Canada bans foreign home buyers for two years • Hacker News Board

Re: Canada bans foreign home buyers for two years

#561

Post by TimPC » Tue, Apr 19, 2022, 6:20 PM UTC

Ekaros wrote: post #298

RocketOne wrote: post #183

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The buyer's realtor is supposed to be working in the buyer's best interest and getting the lowest price possible. In reality it doesn't often work that way, especially when the buyer and seller realtors know each other. I just bought a house and both realtors ended up being from the same office, and are good friends. Do I honestly think I got the best price? Not likely.

Coming from country(Finland) where the buyer does not employ realtor the whole thing of buyer paying someone to get house feels weird. And seller's realtor really doesn't only care about price, but also about the speed they can sell the property, thus spending less time on it.

The buyer doesn't pay the representative. The seller pays for both agents. Having a buyer represented is generally a good thing even if there are problems. It improves access to the market and helps a person in deciding what houses they can realistically get. A big thing for my wife was that she didn't want to see a house we couldn't afford because of how it would alter her expectations and we couldn't figure out on our own which houses were listing enough below ask that we didn't have a chance at them. Our agent helped us filter houses so that we looked at houses we could end up in.

Re: Canada bans foreign home buyers for two years

#562

Post by gedy » Tue, Apr 19, 2022, 6:21 PM UTC

weeksie wrote: post #511

huevosabio wrote: post #493

These are boogieman policies that have zero influence on the root cause. Foreign investors jump into the housing market because the current system ensures that the supply of housing is limited so it is an attractive way to park your wealth. But that is not the root cause. The root cause is the system that is geared to keep houses always appreciating via supply constraints: aggressive zoning, discretionary permitting,…

It'll be interesting in a couple years when prices are still crazy and someone has to come up with an excuse for why. It's amazing to me how resistant people are to the idea that housing is expensive because there aren't enough homes for people to live in. It's always a search for exotic explanations like foreign buyers and mysterious empty apartments.

It's also amazing to me how resistant people are to the idea that housing is expensive because of near zero interest rates and tons of money being flooded into the economy.

Re: Canada bans foreign home buyers for two years

#563

Post by reedjosh » Tue, Apr 19, 2022, 6:21 PM UTC

vkou wrote: post #546

huevosabio wrote: post #493

These are boogieman policies that have zero influence on the root cause. Foreign investors jump into the housing market because the current system ensures that the supply of housing is limited so it is an attractive way to park your wealth. But that is not the root cause. The root cause is the system that is geared to keep houses always appreciating via supply constraints: aggressive zoning, discretionary permitting,…

> The root cause is the system that is geared to keep houses always appreciating via supply constraints: aggressive zoning, discretionary permitting, NIMBYism. You're conspicuously avoiding low interest rates and 30-year mortgages from that list. When people can borrow against their entire life's earnings to buy a home, the price of a home will trend towards that of a person's entire life's earnings. Limiting maximum…

> Limiting maximum mortgage terms to 9

Or at least not bolstering the mortgage market. Fannie and Freddie practically caused the extreme leverage mortgage phenom in the US.

Re: Canada bans foreign home buyers for two years

#564

Post by andrewmutz » Tue, Apr 19, 2022, 6:23 PM UTC

mpalczewski wrote: post #547

huevosabio wrote: post #493

These are boogieman policies that have zero influence on the root cause. Foreign investors jump into the housing market because the current system ensures that the supply of housing is limited so it is an attractive way to park your wealth. But that is not the root cause. The root cause is the system that is geared to keep houses always appreciating via supply constraints: aggressive zoning, discretionary permitting,…

In general I agree, that the root cause tends to be a supply constraint. Even if there were a bunch of people buying up houses, at least in theory that should make rents go down. However, in places like Vancouver people are buying up property as a place to park money and they remain unoccupied. Policies like additional taxes on unoccupied or secondary residences. Seem like one good way of adding supply.

If they buy properties as an investment, why not rent them out? If you dont want the hassle, there are property management companies that will handle everything for you.

Re: Canada bans foreign home buyers for two years

#565

Post by cosmiccrisp » Tue, Apr 19, 2022, 6:23 PM UTC

huevosabio wrote: post #493

These are boogieman policies that have zero influence on the root cause. Foreign investors jump into the housing market because the current system ensures that the supply of housing is limited so it is an attractive way to park your wealth. But that is not the root cause. The root cause is the system that is geared to keep houses always appreciating via supply constraints: aggressive zoning, discretionary permitting,…

>The root cause is the system that is geared to keep houses always appreciating via supply constraints: aggressive zoning, discretionary permitting, NIMBYism.

I don't agree that this is the root cause. The root cause is the artificial demand on housing created though our mass immigration policy. Canada accepts _at least_ 500,000 people per year through various channels, "temporary" foreign workers, international students (many of whom stay), refugees, and of course, normal immigration. And I am low balling that number. It could be closer to 1 million.

When you bring in an entire large city worth of people, it stands to reason that this will cause massive pressure on housing prices. Now sustain that yearly increase for decades, and you have the problem we face today.

There are 9 million people in Canada (a country of around 40M) currently living here on 10 year visa's. - Crazy!

So there you have it. How could you leave that completely out from your argument and only blame zoning laws and nimbyism?

