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Ethereum Has Issues

blog.dshr.org

351–360 of 377 posts

Re: Ethereum Has Issues

#351
post #332
post #302

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I can't even understand half of what's being said here. I can't imagine the debanked using any of those things, as the evangelists keep promising.

Do you understand how a spark plug works or how a hardware interrupt works within the Linux kernel? I don’t, but people who have specialized in those specific disciplines and spent their time thinking about how these things work have lead to usable cars and usable/better operating systems as a result. USB is a spec that I don’t care how it works, just that it does. I think crypto concepts like BFT, MEV, consensus, et…

None of this is important in my quest to buy a hot dog. I can't replace money with something that makes zero sense to me as a user of money.

Sure, it's technically cool, but it's not the currency it pretends to be.

Re: Ethereum Has Issues

#352
post #340

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Dude, defrauding Chainlink even once would probably cost you trillions of dollars - if not more. Have you read the super-linear staking section in the white paper?

You have the burden of proof, doubly so considering Chainlink has no working product which lives up to its promise. Not saying it’s impossible, but you shouting out a number and some terminology just makes it seem like you are emotionally invested in addition to financially.

First of all, I'm neither invested in ChainLink nor ETH. I'm interested in working on oracles.

Secondly, this is an informal discussion on a mainstream forum - one which is pretty strongly against crypto. So forgive me for not being super keen on writing PhD-level responses

The current white paper mentions that for a briber with at most `$d*(n^2 + n)/2`, where n is the number of oracle nodes, there exists a subgame perfect equilibrium for bribers to not issue the bribe and nodes to behave honestly. I can't seem to find a formal proof though.

If you bother to check the listed examples in the white paper, my hand-wavey "trillions of dollars" estimate wouldn't be even that far off, assuming wider adoption of Chainlink.

Re: Ethereum Has Issues

#353

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>and it neither invalidates the original proposed solution nor lessens its usefulness Yes, you're right that by itself it doesn't invalidate the proposed solution. Aside from that, blockchains are still useless and that's what invalidates it. They don't do anything meaningful. Any blockchain-based solution is useful in spite of the blockchain, not because of it. I've never seen any use of blockchains to disprove this…

I am pretty anti-crypto generally but I feel compelled to reply to your maximalist position that there is "no practical value whatsoever, current or potential" to blockchains. The one use case I have seen for blockchain that is real is that cryptocurrency is great for moving money around the world when governments or banks maybe don't want you to do so. At the very least the experience of sending crypto is about as a…

>The one use case I have seen for blockchain that is real is that cryptocurrency is great for moving money around the world when governments or banks maybe don't want you to do so.

No it isn't. You don't need blockchains to create illegal banks and exchanges or to launder money. All of that was around for a long time before blockchains. You could even create those things "as a service" without blockchains, it would be just as shady and illegal. I'm serious here, there is absolutely no practical value to blockchains whatsoever.

Re: Ethereum Has Issues

#354
post #255

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Your link does not support your claim. Crops are watered with non-potable water and it's not regulated. Any farmer can water their crops and sell them on the side of the road without any interference from the EPA.

The claim I’m making isn’t that you can’t use non-potable water. It’s that the water quality is regulated (see https://www.accessdata.fda.gov/scripts/cdrh/cfdocs/cfcfr/CFR... ) and you can’t fertilize crops with raw human sewage ( https://www.accessdata.fda.gov/scripts/cdrh/cfdocs/cfcfr/CFR... ), both of which are true (with certain exceptions). I find it is useful to try to disprove your own beliefs before confident…

Many farmers in my state water from rivers on their land that aren't even large enough to get EPA attention let alone direct regulation. I think you're under the impression everyone with a vegetable stand is Cargill or something.

