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The Uber Bubble

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Re: The Uber Bubble

#351

Post by randyrand »

kanbara wrote: post #321
jmyeet wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't disagree with your points but let me give you some counterpoints: 1. Taxi services are balkanized; 2. Many tax services don't allow you to order a taxi ahead of time. You have to flag one down (eg NYC). For ordering a car, you need to otherwise deal with an (expensive) car service; 3. Uber made the payment process seamless and I cannot overstate how important this is as a user. I hate dealing with NYC yellow…

in europe there are many taxi companies that have started to do uber app features and prepayment and all the jazz that make uber so great. the main issues i have with uber are that it's now almost more expensive than taxis, there's almost no regulation, the drivers are taken advantage of / not making profit and also not getting proper benefits. just because taxis suck doesn't mean uber should replace them. government…

are you saying the drivers are too stupid to calculate they are making net money?

that’s quite the (insulting) claim!

Re: The Uber Bubble

#352

Post by Marazan »

chrischen wrote: post #299
cameronh90 wrote: post #118

Do people actually claim Uber is a successful business? In the UK, none of the original companies that built the railroads still exist. Many of the railway companies were never particularly profitable and the railway boom was a stock market bubble. Lots of them were fraudulent or poorly run. Eventually they all either went out of business, or amalgamated and ultimately got nationalised. Nevertheless, they proved the…

If Uber can’t turn a profit then how did cab companies (essentially Uber but with a worse product, no software efficiencies, and bad UX) turn a profit for over a century?

They charged more than the service cost to produce.

A shocking idea I know but there we got.

Re: The Uber Bubble

#353

Post by gunshai »

jlund-molfese wrote: post #167
inamberclad wrote: post #67

Uber as a business is a massive loss, but consumers still _chose_ Uber over taxis because the process of getting and riding in a car is a million times more transparent than a taxi ever was. You can see what car and what driver are picking you up, what route they're going to take, and how much it will cost. Taxis failed because they failed to modernize.

One of the nice things about ridesharing is that, at least in some cities, taxis have started modernizing. I've been using Curb in Philadelphia, and it's significantly cheaper when Uber/Lyft have surge pricing. Otherwise, it's usually a little more expensive, but the drivers are more reliable so it's sometimes worth paying a few extra bucks. I've had Uber drivers accept my ride, then drive away from me, refuse calls,…

That is really interesting/odd behavior. What is the gain from this?

Re: The Uber Bubble

#354

Post by amelius »

gruez wrote: post #189
amelius wrote: post #144

Why isn't it illegal to disrupt a market by undercutting the competition in a long-term structural way? What makes it worse is that money is pumped into it like a ponzi scheme (first investors cash, last investors are left with the bubble), which should be illegal in itself.

According to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dumping_(pricing_policy) , it only seems to be banned if you're doing it as a country. >What makes it worse is that money is pumped into it like a ponzi scheme (first investors cash, last investors are left with the bubble), which should be illegal in itself. IANAL, but part of what makes a ponzi scheme illegal is that there's deception involved (ie. you're taking money for…

> IANAL, but part of what makes a ponzi scheme illegal is that there's deception involved (ie. you're taking money for investors and saying that you'll use it to invest in the business, but really you're paying out yourself/other investors).

You're taking investor money, and inflate the bubble. And you prevent the bubble from popping by using the investor money to subsidize rides. Part of the deception is that the true price of a ride is higher in reality.

Re: The Uber Bubble

#355

Post by whitepaint »

arthurofbabylon wrote: post #268

When traveling in India, I foolishly took a cycle rickshaw. It was gross/shameful. A man far less fortunate than I was sweating, working hard, barely getting paid, and breathing horribly polluted New Delhi air while I just sat there. When Uber started to squeeze its drivers, I again felt just like this. I hated hearing drivers complain about their life problems. I hated doing the math and seeing how little these peop…

Just make a tip. Problem solved.

