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A drug that cures alcoholism may be the next anti-anxiety medication

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Re: A drug that cures alcoholism may be the next anti-anxiety medication

#72
post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

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Yes, there’s a protocol and it’s called the alcohol withdrawal scale. Advocating for people to switch from alcohol to xanax to quit drinking… this is utter madness and I strongly advise anyone who reads this to completely disregard this advice.

> Advocating for people to switch from alcohol to xanax to quit drinking… this is utter madness and I strongly advise anyone who reads this to completely disregard this advice.

Yeah, absolutely.

This recently happened to someone I knew who was addicted to alcohol, 9 months later they died from a combo of alcohol, Xanax and Fentanyl.

Let me preface this with I'm not a doctor, I also never tried Xanax / Fentanyl and I don't "really" drink alcohol. The air quotes mean I drink about a handful of beers a year at assorted family events and occasionally when socializing. I'm not saying that to brag or be like "look at me, I'm above that!", I just want to paint the picture here that I don't have first hand experience on how easily it is to get addicted to this stuff, know what it feels like or how hard it must be to quit.

Anyways, here's 1 potential formula for how someone ends up dying after being prescribed Xanax when a doctor knows the patient has addictive behaviors and drinks a lot:

1. They're addicted to alcohol to the point where they feel compelled to drink very often. Not just a beer a day, but more like lots and lots of Vodka.

2. They try going to rehab multiple times and it fails every time within a month or 2 after returning.

3. They get prescribed Xanax by a doctor.

4. They have an addictive personality in general and get addicted to Xanax.

5. This helps for a brief amount of time (weeks or months perhaps).

6. They end up drinking again.

7. They very quickly discover drinking while taking Xanax has a whole new effect.

8. They run out of prescribed Xanax.

9. They attempt to find it on the street and do.

10. They enter a world of street drugs and now Xanax turns into Xanax plus Fentanyl (intentional or not, I don't know how it becomes laced, etc.).

11. They do this combo for a bit and one day they go-to sleep and never wake up from heart failure.

The question I ask myself all the time now is if step 3 didn't happen, would the outcome have been the same? My gut tells me no way, being introduced to Xanax started the chain of events that lead to death.

Re: A drug that cures alcoholism may be the next anti-anxiety medication

#73
post #25

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One anecdote to another: Naltrexone isn't all that different from what you're describing Disulfiram as here - it's an opiod blocker so when you drink you get the poison and not the happy chemicals. That doesn't help with addiction, it's subjecting yourself to negative effects / conditioning for drinking. Naltrexone doesn't work for me. It is not very effective for some people.

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I knew a guy who swapped his World of Warcraft addiction with heroin. It worked surprisingly well, he never played WoW again. Last time I saw him, he tried 'borrowing' some money from me for 'medicine for his mom'.

Re: A drug that cures alcoholism may be the next anti-anxiety medication

#74

Tips on how to read a science paper like this that involves mice or rats and makes lots of implicit and explicit bd claims about relevance to humans: (from of a card carrying neurogeneticist who uses mice and rats to study the biology and treatment of human diseases, specifically alcoholism and substance use disorders) Step 1: Go to Methods section of the paper and check the SEX, AGE, and TYPE(s) of mice or rats that…

Thank you.

This kind of easy to follow step-by-step breakdown of the method section should be included as an obligatory abstract of its own if one really is willing about improving the readability for people outside of the field. It actually takes a lot of time (most people don't have) in identifying all the technical terms and then to recognize what their actual experiments/basis were so that one can actually follow their arguments.

Re: A drug that cures alcoholism may be the next anti-anxiety medication

#75
I still worry about these types of drugs and their threat towards the human condition.

Whether we create a "Soma" type drug from Brave New World which in little doses provides enough pleasure to forget our painful addictions, are we actually solving problems or simply inhibiting them so long as the drug is used? Does this now create a new dependency on another drug that can lead to other life ruin?

I'm a firm believer in the duality of the world. The pain we go through in terms of alcoholism/anxiety can be life's cruel way of teaching us. In other words, the pain doesn't leave until it's done teaching you(in one way or the other). Having friends and family who coped with alcohol and are extremely anxious, you can see it as both the best and worst thing that has happened to them.

To make real change away from alcoholism or anxiety, there's much more work than simply inhibiting the pain or providing more pleasure outweighing it. I believe this is more alongside the self and understanding one's purpose as both of these things are typically "symptoms" of the bigger human condition problem.

Re: A drug that cures alcoholism may be the next anti-anxiety medication

#76
post #66

Phenylethylamine works somewhat like that: take 2-3g and don't drink. If you do, you'll heavily regret it as it will fuck up your blood pressure to the point of getting all red and passing out. Not safe at all, but it did work for me for a while. Quitting out of fear can work. A better alternative to treating alcoholism and anxiety are gabapentinoids and gabaergics. There are a few of them, and indeed Gabapentin has…

Informative post, but I have one minor correction:

Gabapentin(and pregabalin), while a GABA analogue, doesn't actually interact with GABA receptors og GABA itself at all. It acts on voltage-gated calcium channels, which is in part similar to the downstream signalling effects of GABA, and hence gives the effects you describe.

Re: A drug that cures alcoholism may be the next anti-anxiety medication

#77

I still worry about these types of drugs and their threat towards the human condition. Whether we create a "Soma" type drug from Brave New World which in little doses provides enough pleasure to forget our painful addictions, are we actually solving problems or simply inhibiting them so long as the drug is used? Does this now create a new dependency on another drug that can lead to other life ruin? I'm a firm believe…

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Re: A drug that cures alcoholism may be the next anti-anxiety medication

#78
My Dad was not an alcoholic but he had anxiety due to a long illness. Anxiety is terrifying to the person who has it but also to those around them. It starts silently and even people close to them may not even notice.

Looking back when I was with my Dad little things now stand out more quirks as to why small things now upset him. As Dad's illness got worse I could see the anxiety but still I wasn't sure what I was seeing. My Dad a blue collar worker arms the size of my legs, impervious to anything, stoic. But to see the affects of anxiety on him was terrifying.

Thank god for these types of drugs it made my Dad's life bearable. It's not perfect but living in terror versus being a bit drowsy is the better choice. I wouldn't wish anxiety on my worst enemy.

Re: A drug that cures alcoholism may be the next anti-anxiety medication

#80
post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm currently on a naltrexone/wellbutrin combo. I started it to try to finally end an infinite binge/purge cycle I find myself stuck in (an eating disorder). I also have depression/insomnia and had been self-medicating with alcohol (really, I just drank to relax -> drank to fall asleep -> didn't fall asleep -> drank more). I wouldn't say it was a lot compared to what you think of when you think of an alcoholic but it…

Probably good to have an alert bracelet, but if you were undergoing emergency surgery, the anesthetist would monitor close enough to know something is off and respond appropriately.

How? By upping the pain medication?
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