Re: Ethereum Has Issues

#355
post #335

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>It does add additional transparency to financial markets though No, not really. This comment is more crypto myth-building. There's nothing technical about blockchains that adds transparency. Any company that wants to publish all its financial statements publicly can technically already do so and could always do so. They don't for many reasons, the most important ones being that customers overwhelmingly want financia…

1. Saying that transparency isn’t desired does not refuse his point. Not only that but the off topic declaration where you imply privacy is impossible on blockchain is incorrect. 2. Miners and block verifiers are not middle men. They have negligible control where as a middle man has full control. 3. The verifiably of smart contracts is not exceptional for its own sake, but for the fact that it prevents cheating in a…

>Saying that transparency isn’t desired does not refuse his point.

That's not what I was saying, at all.

>Not only that but the off topic declaration where you imply privacy is impossible on blockchain is incorrect.

Please do not argue straw men. I never implied privacy is impossible. I know about things like privacycoins. Some have even been mentioned in this comment chain. My actual implication here is that blockchains cannot promise either privacy or transparency. Those who want to use mixers and privacycoins will do so and you won't have any transparency into their activities. Those who want to insist you use KYC exchanges and traceable coins will do so and you won't be able to have privacy there if you want to transact with them. So basically, an ordinary person has no control over how much transparency or privacy there actually is on the network. Unless you have an outsized level of control on the network (and therefore the network is not decentralized) then you're completely dependent on the other more powerful party. So basically blockchains are providing nothing of value here compared to an ordinary financial service.

>2. Miners and block verifiers are not middle men. They have negligible control where as a middle man has full control.

No, they have full control. Like actual full control over the network. Individually they don't, but as a whole they do, that's literally how the network functions.

>3. The verifiably of smart contracts is not exceptional for its own sake, but for the fact that it prevents cheating in a system where cheating is heavily incentivized.

No, this is wrong. Verifying a smart contract does not prevent cheating. Even if you verify that the smart contract technically has no bugs, it could still do the wrong thing, or the other party could just commit good old-fashioned normal fraud and never hold up their end of the bargain. Smart contracts are not actually smart not are they contracts.

>4. Auditing smart contracts will generally be much easier than auditing EVM bytecode. Ethereum isn’t the only game in town and the most sophisticated layer 1 smart contract languages converge toward functional, locked down languages which lend themselves to automated and manual auditing. The same way open source increases user security even though 99% percent of users won’t build or read its code.

This whole paragraph is based on a falsehood. Open source does not increase user security, go look at the recent log4j disaster. What actually increases security is having security engineers being paid to look for and fix security issues, the cost of which is not significantly different between open or closed source. I have seen no reason to believe it's any different in smart contracts. Functional languages can be good for proving certain types of code with fixed requirement, but the same thing also applies to any of that category of software, financial or otherwise. It's again not related to blockchains at all.

>I seriously doubt you don’t have an emotional stake in your position. Perhaps the classic “I’m a smart tech person yet I missed out, so really it’s always been bad and I’ll be proven right someday,” syndrome.

This is a totally wrong, nonsensical and completely rude comment, please never say anything like this again. Never even let the words cross your mind. Your intelligence is capable of much better things.

>and others still that identified problems went to work on them rather than pretending they were unsolvable

This also makes no sense. I've been looking at this for 10 years. The problems aren't unsolvable. There are plenty of problems to solve, the reason why you shouldn't bother solving them is because all of those problems are intentionally caused by the bad design of blockchains. Our work is hard enough without purposefully making it harder, but that's the only thing blockchains do.

>The dogmatic crypto skeptic is as bad as the crypto shill.

I'm not a "crypto skeptic" and I don't care to discuss dogma. This is about the facts. Please avoid making these ridiculous accusations, please stop trying to psychoanalyze me, and just stick to the facts. That will help both of us.

Re: Ethereum Has Issues

#356
post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>It does add additional transparency to financial markets though No, not really. This comment is more crypto myth-building. There's nothing technical about blockchains that adds transparency. Any company that wants to publish all its financial statements publicly can technically already do so and could always do so. They don't for many reasons, the most important ones being that customers overwhelmingly want financia…

> There's nothing technical about blockchains that adds transparency False. On a public chain like Ethereum, every single historical operation and its outcome events and state can be traced and verified. If the source code is published, the running bytecode can be verified to match the source code. > smart contracts are [...] not "non-custodial" because they require middlemen to run the blockchain Also false - miners…

>False. On a public chain like Ethereum, every single historical operation and its outcome events and state can be traced and verified. If the source code is published, the running bytecode can be verified to match the source code.