Re: The Uber Bubble

#356

Post by fwr »

gunshai wrote: post #353
jlund-molfese wrote: post #167

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of the nice things about ridesharing is that, at least in some cities, taxis have started modernizing. I've been using Curb in Philadelphia, and it's significantly cheaper when Uber/Lyft have surge pricing. Otherwise, it's usually a little more expensive, but the drivers are more reliable so it's sometimes worth paying a few extra bucks. I've had Uber drivers accept my ride, then drive away from me, refuse calls,…

That is really interesting/odd behavior. What is the gain from this?

The driver is most likely on multiple apps, and is doing rides there while the Uber one stays open so he can accept the cancellation fee when somebody less devoted than the parent commenter gets frustrated enough

Re: The Uber Bubble

#357

Post by samastur »

randyrand wrote: post #351
kanbara wrote: post #321

Earlier quoted context omitted.

in europe there are many taxi companies that have started to do uber app features and prepayment and all the jazz that make uber so great. the main issues i have with uber are that it's now almost more expensive than taxis, there's almost no regulation, the drivers are taken advantage of / not making profit and also not getting proper benefits. just because taxis suck doesn't mean uber should replace them. government…

are you saying the drivers are too stupid to calculate they are making net money? that’s quite the (insulting) claim!

That's not what kanbara said.

Most people are bad at calculating financial implications of decisions before them. There are lots of reasons for this (limited finance/math knowledge, impenetrable language in which conditions are layed out...) or actually don't have better options so they can literally be taken advantage of. Some may be even stupid, but there's no need or reason to reach for that as an explanation.

Re: The Uber Bubble

#358

Post by prmoustache »

xapata wrote: post #311
westcort wrote: post #35

My key takeaways: 1. Uber is actually a higher cost/less efficient producer of urban car services than the taxi companies it has driven out of business 2. Individual Uber drivers with limited capital cannot acquire, finance, maintain and insure vehicles more economically than Yellow Cab 3. Expenses other than drivers, vehicles, and fuel account for 15 percent of traditional taxi costs but Uber charges drivers 25-30 p…

In some countries, taxis are so often criminal that tourists are warned to avoid them. In some less extreme places, drivers simply never use the meter and the passengers must negotiate every ride. Uber and its competitors have been wonderful for hailing rides in these places.

Apparently in Mexico it used to be the case 5years ago but nowadays you can't rely on Uber either anymore if you are a woman and you don't want to just be a dead raped corpse the next morning.

Source: mexican gf and her family still living there.

Not sure if the issue comes from Uber not giving out drivers info, drivers blaming someone borrowed their car but not disclosing identity of supposed borrower or police not even asking but it seems to be the true reality.

Also a quick google search shows there are occurences of this in the USA as well. The fact the driver may be charged and found guilty after that sadly do not prevent the crime from happening in the first place.

Re: The Uber Bubble

#359

Post by cjbgkagh »

shostack wrote: post #312
omegalulw wrote: post #240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Taxis died because it's a horrible user experience that was propped up by a government-enforced monopoly. This cannot be understated. Also, as an introvert, negotiating with drivers, especially those that don't drive by the meter was always stressful, I mostly ended up overpaying.

"credit card machine is broken." Things I don't ever have to hear or put up with ever again #623.

Definitely agree.

Nowadays I have Uber drivers sit around the corner refusing to show up and calling me to tell me I should cancel so that I have to pay the $5 fine. Sure I can contact support to get that $5 back but it has happened to me so many times there really should be a button for it. It’s hard for me to believe Uber is not aware of this behavior.

Re: The Uber Bubble

#360

Post by danjc »

theonlybutlet wrote: post #194

It depends, in South Africa Uber basically created the personal taxi market all by itself, prior to Uber very very few people utilised personal taxi's. The big selling point being safety with car and driver being vetted. Edit: Without a doubt many of my friends and family would have never have stepped foot in a personal taxi in their lives prior to the advent of Uber.

You’re right but I’m not sure it’s going to last. Also in SA having spent a year out of the country. The condition of the cars is worrying. I think many of the drivers initially bought/financed new cars and now that they’re out of service plan they don’t prioritize maintaining them at the same level.
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