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My upgrade to 25 Gbit/s Fiber To The Home

michael.stapelberg.ch

41–50 of 522 posts

Re: My upgrade to 25 Gbit/s Fiber To The Home

#41
post #33
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But what’s the value there? Even 4K high quality video is much less than 100mbps

why stream on demand if we have the bandwidth to just send the whole video in the first 100ms? this might actually save power; instead of back & forth back & forth with the service, we can transmitnthe whole thing & be done, the server can now go serve other people.

> why stream on demand if we have the bandwidth to just send the whole video in the first 100ms?

Probably the best argument would be that many/most? people don't watch the whole video.

Re: My upgrade to 25 Gbit/s Fiber To The Home

#43
post #5

Not convinced by the use case section. Very few servers will allow you a full 25gbit download, let alone anything more than a 1gbit (and often less). And if you own the server on the other end, that sort of bandwidth comes at a cost. I think beyond 1gbit, the benefit become super marginal and the hardware expensive.

If you run a large scale Plex server I could see the 25Gbps coming in handy. Most 4K movies (Native Blu-ray rips, not the low bitrate renditions you get on streaming services) run about 50-100Mbps. That would let you stream to 200+ people at once, and have overhead for other things.

Re: My upgrade to 25 Gbit/s Fiber To The Home

#44
post #32

I'm really unsure as to whether it's worth investing whatsoever in consumer grade fiber connections. My speeds are advertised as 1Gbits down and 100Mbits up. On speed tests, I get much higher downloads (~1.5Gbits per second). This might be because it's not capped properly, and I live in a place that they're still building houses in (I imagine that our "box" is not yet saturated). However, I rarely max that speed out…

I think it has to do with the routing and peering. I can get full speed on Steam, Origin, but not from Microsoft, for example.

I have gotten 800+ downloading games onto my xbox

Re: My upgrade to 25 Gbit/s Fiber To The Home

#45
I had 10gb internet on what was essentially a shared connection when I lived in Zürich.

That, along with a surplus server I literally housed in my shoe closet, gave me the firepower I needed to prototype out something that led to two research grants which now employ myself and a new PhD student.

We discount technological investments like this as being “too much” and “unpractical”, but we forget that, even if it only one person in a hundred or a thousand take advantage of them, the impact can be enough to launch careers or start businesses with sizeable positive externalities.

Re: My upgrade to 25 Gbit/s Fiber To The Home

#46
post #5

Not convinced by the use case section. Very few servers will allow you a full 25gbit download, let alone anything more than a 1gbit (and often less). And if you own the server on the other end, that sort of bandwidth comes at a cost. I think beyond 1gbit, the benefit become super marginal and the hardware expensive.

> I think beyond 1gbit, the benefit become super marginal and the hardware expensive

Is it expensive though? We spend how much of our lives online. How much do you think this all-spanning life upgrade costs? What is the price of never ever dealing with buffer-bloat? Take a guess.

I calculate it as a one time $356 cost plus labor. You might have paid more for your wifi system. 128 port 25gbe switches are around $20k ($156/port). Transcievers are under $100 and you need one on both ends. For a lot of already deployed fiber, this is a drop in replacement. This is absurdly cheap. Given how cheap this is it's an obvious & enthusiastic heck yes. Who wouldnt throw down $356 right now to get 25Gbe for life?

Cost gets a bit more complicated when it comes to the POPs & their uplink. Subscribers are going to be way oversubscribed even with some fairly expensive 100Gb uplinks. As you get further from an exchange the difficulty grows geometrically (because pops become.further hops away from the ix). Peering needs to be bigger too, as does transit (but ask whether the net volume of traffic grows elastically or not), which has costs. But I think we need to frame this question a bit better, of whether it's "worth" upgrading. Honestly costs are so low it doesnt make sense not to; the rest of the world is just milking us, bilking us, charging what the market will bear, protecting it's profit centers, and this company init7 is doing what makes financial sense for the consumer. Donwe need all that? Maybe maybe not. Should we settle for less? There's almost no financial case when the hardware is so so so very cheap. This tech sounds magical but 25Gbe is not exotic, not extreme technology; "the future is already here, it's just not evenly distributed yet".

Re: My upgrade to 25 Gbit/s Fiber To The Home

#47

On behalf of all tech-minded Americans, I would like to say... I hate you. I just got a notice in the mail that my ISP is "upgrading" their network so now I can pay $200 USD/month to get a whopping 2gbps, which I actually thought was pretty amazing until I read your post. So, thanks. In all seriousness, congrats! You made a good case for why one would need that much bandwidth. Also, we need to catch up here. :)

I'm in a rural city in Thailand, fiber 2Gbps is $50 / mo. And this is just for normie. Like unimpressive.

USA requires more raw materials to provide services. United States is about 19 times bigger than Thailand. Thailand is approximately 513,120 sq km, while United States is approximately 9,833,517 sq km, making United States 1,816% larger than Thailand. And then there is the duopoly of ISPs where they carve out huge chunks and agree not to compete.

Re: My upgrade to 25 Gbit/s Fiber To The Home

#48
post #5

Not convinced by the use case section. Very few servers will allow you a full 25gbit download, let alone anything more than a 1gbit (and often less). And if you own the server on the other end, that sort of bandwidth comes at a cost. I think beyond 1gbit, the benefit become super marginal and the hardware expensive.

It's just marketing at this point. It's a best effort service, and with the current tech the overselling is becoming crazy.

Re: My upgrade to 25 Gbit/s Fiber To The Home

#49
post #32

I'm really unsure as to whether it's worth investing whatsoever in consumer grade fiber connections. My speeds are advertised as 1Gbits down and 100Mbits up. On speed tests, I get much higher downloads (~1.5Gbits per second). This might be because it's not capped properly, and I live in a place that they're still building houses in (I imagine that our "box" is not yet saturated). However, I rarely max that speed out…

I think it has to do with the routing and peering. I can get full speed on Steam, Origin, but not from Microsoft, for example.

Microsoft’s CDN is awful. I’m in Chicago so my fiber connection literally terminates at an Akamai and Cloudflare edge. Steam, Apple, et al I routinely pull 100+ megabytes per second. Microsoft, I’m lucky if I get a third of that.

Re: My upgrade to 25 Gbit/s Fiber To The Home

#50
post #5

Not convinced by the use case section. Very few servers will allow you a full 25gbit download, let alone anything more than a 1gbit (and often less). And if you own the server on the other end, that sort of bandwidth comes at a cost. I think beyond 1gbit, the benefit become super marginal and the hardware expensive.

> Very few servers will allow you a full 25gbit download

As TFA mentions, same was the case with 1 gbit. I can confirm, I'm on the same ISP and was "early" to have 1gbit/s. Lots of servers still only had 100mbit/s links. These days I have zero issues saturating my 1gbit link.

Give it time, now that it starts rolling out, costs will come down and server links will be upgraded. The usual early adopter stuff.

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