“Multiple personality disorder” probably doesn't exist • Hacker News Board

Re: “Multiple personality disorder” probably doesn't exist

#101

Post by moonchild » Sat, Apr 23, 2022, 10:56 PM UTC

pyuser583 wrote: post #100

pnathan wrote: post #46

I'm friends with someone who has clinical DID. It is, as near as I can tell, not induced by media, etc, but by extreme and profound trauma. > The people who have traditionally been treated for DID have suffered, greatly, and not in the cool arty time-to-dye-my-hair-again type of suffering common to social media performance, but actual, painful, pitiable suffering. Those patients who have been diagnosed in the past wi…

Someone very close to me had a serious mental illness. Nobody has any idea what the illness is. Different doctors give it different names. The same doctors give it different names. I eat the impression doctors are less worried about the “anatomy” of the illness, and more worried about finding a cure. If “take these anti-psychotics daily, get 8 hours of sleep a night, and meet weekly with a therapist” prevents symptom…

You seem to be implying that this is a bad thing.

Diagnoses and categorisations are all fake, and constructed. The only reason why it's interesting to diagnose is that we may notice similar treatments are helpful for people with similar diagnoses. Diagnosis isn't inherently useful; it's a means to an end.

Re: “Multiple personality disorder” probably doesn't exist

#102

Post by rob_c » Sat, Apr 23, 2022, 10:56 PM UTC

naravara wrote: post #67

rob_c wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Trying to replay a-politically (with the knowledge that nothing happens in a political vacuum in reality). It can be successfully argued that the political left have adopted the drama and status of victimhood in a way that hasn't been done before in mainstream politics and given the strong correlation between political affiliation and age I think it's a concerning edge to the topic of mental health, or perception the…

> It can be successfully argued that the political left have adopted the drama and status of victimhood in a way that hasn't been done before in mainstream politics It absolutely has. The martyr/persecution complex is a central elements of dominionist Christian politics.

I'm fairly sure most of the 'dominionist' christian politics was based on expansionist bigotry, i.e. "lets go beat god into the heathens" and "cold is gods way of telling us we need to burn more protestants".

The modern victimhood isn't based on hiding in attacks, priest holes or being afraid to show your face in public, it's being a screaming matyr to some slight, imagined or not, and demanding the same level of attention for everything from nasty words to really injustice against fellow humans.

Again, I'm not saying either situation is correct, why we can't move past this childish way of viewing the world saddens me, but there is a difference between true oppression and standing up in-front of a crowd and claiming to be oppressed. Yes I am actually using text-book definition of literal oppression here and not some imagined slight of someone against a large group of people who think differently. The latter is akin to me feeling oppressed because I can't find or import the right cheeses/food that I grew up with where I live due to market forces and economics, the former is being told I can't do it because of some prejudice or law. There is and always will be an important difference here.

Re: “Multiple personality disorder” probably doesn't exist

#103

Post by Trasmatta » Sat, Apr 23, 2022, 10:58 PM UTC

ComradePhil wrote: post #88

Trasmatta wrote: post #24

See also: Internal Family Systems. It's a form of therapy that considers all of us has having many different discrete "parts". I recently started IFS therapy and have been having success with it. I'm not sure how literally I take the "parts" (I think they may be much less "solid" and more transient than IFS claims), but it seems to be a really interesting and helpful way to approach your own mind. https://en.wikipedi…

Are you working with an IFS therapist or are you using Pete Gerlach's online self-help course? Has anyone had success with Pete Gerlach's course?

I'm working with an IFS therapist. I haven't used that course. I am also reading Jay Earley's "Self-Therapy" book in conjunction, and that's been helpful.

Re: “Multiple personality disorder” probably doesn't exist

#104

Post by throw_m239339 » Sat, Apr 23, 2022, 11:01 PM UTC

reilly3000 wrote: post #57

The phenomenon of mental illness & trauma-based clout is intriguing and I don’t really understand it. Certainly a conservative trope for the balance of my life has been one of victimhood, from the notion of a persecuted majority to the plight of small business ownership. If it’s a liberal trope to be victim of one’s genetic makeup and life experiences the logical conclusion is that one shouldn’t feel remorse for not…

> The phenomenon of mental illness & trauma-based clout is intriguing and I don’t really understand it.

Society right now likes to reward people who seek some form of victimhood, so it's no surprise people would fraudulently claim they are victims for internet brownie points, or donations... it's just an aspect of our ultra narcissistic society, tik tok driven.

Re: “Multiple personality disorder” probably doesn't exist

#105

Post by motoboi » Sat, Apr 23, 2022, 11:02 PM UTC

CactusOnFire wrote: post #93

pnathan wrote: post #46

I'm friends with someone who has clinical DID. It is, as near as I can tell, not induced by media, etc, but by extreme and profound trauma. > The people who have traditionally been treated for DID have suffered, greatly, and not in the cool arty time-to-dye-my-hair-again type of suffering common to social media performance, but actual, painful, pitiable suffering. Those patients who have been diagnosed in the past wi…

I dated someone who had it- was beaten heavily during their childhood formative years, and told me that the separation of identities was a means of coping. It seemed like an extreme emotional compartmentalization which left them with a fractured sense of self. Some people might say that they could have just been pulling an elaborate hoax on me from a year and a half. But the amount of acting it would have required ju…

Yeah. Think about years-of-sexual-abuse-and-physical-torture-by-a-relative trauma. Think about locked-in-a-basement-forced-to-eat-excrement trauma. Think about forced-for-years-to-rape-your-brother trauma.

