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“Multiple personality disorder” probably doesn't exist

freddiedeboer.substack.com

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Re: “Multiple personality disorder” probably doesn't exist

#41

Post by sshine »

Trasmatta wrote: post #24

See also: Internal Family Systems. It's a form of therapy that considers all of us has having many different discrete "parts". I recently started IFS therapy and have been having success with it. I'm not sure how literally I take the "parts" (I think they may be much less "solid" and more transient than IFS claims), but it seems to be a really interesting and helpful way to approach your own mind. https://en.wikipedi…

I'll second this recommendation.

I personally interpret the "parts" quite literally, but what's most interesting is:

You can make most people say that "a part of them wants X, while another part of them wants Y" without having swollowed any metaphysics. It's like the ability to address the ambiguity of one's mind, without needing to admit that it is fundamentally fractured, is a language that many will eagerly adapt to.

And yes, IFS also makes the claim that "multiple personality disorder" isn't.

Here's a website that tries to explain what it's like to embrace the plurality of one's being:

https://morethanone.info/

Re: “Multiple personality disorder” probably doesn't exist

#42

Post by User23 »

What exactly does it mean for a mental condition to be real or not real? It’s often easy enough to determine if a physical phenomenon is actually occurring or illusion, but for a mental one? And while it’s tempting to make analogies from physical phenomena to mental ones, it’s not even wrong.

Re: “Multiple personality disorder” probably doesn't exist

#43

Post by cptcobalt »

Trasmatta wrote: post #24

See also: Internal Family Systems. It's a form of therapy that considers all of us has having many different discrete "parts". I recently started IFS therapy and have been having success with it. I'm not sure how literally I take the "parts" (I think they may be much less "solid" and more transient than IFS claims), but it seems to be a really interesting and helpful way to approach your own mind. https://en.wikipedi…

I've been in IFS therapy for a bit.

I agree have a similar experience as you, I think. I don't take the "parts" too literally—and it was deeply uncomfortable to think about myself that way in the first few sessions while working on, well, the presenting issues. I adjusted and got more comfortable with it over time, and just see it as an easier way to have more precise communication (and also some internal introspection) in the frame of therapy.

It feels like an applied irl Inside Out: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inside_Out_(2015_film)

Re: “Multiple personality disorder” probably doesn't exist

#44

Post by mjevans »

causality0 wrote: post #26

I think quite a few identity-centered mental illnesses might actually be particular delusions, and in some cases we may be grouping people subject to one mental abnormality with others who are under the delusion they have that abnormality. That could explain why certain subsets of people exhibit symptoms which don't match the normal presentation. For example, and anecdotally based on my personal experience, people un…

It would be extremely helpful for both groups if there were a test based on philological data that machines could measure. I am fearful of our medical technology and knowledge immaturity, that future generations might look back on as being as bad as leaches.

Both groups need help, but it might be very difficult to get each the correct help so they can live lives they are happy with.

Re: “Multiple personality disorder” probably doesn't exist

#45

Post by User23 »

ZeroGravitas wrote: post #19

When it all goes political at the end, what exactly does the author think happened in colleges. He uses the word 'woke' as if a horrible plague struck. Maybe, I'm just sheltered, and civilization did collapse at some point in the last decade, so can someone point to a summary of what people in his bubble think happened? > The specific way that lefties will dismiss this problem will be to say, hey, who cares, it’s jus…

It’s funny that you’re ruffling feathers stating the obvious. Also I infer from your username that you’re probably quite left leaning politically.

Re: “Multiple personality disorder” probably doesn't exist

#46

Post by pnathan »

I'm friends with someone who has clinical DID. It is, as near as I can tell, not induced by media, etc, but by extreme and profound trauma.

> The people who have traditionally been treated for DID have suffered, greatly, and not in the cool arty time-to-dye-my-hair-again type of suffering common to social media performance, but actual, painful, pitiable suffering. Those patients who have been diagnosed in the past with the disorder, by doctors, and who have spent years and years dealing with the consequences, are often truly debilitated people, whether the disorder itself is real or not. They require intense therapy, are often medicated with powerful drugs, and are frequently subject to long-term hospitalization. They tend to live broken and pain-filled lives, like most people with serious mental illness.

This is a relatively accurate description of their life. Clinical DID is not cute or something to parade in front of people you don't know.

I have extraordinarily little interest in open DID fora like Reddit, because these fora don't adequately encompass my friends' reality.