Re: Canada bans foreign home buyers for two years

#566

Post by idiotsecant » Tue, Apr 19, 2022, 6:23 PM UTC

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #557

huevosabio wrote: post #493

These are boogieman policies that have zero influence on the root cause. Foreign investors jump into the housing market because the current system ensures that the supply of housing is limited so it is an attractive way to park your wealth. But that is not the root cause. The root cause is the system that is geared to keep houses always appreciating via supply constraints: aggressive zoning, discretionary permitting,…

We really should follow Japan on this: (a) National zoning (b) A culture that abhors second hand housing (so structures don't appreciate like land does). Housing that depreciates is no longer a sound investment. (c) Liberal definition on minimal standard housing to rent (central heating not required, toilets can be shared, no personal shower or even a shower at all in the building you are renting a room in, small spa…

In what sane universe is not requiring toilets and showers a solution to housing issues? I'm reasonably sure we can meet housing needs and still maintain basic human dignity.

Re: Canada bans foreign home buyers for two years

#567

Post by creato » Tue, Apr 19, 2022, 6:24 PM UTC

ejb999 wrote: post #450

rybosworld wrote: post #264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not unreasonable to want to protect your hard-earned money. Inflation forces people to invest in assets. We have reached a point where everything is overpriced (stocks, homes, etc.) and inflation is rampant. So unless you want to have less purchasing power than you did last year, you invest in what you think gives the best return. Placing the burden on the individual to "do the right thing" is scapegoating in th…

But this is the comment I was responding to: " I think it would be fine if my taxes were helping others to start out. " so that poster was saying having his taxes jacked up to help someone out is 'ok with them', and yet he has the power to help others out already - without the law forcing him/her to do it - he obviously thinks he can afford it, and is in favor of it - but he is not going to do it without the law requ…

No, it means everyone should do something, including himself. But not himself alone.

Re: Canada bans foreign home buyers for two years

#568

Post by 3pt14159 » Tue, Apr 19, 2022, 6:24 PM UTC

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #557

huevosabio wrote: post #493

These are boogieman policies that have zero influence on the root cause. Foreign investors jump into the housing market because the current system ensures that the supply of housing is limited so it is an attractive way to park your wealth. But that is not the root cause. The root cause is the system that is geared to keep houses always appreciating via supply constraints: aggressive zoning, discretionary permitting,…

We really should follow Japan on this: (a) National zoning (b) A culture that abhors second hand housing (so structures don't appreciate like land does). Housing that depreciates is no longer a sound investment. (c) Liberal definition on minimal standard housing to rent (central heating not required, toilets can be shared, no personal shower or even a shower at all in the building you are renting a room in, small spa…

Or we could, you know, intelligently tax property nationally and tie it to a national dividend that directly goes to landed immigrants and citizens in the form of a basic income. It will make sure that the poor and lower middle class don't get hosed and simultaneously make property a less attractive investment for foreigners or would-be mansion builders.

I don't want to live in the same place my whole life and I don't want every Canadian city to look and feel the same.

Re: Canada bans foreign home buyers for two years

#569

Post by andrewmutz » Tue, Apr 19, 2022, 6:24 PM UTC

johnnyanmac wrote: post #537

weeksie wrote: post #519

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can always build more dense housing on land that is in high demand. In fact, doing that is the most obvious and effective way to keep prices low for desirable locales. Backed up by pretty much all the economic research on the subject in the last decade.

>You can always build more dense housing on land that is in high demand. you CAN. But that takes a while. There's always something under construction in Califnornia and a good portion of that is trying to build more apartments and housing. The time to make those don't keep up with the influx of people emmigrating to LA or otherwise leaving the parents' homes to seek their own lifestyle. It's honestly a more feasible…

We dont have a shortage of dense housing because it takes to long to build

We have a shortage of dense housing because it is illegal to build dense housing in the places it should exist, and where it is legal, community review processes quickly shut it down

Re: Canada bans foreign home buyers for two years

#570

Post by hibikir » Tue, Apr 19, 2022, 6:24 PM UTC

dimitrios1 wrote: post #513

huevosabio wrote: post #493

These are boogieman policies that have zero influence on the root cause. Foreign investors jump into the housing market because the current system ensures that the supply of housing is limited so it is an attractive way to park your wealth. But that is not the root cause. The root cause is the system that is geared to keep houses always appreciating via supply constraints: aggressive zoning, discretionary permitting,…

The root cause of the supply constraint that ultimately gives real estate it's value is the land, and more specifically, the land being in a particular location . For example, a row of condos built right next to a major employer of the town, in the center of the city. That land is going to be valuable so long as that town exists, and as the population continues to grow, will only become more valuable. Adding more hou…

I think that most YIMBYs are arguing the opposite: That if I buy a piece of land, and I want to build a duplex in it, all the way to the property line, I should be able to do it. As it is, zoning and the approval processes make all kinds of viable projects impossible to do, by the property owners.

If I wanted to turn my single family house into a duplex, or just tear it down and build bigger, to far closer to the property line, I'd be completely unable to do so, because the zone is R1, the minimum offset to the edge of the property is enough to part 2 F-150s lined front to back. The maximum legal usable square footage, across all levels, of the house must not exceed 40% of the square footage of the lot. Most of my property must, by regulation, be lawn, and the taller I build, the more lawn I need. There's houses with this zoning structure right next door to supermarkets.

So how is asking to be allowed to redevelop your own lot being against private property ownership? If land is so plentiful nobody wants to build taller, the land will remain very low density. But the idea of having a lot that, if razed, would be worth a million dollars, but where building a duplex is illegal is not, in any way, going against private ownership.