This is the kind of thing that create severe DID cases.

Those things unfortunately exists and occur. Those people are not faking it.

Someone who never had a severe and long term trauma claiming to have DID? Completely different situation.

Re: “Multiple personality disorder” probably doesn't exist

#106

Post by colechristensen » Sat, Apr 23, 2022, 11:02 PM UTC

pyuser583 wrote: post #100

pnathan wrote: post #46

I'm friends with someone who has clinical DID. It is, as near as I can tell, not induced by media, etc, but by extreme and profound trauma. > The people who have traditionally been treated for DID have suffered, greatly, and not in the cool arty time-to-dye-my-hair-again type of suffering common to social media performance, but actual, painful, pitiable suffering. Those patients who have been diagnosed in the past wi…

Someone very close to me had a serious mental illness. Nobody has any idea what the illness is. Different doctors give it different names. The same doctors give it different names. I eat the impression doctors are less worried about the “anatomy” of the illness, and more worried about finding a cure. If “take these anti-psychotics daily, get 8 hours of sleep a night, and meet weekly with a therapist” prevents symptom…

Psychology diagnoses (i.e. DSM diagnoses) are mostly about being able to reliably diagnose and communicate between providers, billing, etc. They are very much not about concrete underlying causes but about the ability to decide what label to put on a person.

The usefulness of these diagnoses are rather low and treatment tends towards "throw shit at the wall until something sticks". There are lots of things to try for each cluster of symptoms in common and useful heuristics, but the plain truth is that psychology's top-down approach to identification and treatment of conditions has had limited success and will be (and has been) slowly replaced by bottom-up neuroscience approaches which are starting to reach the levels useful to psychological conditions.

Re: “Multiple personality disorder” probably doesn't exist

#107

Post by PaulDavisThe1st » Sat, Apr 23, 2022, 11:03 PM UTC

thelettere wrote: post #94

pnathan wrote: post #46

I'm friends with someone who has clinical DID. It is, as near as I can tell, not induced by media, etc, but by extreme and profound trauma. > The people who have traditionally been treated for DID have suffered, greatly, and not in the cool arty time-to-dye-my-hair-again type of suffering common to social media performance, but actual, painful, pitiable suffering. Those patients who have been diagnosed in the past wi…

Dude has exactly zero expertise in the field or experience with this population, and yet he makes these kinds of claims. And all based on an article or two he found. Pathetic. Almost every psychiatric diagnosis is problematic, and articles questioning any's validity can be dug up. Doesn't mean the emotional/cognitive/behavioral cluster does not exist. The link between trauma and disassociation is incontrovertible, an…

No matter what one might think of Freddie deBoer, it is worth being aware of his own experience with psychosis. While this is not the same thing as DID, it did give him relatively deep personal insight into aspects of serious psychiatric disorder:

https://freddiedeboer.substack.com/p/since-you-asked

There re still plenty of people who have a severe distaste for his writing, his political views and his behavior, and I think that's fine. However I think it's unfair to claim that this article is "all based on an article or two he found."

Re: “Multiple personality disorder” probably doesn't exist

#108

Post by majkinetor » Sat, Apr 23, 2022, 11:07 PM UTC

thelettere wrote: post #94

pnathan wrote: post #46

I'm friends with someone who has clinical DID. It is, as near as I can tell, not induced by media, etc, but by extreme and profound trauma. > The people who have traditionally been treated for DID have suffered, greatly, and not in the cool arty time-to-dye-my-hair-again type of suffering common to social media performance, but actual, painful, pitiable suffering. Those patients who have been diagnosed in the past wi…

Dude has exactly zero expertise in the field or experience with this population, and yet he makes these kinds of claims. And all based on an article or two he found. Pathetic. Almost every psychiatric diagnosis is problematic, and articles questioning any's validity can be dug up. Doesn't mean the emotional/cognitive/behavioral cluster does not exist. The link between trauma and disassociation is incontrovertible, an…

> Case reports of it across Western, Middle Eastern and Asian societies across the last 2 centuries show a remarkable degree of consistency in their reports of this

The same goes for vampires.

Re: “Multiple personality disorder” probably doesn't exist

#109

Post by PaulDavisThe1st » Sat, Apr 23, 2022, 11:09 PM UTC

meowface wrote: post #70

MaxLeiter wrote: post #18

I found the intro on multiple personality disorder and tiktok interesting, but the article is really about politics, which isn’t reflected in the title. I lost interest when he mentioned leftists

Fair reaction, but just as an FYI, Freddie deBoer is himself a prominent leftist blogger. So this is kind of an "intra-leftism" dispute. That arguably makes it a little less eye-rolling to read as one might find from a rightist critiquing the left, or vice versa.

There's a lot of gatekeeping over what counts a "genuine left-ism" and deBoer is probably one the people most subject to it over the last decade. He is routinely eviscerated for his views on many other clearly left-ish blogs etc. and generally not treated respectfully in such venues. Don't even consider bringing up his name or any of his writing on, for example, Lawyers Gun Money, unless you do not mind being ridiculed too.

So yeah, intra-leftism dispute is probably more applicable to deBoer than almost any other old-school-but-still-at-it blogged that I can think of.

Re: “Multiple personality disorder” probably doesn't exist

#110

Post by PaulDavisThe1st » Sat, Apr 23, 2022, 11:11 PM UTC

sampo wrote: post #72

johnny22 wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't say I've heard of "horny sentient planets"

I think it's a reference to the movie Guardians of the Galaxy 2.

That or a very, very elliptical reading of "Solaris"