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On anti-crypto toxicity

blog.mollywhite.net

541–550 of 734 posts

Re: On anti-crypto toxicity

#541

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because artists haven't generally backed themselves by weaponized ASICs and a very unhealthy social scene of greed and deception (not to mention pollution)

> Because artists haven't generally backed themselves [into a] very unhealthy social scene of greed and deception Except they absolutely have. The contemporary art market is exactly what you describe. There's sharks sitting in tanks of embalming fluid being sold for tens of millions of dollars just to be put in storage, and people laundering their money in art investment schemes. The contemporary art market is absolu…

>The contemporary art market is exactly what you describe.

Yes, there are strong parallels between the art market and the NFT market. The main one being that money laundering seems to be the primary purpose of both. But at least art does provide people with some level of subjective enjoyment beyond that.

Re: On anti-crypto toxicity

#542

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are basically saying "these GNU people only produce things that are interesting for people into software stuff. Don't give me a C compiler, give me Visicalc." It's not because this is not "real-life" enough for you that it means that it is not worthy of being done.

> You are basically saying "these GNU people only produce things that are interesting for people into software stuff. Don't give me a C compiler, give me Visicalc." Yes we are. Yes, we re saying that. Because Unix was announced outside Bell Labs in 1973, and VisiCalc's first release was in 1979. It wasn't released on Unix, but that's really beside the point. Two years later it was available for basically any consumer…

Visicalc was not free software. Unix is from the 70's, but Linux 1.0 is from 1994.

The point is not just in having an application, the point is in having an application created under the new paradigm.

Re: On anti-crypto toxicity

#543
post #452
post #46

I think toxicity from the anti-crypto crowd is basically inevitable at this point. It has been a decade of dumb claims and ridiculous assertions from the pro-crypto crowd. None of their claims have materially panned out. There's some promise in some places - mainly in the most nerdy corners of ETH, but it's still only promises. Meanwhile, this long protracted failure has been accompanied by a massive increase in stup…

BTC was the only way I was able to pay for hosting/domain for my non-commercial pet-project (~1,5 years of almost daily after hours development) after sanctions raised against the country I live in. This is my anecdotal experience (and no, I don't invest in crypto), but that's enough for me to not consider cryptocurrencies "just scum". P.S. Also I pay for VPN with it, because this is also the only way at the moment,…

Also, cryptocurrencies help Russians evade sanctions, that were put on them for genocide in Ukraine.

Re: On anti-crypto toxicity

#544

Unfortunately, given: "How can we create a more equitable financial system, where everyone has access to banking services? How can we reduce the power that a small few currently hold over the web? How can we improve data privacy and ensure that people have control over their personal information? How can we create reasonable privacy in the financial system? How can we make information more available to everyone? How…

Just to add a bit. This one: > How can we create a more equitable financial system, where everyone has access to banking services? Is a government mandate away. If you want it, got to the streets or call your representatives. In most countries, a simply executive decree is enough to get it.

In most countries, more equity would not benefit the ruling class. Do you have a political solution that accounts for this which I could suggest to my representative? Because absent one, a digital gold standard seems the least bad option to me.

Re: On anti-crypto toxicity

#545
post #411

Earlier quoted context omitted.

On the other hand, I had over time a few credit card disputes, and the existing system worked just fine.

My bank handles card disputes very well imo. Basically I can start the dispute via my banking app and based on your past history the bank will front you the refund while they wait out the dispute. Things like that happen when you have an intermediate handling the transaction, and personally for my day to day transactions I'm happy with using the existing banking system BUT the existing system does have flaws in my op…

US experiences come to me like from an alien world, most of the time. Zoning laws messing with cafes, banks kicking sex workers, and this is only from the last 5 minutes HN reads...

And back to the topic: yes banks deserve some stronger kicks and that can be achieved only through politics (aka, getting involved). Cryptids only shuffle the burden around a bit.

Re: On anti-crypto toxicity

#546

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If the government told you you're not a person, would that hold? Governments have always had the ability to dictate who is a citizen and who isn't. Someone born in Angola is not protected by or subject to the US Constitution. > To me your saying nothing's money unless the government says it is. Now you're learning! Granted in a democracy the people have a say in what governments do, so if you convince enough people…

> 1. Enough voters/lobbyists will be convinced of its viability that political changes are made to accept it as currency (unlikely, given the traits of bitcoin) One can dream > 2. An epic tax-evasion crackdown that will make the conviction of Al Capone look like a Cub Scout picnic. Monero FTW. Your response to governments dictating who's a person: > Governments have always had the ability to dictate who is a citizen…

> Monero FTW.

Monero makes things more difficult, not impossible. If the government decides to outlaw Monero then by definition it will only be used by outlaws, and so long as the majority of the population doesn't see trading in Monero as worth the risk, it will remain limited in scope.

