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Ask HN: Companies hiring for a 4-day workweek?

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Re: Ask HN: Companies hiring for a 4-day workweek?

#21

Post by inglor »

thomasahle wrote: post #6

I like 4-day weeks, but what I would like even more is a month consecutive vacation a year. (Which is just 20-23 days off, rather than the ~50 Fridays every year.) This is pretty common places in Europe like France or Denmark (where you must take at least three weeks consecutive vacation.) Is this something any US companies are advertising?

At Microsoft Israel we have:

- 23 days off every year for everyone.

- 5 extra days off for COVID years (but doesn't accumulate between years)

- 18 days of (paid) sick leave (also for family)

- Lots of leaves for stuff like family sickness (1 month a year), bereavement (10 days), paternity (6 weeks), maternity (6 weeks) on top of the ones we get from the government (3.5 months parenting leave for example).

- 2 times a year where taking a holiday only costs half called roughly "office shushing" where you take 2 days but are away 5.

- Plenty of holidays etc, requirement to take at least of 5 days consecutive (so 10 days off with weekends) of vacation a year and it only accumulates up to one year's worth so you are required to use your PTO in practice.

After a long time, you also get a sabbatical which is pretty crazy to me in a tech company.

In practice you take few long vacations (e.g. 1 month off twice a year during the times of the hadmama where it "costs" half) and a bunch of short ones (long weekends).

This isn't based on level and you don't have to be a principal engineer to get these benefits it's just market competition - SW1s fresh out of college get the same amount of vacation.

Re: Ask HN: Companies hiring for a 4-day workweek?

#23

Post by id »

vkazanov wrote: post #14
thomasahle wrote: post #6

I like 4-day weeks, but what I would like even more is a month consecutive vacation a year. (Which is just 20-23 days off, rather than the ~50 Fridays every year.) This is pretty common places in Europe like France or Denmark (where you must take at least three weeks consecutive vacation.) Is this something any US companies are advertising?

At Bumble we have: - an unlimited PTO (you'd have to explain going beyond, say, 4 weeks, but otherwise working) - mandatory 2 payed weeks off (1 in December and 1 in Jun) - mostly remote using the "office-hub" model, only requiring presence when necessary - every 2 weeks there something we call a Focus Friday, when nobody can contact you and you are free to concentrate on things you want to work on. This covers all o…

>you'd have to explain going beyond, say, 4 weeks

This is less than the PTO mandated by law in many European countries. Hardly unlimited.

Re: Ask HN: Companies hiring for a 4-day workweek?

#25

Post by svacko »

Piktochart.com is working 4DWW plus national vacations - there are currently searching for a frontend dev https://piktochart.com/careers/#jobs .There are also other companies, like https://buffer.com/journey part of the people-first initiative https://peoplefirstjobs.com following the 4DWW.

Re: Ask HN: Companies hiring for a 4-day workweek?

#26

Post by xmprt »

sakarisson wrote: post #20
vkazanov wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At Bumble we have: - an unlimited PTO (you'd have to explain going beyond, say, 4 weeks, but otherwise working) - mandatory 2 payed weeks off (1 in December and 1 in Jun) - mostly remote using the "office-hub" model, only requiring presence when necessary - every 2 weeks there something we call a Focus Friday, when nobody can contact you and you are free to concentrate on things you want to work on. This covers all o…

I'm glad that you're happy with the system, but I'm not satisfied with your comment. In my personal experience, people with "unlimited vacation" tend to take less overall vacation than I do, on a mandatory vacation time per year. > (you'd have to explain going beyond, say, 4 weeks, but otherwise working) Unless "I'd like to take a 5-week vacation" isn't enough explanation in itself, it clearly isn't working. An emplo…

In my experience, the conversation goes like this:

Me: I'd like to take a 5-week vacation

Manager: Why?

Me: I haven't taken a long vacation in about year.

Manager: Sure thing. Approved.

This is what happens and it's better than dealing with accrued PTO where I have to keep track of the days off. I'm sure companies are doing this because they've done the math and see that on average people take less time off with UTO. But if you have a good team and good managers then it isn't difficult to take time off.

Additionally, in the accrued PTO case, if you end up taking 5 weeks straight with absolutely no justification and your manager isn't good then there's probably a chance at retaliation. In either case, it depends on your relation with your manager.

I do agree that mandatory vacation is probably the best however, it's extremely rare in America which is where the unlimited vacation trend has started.

Re: Ask HN: Companies hiring for a 4-day workweek?

#27

Post by nkmnz »

In Germany, employers with more than 15 employees cannot deny the request of an employee to work only part-time without a strong reason (e.g. the company cannot operate without you because you are the only employee with a specific license). That said, it’s difficult to be a remote employee vs. a remote freelancer because of taxes and insurance law.

Re: Ask HN: Companies hiring for a 4-day workweek?

#28

Post by xedrac »

sakarisson wrote: post #20
vkazanov wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At Bumble we have: - an unlimited PTO (you'd have to explain going beyond, say, 4 weeks, but otherwise working) - mandatory 2 payed weeks off (1 in December and 1 in Jun) - mostly remote using the "office-hub" model, only requiring presence when necessary - every 2 weeks there something we call a Focus Friday, when nobody can contact you and you are free to concentrate on things you want to work on. This covers all o…

I'm glad that you're happy with the system, but I'm not satisfied with your comment. In my personal experience, people with "unlimited vacation" tend to take less overall vacation than I do, on a mandatory vacation time per year. > (you'd have to explain going beyond, say, 4 weeks, but otherwise working) Unless "I'd like to take a 5-week vacation" isn't enough explanation in itself, it clearly isn't working. An emplo…

I dislike unlimited/untracked/open (whatever buzzword) PTO. I feel like I have to beg for time off, so I end up taking very little and burning out. Even when I'm sick, I feel like I have to justify why I cannot work. I guess it's better than the places that only give you two weeks vacation/sick leave. I'm having some serious Europe envy right now. They seem to take vacation time seriously.

Re: Ask HN: Companies hiring for a 4-day workweek?

#29

Post by nurettin »

inglor wrote: post #21
thomasahle wrote: post #6

I like 4-day weeks, but what I would like even more is a month consecutive vacation a year. (Which is just 20-23 days off, rather than the ~50 Fridays every year.) This is pretty common places in Europe like France or Denmark (where you must take at least three weeks consecutive vacation.) Is this something any US companies are advertising?

At Microsoft Israel we have: - 23 days off every year for everyone. - 5 extra days off for COVID years (but doesn't accumulate between years) - 18 days of (paid) sick leave (also for family) - Lots of leaves for stuff like family sickness (1 month a year), bereavement (10 days), paternity (6 weeks), maternity (6 weeks) on top of the ones we get from the government (3.5 months parenting leave for example). - 2 times a…

How do you get any work done?

Re: Ask HN: Companies hiring for a 4-day workweek?

#30

Post by kinow »

I've been doing 4 days per week here in New Zealand, but I asked it when being hired. Maybe check some companies with remote work if they'd be keen to hire you for 4 days per week too, maybe write in your cover letter or in an email when applying.
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