No it's not false. Ethereum doesn't matter, there are a ton of sidechains and mixers that obfuscate transactions and you can't stop people from using them, you also can't guarantee they will provide source code or provide any means to verify their own smart contracts which they don't have to build on top of Ethereum's platform. And many of them don't anyway, specifically because of deficiencies in Ethereum.

>Also false - miners/validators have no opportunity to seize or freeze assets

Actually they do, if they all decide they don't like you then they can blacklist your wallet address. For practical purposes it's the same as a frozen asset. The inability to seize assets is actually a bad thing because it means the network operators have no effective way to confiscate stolen money.

>See above. You can verify what code was running when and with what input.

And you can also do that with literally any other program regardless of whether it's on a blockchain or not.

Re: Ethereum Has Issues

#357
post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I deposit $100 of eth, borrow $50 of eth I could be missing something, but it seems you're lending $50 worth of eth, rather than borrowing. Your net debt position is <0.

I think the reason crypto investors are excited about this is that it allows them to maintain a position in a crypto coin while still extracting some liquidity - possibly to invest in other coins. So, say you own 5 BTC and don't want to sell it because it's going "to the moon". You stake it as 200% collateral on a DeFi loan and get 2.5 BTC of liquidity you can use to buy some ETH. What's interesting about this is tha…

'... it allows them to maintain a position in a crypto coin ...'

In some 'we own you and command you to pay tribute to mighty rulers from what you produce' regimes, the loan avoids a sale and the resulting tax event. In my experience, the loan can be converted to fiat money.

Re: Ethereum Has Issues

#358

What useful has Ethereum created apart from providing an ever-bloating platform for generation of infinite digital-only tokens? As of 2022 the oracle problem still hasn't been solved, so actual decentralized, objective real life object-to-blockchain interaction is impossible. Monero added fully anonymous crypto that is used by most of the dark web. USDT, USDC provided stablecoins that can circumvent what fiat can't.…

I spent a year working on open source projects through gitcoin.co. I would wake up in the morning, choose an issue from the list, bash out the solution and tests in a few hours, code review after lunch and by the end of the day I would have ~$500 in ETH or DAI sent from Gitcoin's smart contracts to my Ethereum address.

It's not really feasible anymore due to high gas fees, but there is a real use case for you.

Re: Ethereum Has Issues

#359

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, the blockchain bros have reinvented... dark pools, which has been around since 1979? Because that's what you just described.

Dark pools rely on the operator being trustworthy. Distributed encryption relies only on cryptography and the validator set being too large, and costly to join, to allow cooption, and both assumptions are highly trustworthy.

Even if this is true, it is still just a dark pool, which is trivial to game. One ping is all you need.

I think the race to put order books on blockchain is misguided. Constant-product DEXes can offer way less gameable best-execution by simply trading more cautiously for the swapper.

Problem is, on Ethereum, gas makes it too expensive _not to trade_ once you get to the blockchain. MEV is a problem that can be managed effectively if the blockchain is scalable (thus avoiding gas problems).

Re: Ethereum Has Issues

#360
post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I deposit $100 of eth, borrow $50 of eth I could be missing something, but it seems you're lending $50 worth of eth, rather than borrowing. Your net debt position is <0.

I think the reason crypto investors are excited about this is that it allows them to maintain a position in a crypto coin while still extracting some liquidity - possibly to invest in other coins. So, say you own 5 BTC and don't want to sell it because it's going "to the moon". You stake it as 200% collateral on a DeFi loan and get 2.5 BTC of liquidity you can use to buy some ETH. What's interesting about this is tha…

This process doesn't create new "money" as far as I can tell. Centralised exchanges can indeed inflate the supply of any crypto-currency by lowering the reserve ratio. But I think the way they pump the coins is mostly by issuing unbacked "stablecoins" and using those to buy crypto-currencies.
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