Re: “Multiple personality disorder” probably doesn't exist

#47

Post by pmoriarty »

Trasmatta wrote: post #24

See also: Internal Family Systems. It's a form of therapy that considers all of us has having many different discrete "parts". I recently started IFS therapy and have been having success with it. I'm not sure how literally I take the "parts" (I think they may be much less "solid" and more transient than IFS claims), but it seems to be a really interesting and helpful way to approach your own mind. https://en.wikipedi…

For a Jungian look at this see "Subpersonalities"[1] by John Rowan.

For a more recent take, see "Your Symphony of Selves"[2] by James Fadiman.

[1] - https://www.amazon.com/Subpersonalities-People-Inside-John-R...

[2] - https://www.amazon.com/Your-Symphony-Selves-Discover-Underst...

Re: “Multiple personality disorder” probably doesn't exist

#48

Post by swatcoder »

causality0 wrote: post #26

I think quite a few identity-centered mental illnesses might actually be particular delusions, and in some cases we may be grouping people subject to one mental abnormality with others who are under the delusion they have that abnormality. That could explain why certain subsets of people exhibit symptoms which don't match the normal presentation. For example, and anecdotally based on my personal experience, people un…

Alternately, some people face more than one tough challenge in their experience such that their “clinical” presentation is modulated in chaotic ways by all the other shit they deal with.

With all the championing of identifying as this or that, it’s easy to forget that identity is reductive and that whole, complicated, multifaceted people are involved.

It’s certainly true that there are people who chase delusions, identify with some struggle for attention or to feel included in a community, but your approach of evaluating their “clinical symptoms” (are you a clinician?) probably isn’t a very accurate way of spotting them. In fact, it’s just really hard to do altogether, let alone from an armchair.

Re: “Multiple personality disorder” probably doesn't exist

#49

Post by jollybean »

causality0 wrote: post #26

I think quite a few identity-centered mental illnesses might actually be particular delusions, and in some cases we may be grouping people subject to one mental abnormality with others who are under the delusion they have that abnormality. That could explain why certain subsets of people exhibit symptoms which don't match the normal presentation. For example, and anecdotally based on my personal experience, people un…

It's perfectly fair to talk bout this issues but I'll challenge a couple of those points:

- I overwhelmingly doubt the notion of some material group of 'fake transgender' people, fully going through transistion, and then 'overacting' their gender as some kind of evidence that they are under 'transgender delusion'.

It's frankly an outrageous statement - even though I'm sure you're just ruminating and don't mean ill - it's almost offensively uninformed.

If you spend 1 hour with a few trans people, that view would be dispelled pretty quickly.

- 'Transgender Delusion' is akin to saying 'gay delusion' and while there should be some space for 'straight talk' to the extent these things may exist, you can imagine what kind of reaction you'd get for calling people who self-identify as gay as 'just deluded'.

- Also problematic in your statement is the notion that 'trans' is a binary thing, often it's not. It's not M->F and F->M with people 'flipping' into other socially normative appearances and behaviours. It's everything in between.

- All of that said, I think it is fair to posit that because gender is softer issue int that most of us have probably more in common than separates by gender, and that it's clearly a bit of a spectrum ... some people have do have 'problems' with their gender identity, and though may not be 'deluded' ... definitely have issues with nailing it down. Combined with the assertive push for protecting identity expression, I think people revel in their confusion. Labels like 'genderqueer' make me think this is a possibility.

- There is a political aspect to this as much as people don't want their to be, and it's really easy for people to assume a 'moniker' as part of their public identity that really isn't part of their core identity. For example, there were agender people in the past of various kinds, more of a creative or artistic statement to 'reject' the notion of gender, less so a material identity.

- Multiple personality 'disorder' is outside the spectrum of gender etc. and the author is a bit off to make it so overtly political, but he's not wrong to point out that we have serious issues in culture with anything that speaks to the level of 'identity'.

Re: “Multiple personality disorder” probably doesn't exist

#50

Post by spython »

Trasmatta wrote: post #24

See also: Internal Family Systems. It's a form of therapy that considers all of us has having many different discrete "parts". I recently started IFS therapy and have been having success with it. I'm not sure how literally I take the "parts" (I think they may be much less "solid" and more transient than IFS claims), but it seems to be a really interesting and helpful way to approach your own mind. https://en.wikipedi…

I too have had good experience with IFS, and I think from the point of view of IFS the less 'solid' and more transient the parts are, the better. The traditional 'multiple personality disorder' are then excessively rigid parts that block each other.

I do enjoy asking my friends how old they feel just in the moment when they talk about something benign bothering them. Most of the time people are able to pinpoint the age from which they speak. E.g. they had a situation that reminded them of some injustice they experienced when they were 6, and so they traveled the affect bridge back to the behaviours and attitudes they had at 6. Of course a six year old can't solve it, but just remembering that they are older and more capable now can bring back the 'adult' parts that can find a solution.

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