Live data from Hacker News

Hiring discrimination: a problem for men in female-dominated occupations

journals.plos.org

331–340 of 666 posts

Re: Hiring discrimination: a problem for men in female-dominated occupations

#331

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are Che tshirts still cool? Maybe just one of those raised-fist tshirts. That's sufficiently distant from the Russian matter.

Che is great, especially if you can rock a beret.

Che tshirt, beret, plaid kilt, birkenstock sandals, and a few of those candy necklaces. This'll be my new look.

Re: Hiring discrimination: a problem for men in female-dominated occupations

#332

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These politics only appeal to ~10% of the population anyway, and they aren't favored by a majority of any ethnicity. This stuff isn't mainstream because voters like it (which is why it never makes its way into any real laws), it's mainstream because the cultural and media elites like it and they don't have to trifle with a democratic process to impose it. Corporate DEI stuff is also useful to "prove" that an employer…

Corporate DEI has laws backing it, but I don't think that's the full picture. Corporations have a genuine economic interest in diverse hiring even if those laws didn't exist: 1) Diverse hiring expands the labor pool, which suppresses wages. 2) Diverse labor organizes less effectively, particularly if the workers can be kept on edge around each other.

If anyone has seen Severance on Apple TV, the animosity fostered between the MDI and O&D departments is an excellent example of the strategy behind this last point.

“Management isn’t taking advantage of you; it’s the person sitting next to you with a different gender or skin color that’s the threat”

Re: Hiring discrimination: a problem for men in female-dominated occupations

#333

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These politics only appeal to ~10% of the population anyway, and they aren't favored by a majority of any ethnicity. This stuff isn't mainstream because voters like it (which is why it never makes its way into any real laws), it's mainstream because the cultural and media elites like it and they don't have to trifle with a democratic process to impose it. Corporate DEI stuff is also useful to "prove" that an employer…

Corporate DEI has laws backing it, but I don't think that's the full picture. Corporations have a genuine economic interest in diverse hiring even if those laws didn't exist: 1) Diverse hiring expands the labor pool, which suppresses wages. 2) Diverse labor organizes less effectively, particularly if the workers can be kept on edge around each other.

There are laws against certain types of discrimination. Corporate DEI is something else altogether (and if the anecdata elsewhere in this thread are to believed, run in direct opposition to some of those anti-discrimination laws).

Re: Hiring discrimination: a problem for men in female-dominated occupations

#334
The DEI movement started with good intentions and did a lot of good but in the long run dividing people along categorizes like gender or race is way too simplistic. For example I am white male but my life experience is probably more similar to a lot of black males vs people like Tim Cook or Elon Musk. And I have no connection to a white male that grew up in a poor mining town in West Virginia. If you want to define groups I think it makes way more sense to do that by income. A woman who makes 1 million will get more respect than a male who makes 20k. I feel we are changing the preferred groups from white males to other groups but in the end we aren’t creating more equality or inclusion. We are just shifting the in groups.

Re: Hiring discrimination: a problem for men in female-dominated occupations

#335
post #280

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> During my career, I've seen enough discrimination in the name of DEI as well. At my work recently, we interviewed a white male and an asian female for the job. To my knowledge, this is the first female applicant we've gotten because they generally get snapped up by higher prestige/visibility roles. I've interviewed many people before, and the manager will request feedback about the applicants and use whichever had…

Please let them know, but do so as anonymously as is possible. Consider an email from a proton burner address via VPN, printed letter mailed from somewhere other than where you live (maybe even from your office if there are no cameras). Depending on the size of the company, discovery during a lawsuit like this can get insanely detailed and expensive.

Honestly, it might not be a bad idea to make it easy to find him.

Yeah, the op might be punished, but if companies start to worry that employees are going to out them for their illegal behavior, they might change.

Re: Hiring discrimination: a problem for men in female-dominated occupations

#336
post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

After age 40 I did a coding bootcamp to change careers. Another guy in the camp was doing the same. We compared notes on interviews. One day he gets a call back from a recruiter and he put the recruiter on speaker phone. She told them they liked him but chose someone else because (drum roll) culture fit. He asked what she meant by that and she outright said: "The other person is younger. You're old." We were shocked…

I think due to the massive influx of people into this profession, the median age is still pretty low, but I think this will stabilize, and the age pyramid will look more even. As good, productive people will get older, recruiters will realize that people don't go senile at 40.

Eh, it's been this way since at least the 90's.

How long should anyone wait for clearly illegal behavior to start being not ok?

Re: Hiring discrimination: a problem for men in female-dominated occupations

#338
post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not the OP, but I'll bite. For many species, males have a higher standard deviation across a variety factors. There are biological reasons for this, since males are more disposable than females for reproduction. Think of one rooster for a dozen hens - this is still a viable flock, even if the other roosters get eaten. Nature can experiment more with males simply because the stakes are lower, and sometimes those e…

> There are biological reasons for this, since males are more disposable than females for reproduction. Think of one rooster for a dozen hens - this is still a viable flock, even if the other roosters get eaten. Note that birds do not have mammalian sex chromosomes - males have ZZ and females have ZW - and females have been measured to have greater variability in birds. So there is not really a biological reason as y…

I've not come across this before ("males have ZZ and females have ZW - and females have been measured to have greater variability in birds"). Do you have some references/books you can recommend? I'd like to find out more.

Re: Hiring discrimination: a problem for men in female-dominated occupations

#339

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The black family was only endangered because of those very same people who wrote all sorts of asinine rules for the social safety net programs that penalized stable households, penalized married couples and penalized above the table jobs. Were they poor? Sure. Were they marginalized? You bet. But the single mother, the child without a father figure and the idle black man were not serious issues, let alone stereotypes…

Seems like they purposefully created people now dependent on these government programs in order to secure electorate.

Those programs are given to people based on economic situations not race.

Re: Hiring discrimination: a problem for men in female-dominated occupations

#340
post #208
post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

After age 40 I did a coding bootcamp to change careers. Another guy in the camp was doing the same. We compared notes on interviews. One day he gets a call back from a recruiter and he put the recruiter on speaker phone. She told them they liked him but chose someone else because (drum roll) culture fit. He asked what she meant by that and she outright said: "The other person is younger. You're old." We were shocked…

Would be interesting to compare this across areas. My impression is that eg Finance (another popular destination for mid-career switches) is far more open in that regard. Experience, even if it's in a different field (as long as it's a technical role or one that will give you a rich set of contacts) seems to generally confer seniority. Would be interesting if someone could weigh in.

Anecdotally, the hard engineering fields (e.g., mechanical, civil, etc.) are much more tolerant about age and more receptive to the benefits and tradeoffs of both youth and, erm.., "experience"

(said tongue-in-cheek because age does not necessarily equate to experience)

Post reply on HN