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Airbnb’s design to live and work anywhere

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Re: Airbnb’s design to live and work anywhere

#171

Post by vineyardmike »

peanuty1 wrote: post #148
muglug wrote: post #6

If this becomes the norm then it's the end of SF as a tech hub. A big move for a company paying the sorts of salaries it does.

It's not going to be the norm for a while. MAGA aka The Big 4 have all announced RTO plans for the majority of their workforce.

Amazon is absolutely not going back to office in a significant capacity. I thought Meta had a bifurcated work force where anyone could be remote?

And G employees won't tolerate the forcing to be in office even if a ton like it. It seems they're the ones always demanding more from the employer (someone has to!).

Re: Airbnb’s design to live and work anywhere

#172

Post by wfme »

ggm wrote: post #162

Somewhere in between a pay grade based on scarcity, and S.F. norms, and a pay grade based on Ross Perot's IBM model of "feed 'em peanuts and sack at will" is a happy medium. I don't personally think that US pay for work done in Bali as a non-dom is sustainable, but paying Indonesian rate for work towards US profit is just as unviable. Whats the happy medium?

Why is it any less sustainable than paying the same person living in the US?

Re: Airbnb’s design to live and work anywhere

#173

Post by cwilkes »

outcoldman wrote: post #64

I know some people are very excited about that, and some think that is going to be a new norm. I have not worked for the corps for at least 4-5 years, but before that I always assumed there are only small amount of people who can really work for company remotely. I definitely saw people calling that they are going to work from home, but saw very little work to be done that day. Which probably means that people used t…

“I saw very little work being done”

That’s an incentive problem not a “be in the office” problem. Or you’ve hired lazy bums. Or the work isn’t interesting enough.

If the people are screwing around then fire them. More than likely the job is dull or not challenging or not rewarding enough. That’s a call for the company to step up their game and bring in A level talent.

Or don’t and keep on getting the C team that’s only doing busy work as a boss is looking over their shoulder.

Re: Airbnb’s design to live and work anywhere

#174

Post by tfehring »

jimkleiber wrote: post #53

> While you’ll be responsible for getting proper work authorization, we’re actively partnering with local governments to make it easier for more people to travel and work around the world. Today, 20+ countries offer remote work visas, and more are in the works. While working from different locations isn’t possible for everyone, I hope everyone can benefit from this flexibility when the time is right. I think currentl…

I think a couple dozen countries offer digital nomad visas now, the ones I've looked into in detail just require you to be employed remotely by a company outside the country and earn at least a couple thousand USD per month.

Re: Airbnb’s design to live and work anywhere

#175

Post by sdoering »

hindsightbias wrote: post #127
vmception wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think a lot of founders and their friends are using the office as a replacement for a healthier separate social circle and social life that they lack (a lot of people lack that, and they do too), so for them they're really just hanging out and like the potential for “increased collaboration” for that reason

Whatever people think of Myers-Briggs, the three I’ve been involved with the managers were always the extroverts. So your choice is WFH micromanaging or keeping that seat in the cube warm.

I don't understand the dichiotomy you're setting up here.

> So your choice is WFH micromanaging or keeping that seat in the cube warm.

Can't WFH work without micromanagement?

At least I can say that I never felt more free than during the work from home phase in the pandemic.

Re: Airbnb’s design to live and work anywhere

#176

Post by nevermindiguess »

dinvlad wrote: post #87
carlivar wrote: post #71

I like that he specifically mentioned open floor plans. This is the number one reason why I don't want to return to the office. I kinda do want to go back. But I need my privacy and some quiet. I can't do the open floor plan ever again.

Can't agree more. Privacy of a small room but having people around when you _need_ them is the best of both worlds.

Start your own company. Get your “boss” office, and roam the staff shared office when you want. Problem solved. Don’t ask your employer to fulfill your capricious dreams.

Re: Airbnb’s design to live and work anywhere

#177

Post by sdoering »

asiachick wrote: post #133
vmception wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think a lot of founders and their friends are using the office as a replacement for a healthier separate social circle and social life that they lack (a lot of people lack that, and they do too), so for them they're really just hanging out and like the potential for “increased collaboration” for that reason

(1) Healthiest = great social circle at work that bleeds into social circle out of work (2) Less healthy = great social circle at work, separate great social circle outside of work (3) Even less healthy = no social circle at work (just a job), great social circle outside work (4) Worse = great social circle at work, no social circle outside of work (I never seen this situation. If you have a great social circle at wo…

Do you have any sources for these claims? Especially regarding (1). And why (2) is less healthy?

Re: Airbnb’s design to live and work anywhere

#178

Post by ggm »

wfme wrote: post #172
ggm wrote: post #162

Somewhere in between a pay grade based on scarcity, and S.F. norms, and a pay grade based on Ross Perot's IBM model of "feed 'em peanuts and sack at will" is a happy medium. I don't personally think that US pay for work done in Bali as a non-dom is sustainable, but paying Indonesian rate for work towards US profit is just as unviable. Whats the happy medium?

Why is it any less sustainable than paying the same person living in the US?

Because there typically is a cost/price function in this. If the cost of living isn't as high, then the company can sell more by reducing the price. To reduce the price they have to reduce the cost inputs. The risk for them, is somebody else working out the same brain awesome can be found cheaper, and removing the market under their feet.

I work in IT, and I know it would suck to be told "you're worth less because you pay less rent" but this actually is normal: The majors are already telling SF residents "take $10,000 to move to Austin but we pay you less" And the majors are already saying "stay in India and we'll hire you and pay you less" -So it is not like there isn't already real world downward pressure on pay.

(the context here is that I am paid way above local average for Australia and way below FAANG in the US, working in a not for profit)

I strongly believe in unions. Even with a union, pay isn't going to be uniform across a nation, or between nations to do the same role.

Musk is making Tesla in the US, Germany and China. I ask, non-rhetorically, which country do you think will wind up in the long term making more of the cars, and why? And, also non-rhetorically, why do you think "knowledge work" (which is what software is) is any different?

Re: Airbnb’s design to live and work anywhere

#179

Post by dmode »

vineyardmike wrote: post #171
peanuty1 wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not going to be the norm for a while. MAGA aka The Big 4 have all announced RTO plans for the majority of their workforce.

Amazon is absolutely not going back to office in a significant capacity. I thought Meta had a bifurcated work force where anyone could be remote? And G employees won't tolerate the forcing to be in office even if a ton like it. It seems they're the ones always demanding more from the employer (someone has to!).

My wife works in Amazon. Their org is going back next month

Re: Airbnb’s design to live and work anywhere

#180

Post by LesZedCB »

wolverine876 wrote: post #84
muglug wrote: post #6

If this becomes the norm then it's the end of SF as a tech hub. A big move for a company paying the sorts of salaries it does.

> it's the end of SF as a tech hub People love to predict this, they seek it. Perhaps it feels like pushing against some establishment (when it's serving another establishment). It's trendy now, which affects people who follow trends, but trends change fast. Talented people want to be around other talented people; smart, intellectually curious people want to live where there are great restaurants, arts, beauty, sophi…

oh yeah, i forgot you can't get any of those cultural artifacts in any other city
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