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What chords do you need?

jefftk.com

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Re: What chords do you need?

#21

Post by drcongo »

drcongo wrote: post #20
bambax wrote: post #15

The obligatory video is of course "Four Chords" by Axis of Awesome: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5pidokakU4I Rick Beato has kind of the opposite video about "the most complex song ever": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZnRxTW8GxT8 The song in question is Never Gonna Let You Go by Sergio Mendes; plenty of videos exist of it; here's one live: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fOPh3bTglak

That Mendes song makes all sorts of twists and turns that your brain doesn't expect (want?) it to. Personally I find it deeply uncomfortable to listen to, it might as well be four songs playing at once.

I'm now watching the Rick Beato video about it and I'm so glad it's not just me whose brain recoils at the chord progressions. Thank you.

Re: What chords do you need?

#22

Post by calflegal »

Trouble with this sort of thing is the subjectivity of 'what chord is this?', taking into account inversions and the like. CMaj7 has C / E / G / B? Who says this isn't Emin6 with the 6th in the bass? It'll depend on the way it's heard and its context within the song, but many approaches can impact this sort of thing.

EDIT: I wrote this without carefully reading the article (oops!). Author does a great job with the "adjustments"...I suspect adjusting to relative minor covers a huge amount of these issues, and the author throws in mixolydian for good measure! There will always be edge cases, secondary dominants, modulations, blah blah blah, but I suspect adjusting to include relative minors handles the vast majority of popular music.

Re: What chords do you need?

#23

Post by edelans »

analog31 wrote: post #12

There's also a huge pile of chord charts published online for the jazz standards and the Great American Songbook, that would be interesting to analyze.

Can't resist mentioning that old joke : "A pop guitarist plays five chords for ten thousand people, a jazz guitarist plays ten thousand chords for five people"

Re: What chords do you need?

#24

Post by [deleted] »

calflegal wrote: post #22

Trouble with this sort of thing is the subjectivity of 'what chord is this?', taking into account inversions and the like. CMaj7 has C / E / G / B? Who says this isn't Emin6 with the 6th in the bass? It'll depend on the way it's heard and its context within the song, but many approaches can impact this sort of thing. EDIT: I wrote this without carefully reading the article (oops!). Author does a great job with the "a…

[deleted]

Re: What chords do you need?

#25

Post by photochemsyn »

I'd like to see this thinking applied to John Coltrane's Giant Steps:

https://perfectauthenticcadence.blogspot.com/2016/01/analyzi...

> "By creating this system of cyclical patterns, Coltrane changed the language of jazz and broke the mold of ordinary jazz harmonic progressions in jazz history. (Wernick 23). The use of “Coltrane changes” is still used by jazz composers today, and has become one of the most influential jazz compositional techniques of the last half-century."

Re: What chords do you need?

#26

Post by hejpadig »

drcongo wrote: post #20
bambax wrote: post #15

The obligatory video is of course "Four Chords" by Axis of Awesome: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5pidokakU4I Rick Beato has kind of the opposite video about "the most complex song ever": https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZnRxTW8GxT8 The song in question is Never Gonna Let You Go by Sergio Mendes; plenty of videos exist of it; here's one live: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fOPh3bTglak

That Mendes song makes all sorts of twists and turns that your brain doesn't expect (want?) it to. Personally I find it deeply uncomfortable to listen to, it might as well be four songs playing at once.

This kind of stuff is fascinating to me, that we can react so differently to music and specifically to various chord progressions. Of course personal taste is inscrutable in some sense, but could it also be about conditioning? E.g. if you listen a lot to certain types of jazz you might get used to some stranger chord movements. I have a lot of friends who cant stand Steely Dan progressions for example, though I love them myself. Here's an example of strange chord movements that I personally like a lot more than the Sergio Mendes song:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SXnUa6SNJFQ (Video showing the chords more clearly) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EPIaw-MgNzM (Original song)

Re: What chords do you need?

#27

Post by beardyw »

np_tedious wrote: post #6
omarhaneef wrote: post #3

I wonder how much the chord-space would shrink farther if you took out the bridge/intro where people tend to mix it up. And if you could adjust when the song shifts keys in the chorus and verse. (Although I didn't keep up with all the simplifications so maybe that is already in here).

Or last verse/chorus up-modulation

A loathsome practice which irritates me unreasonably.

Re: What chords do you need?

#28

Post by sharkbot »

By coincidence, Teenage Engineering is on the front page at the same time as this article. I’ve enjoyed playing and creating music on their pocket operator devices, specifically the PO-20 chip tune one. The sound palette is a bit limited, but the chord opens up a lot of opportunity for creativity, especially with a little bit of music theory to help.

Re: What chords do you need?

#29

Post by alar44 »

calflegal wrote: post #22

Trouble with this sort of thing is the subjectivity of 'what chord is this?', taking into account inversions and the like. CMaj7 has C / E / G / B? Who says this isn't Emin6 with the 6th in the bass? It'll depend on the way it's heard and its context within the song, but many approaches can impact this sort of thing. EDIT: I wrote this without carefully reading the article (oops!). Author does a great job with the "a…

Bingo. Sting had a quote that was something like "All chords are ambiguous until I decide on a bass note to play."

Re: What chords do you need?

#30

Post by jefftk »

omarhaneef wrote: post #3

I wonder how much the chord-space would shrink farther if you took out the bridge/intro where people tend to mix it up. And if you could adjust when the song shifts keys in the chorus and verse. (Although I didn't keep up with all the simplifications so maybe that is already in here).

> Although I didn't keep up with all the simplifications so maybe that is already in here

That one isn't there, because the original motivation of the post was trying to design a chord input system for an instrument. In which case I'm happy telling the instrument in advance "this next song is in Dm" but not changing that on the fly (hands are full)

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