom is? Once it drops well below USD1.00, I think I'll buy a bunch on a cheap bet :)

I thought it'd be the new paradigm, but closed my bitcoin blog when I saw how terrible the client was and couldn't see it improving that much. Just waiting on bitcoin 2.0 from lessons learned.
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