> You're saying a non-citizen isn't a person? I find all your viewpoints defeatist. Maybe that or you still side with governments worldwide? If so, fine, but I don't.

All right, you define what a "person" is and how it's relevant to this discussion. For all practical matters a random person in Angola might as well not exist to the US government, unless the US government decides they're important enough to warrant attention.

I fail to see how the government not being able to deny my being a biological human is relevant here. And actually theoretically they could deny it and refuse to treat me as a person, it just wouldn't change the laws of physics. The Khmer Rouge in Cambodia were notorious for telling people they couldn't be starving because "we're all equal, so if we're not all starving how can you be starving?"

I also wouldn't call my views "defeatist", I'm just presenting uncomfortable truths that I've yet to hear a coherent strategy for tackling. Which can be summed up as: "How do you plan to handle the men with guns, and the authority to use them, who don't agree with you?"

> Do they though? In America, from a purely signals and systems perspective, my choice comes down to red or blue (1 or 0) on a number of representatives and measures I do get to vote on--that's ignoring possibly corrupt voting.

> In the myriad of complicated laws that are passed, and even wars that are fought, I don't get more say than a binary choice on abstractions (representatives)? In what way is that government ruled by the people!?

I'm not saying the system is not corrupt or that it's perfectly representative. No system is either. But changes do generally follow the will of the populace in the long term on issues that affect a given population as a whole. Just look at Marijuana legalization, or the fact that we did withdraw (albeit with criminal incompetence) from Afghanistan. Now whether those changes are objectively positive or negative is another story, the whole process is full of half-measures, short-term thinking, corruption and unsatisfying messes. And citizens don't have perfect power as they would in a direct democracy (for good reason, lots of issues there). But we've yet to figure out anything better than some variety of democracy, and I don't see how crypto solves any of these problems unless you think the government has already collapsed beyond the ability to enforce laws on crypto users (it hasn't, at least in the US).

You can either try to reform the system or replace it. Either way you need a solid plan for what comes after that accounts for the known variables, and I've yet to hear a "crypto will replace the dollar" argument that does so, from even a cursory reading of history.

Re: On anti-crypto toxicity

#547

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And I really still don't understand any use case for someone in a first world country to use crypto. Hi. Here is a use case you can carry on to future discussions. There is a flourishing scene of dark net markets where people can purchase drugs using cryptocurrency. Merchants have reviews, products have reviews, and the whole process is much safer, secure, and convenient than meeting a drug dealer in real life with…

Except (at least in the case of BTC) that transaction will be permanently recorded on an indelible blockchain for everyone to see. Such security and privacy.

Bitcoin Lighting Network and Monero ftw.

Bitcoin is not yet perfect. Hopefully someday. Monero however is pretty great privacy wise.

Re: On anti-crypto toxicity

#548
post #530
post #484

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is the money in your bank account a real store of value? Do you not notice what’s been happening to it at an accelerated pace over the last 30 years? I’m not arguing for bitcoin either way. But I implore you to take a hard look at your definition of real value in a system with inherent inflation that forces you to speculate in order to preserve any “real value.”

I feel that the value of my bank account has been far less relevant than (a) my salary and (b) my mortgage. And I suppose my pension, but since that's a government tax exempt deferred income mechanism it's not "mine" in quite the same way. It always feels strange talking to people for whom the hoard of cash is the important bit. For many people it would be far more useful to stabilize house prices - which are affecte…

I think this is because the hoard of cash is obviously useless today due to inflationary pressures.

Today you get a loan (if you can) to start a business.

It used to be you saved to start a business. But today savings is literally penalized.

This debt based system makes you depend upon it. I wouldn't need a home loan (or at least not such a large one) if the government didn't subsidize loans and cause inflation.

Re: On anti-crypto toxicity

#549

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Yes, the average Russian citizen is excluded from the rest of the world, and will bear the brunt of the impact. As they should, because they're the ones who mostly sat idly and allowed all of this to happen. I have zero sympathy for the average Russian whose inaction made them unable to purchase a new phone or car. What do you expect the average Russia to have done exactly? I’m curious what you would have done in t…

IMO we should do the opposite. We should bombard those countries with our shit. Our cheap services, our shows, our food, our way of life. Hire their engineers. Give them tech like Uber and crupto to create a nightmare for their control freak governors. Erode and drain their funds. Capture the hearts of their young. But instead Russians are listening to their government say "See I told you they hate us".

That's what has been done until now. Germany even had an explicit policy of economic interdependence to make a war unimaginable. You can see how well that worked, right?

Re: On anti-crypto toxicity

#550

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No. It's asking society to correct itself via legislation (we've done that before). It's slower and less sexy than new-tech and has a better track record.

> via legislation (we've done that before). it would be helpful to me if you could cite an example. i don't actually think this is true.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bank_regulation_in_the_United_...
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