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Why Germany won’t keep its nuclear plants open

unchartedterritories.tomaspueyo.com

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Re: Why Germany won’t keep its nuclear plants open

#111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

not to feed the troll but... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Onkalo_spent_nuclear_fuel_repo...

Nuclear waste is, from my perspective, one of the most discussed aspects of turning off nuclear power in germany. It's a complicated matter, that sparked a lot of controversy between german states. For example Bavaria doesn't want it in their back yard, despite being geologically suited. This is an active research field with many aspects. Unfortunately this wikipedia-link-thing won't do.

it's not a complicated matter, you dig a deep hole and throw it in. don't portray a political problem as a technical one

Re: Why Germany won’t keep its nuclear plants open

#112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s not just the German greens. Australia’s greens are staunchly anti-nuclear despite it being the only viable solution to the baseload problem, which renewables haven’t yet solved.

Who’s foreign funding the nationalist greens world-wide? Bet it someone with oil money. SA or Ruskies

No post body was provided.

Re: Why Germany won’t keep its nuclear plants open

#113
The whole argument hinges on the claim that 35% of electricity in Germany is generated by gas. This seems very high and I couldn‘t find a source for this claim in the article.

According to [1], it‘s 14% (for consumers). This includes a large number of CHP (combined heat and power plants), which produce district heat and cannot be replaced with nuclear power.

Then there‘s 36% of industry usage , of which 1/5 [1] is used for power generation in industry power plants. I‘d assume that quite a few of these on-site power plants do other things too, like CHP, and cannot be replaced with nuclear power. Ignoring this, it’d be

14% + 36%*21% = 21,56% of total Gas used for power, in reality, much less would be replaceable with nuclear.

The EU economic think tank Bruegel claimed [2]:

A technically and politically difficult decision to delay the closure of German nuclear power plants in operation until the end of 2021 could free up another 120 TWh of gas

Germany used 945,3 Twh in 2020[3], of which 94,8% was imported[4] That’s 816,14 Twh.

In 2020 55,2% of the imported gas came from Russia [5], so 494,7 Twh. So, according to Bruegel, a respected European think tank, Germany could replace 24,3% of the Russian gas it imported in 2020, if it managed to re-open its power plants closed in 2021. (the ones put out of use years earlier are being demolished[6]

[1] https://www.springerprofessional.de/erdgas/produktion---prod... [2] https://www.bruegel.org/2022/01/can-europe-survive-painlessl... [3]https://www.weltenergierat.de/publikationen/energie-fuer-deu... [4] https://www.bveg.de/die-branche/erdgas-und-erdoel-in-deutsch...

[5] https://www.t-online.de/finanzen/unternehmen-verbraucher/id_...

[6] https://de.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Liste_der_Kernreaktoren_in_D...

edit: corrected an error

Re: Why Germany won’t keep its nuclear plants open

#114
I'm surprised no one here or in the original comments points out the sheer violence of that first photograph, depicting the dead bodies of three Ukrainians. I find it deeply unethical to use such war photographs for a paid newsletter, without showing respect to the families and memories of these people.

Re: Why Germany won’t keep its nuclear plants open

#115
a) Because it's no longer technically feasible not to shut these plants down.

b) Because it's not politically tenable.

c) Because nuclear energy has long since been a minor part of electricity generation, and it wouldn't make much of a difference now.

d) Because it has nothing to do with imports of Russian gas and oil, which is overwhelmingly used for heating, fuel, and industrial purposes. Gas (not just from Russia) only makes up less than 10% of electricity generation. Oil is virtually not used at all for that.

e) Because it's by far the most expensive way of generating electricity, and would not be economically viable without massive subsidies. France's EDF is tens of billions in debt and would be bankrupt without the government backstopping them.

f) Because long-term storage of nuclear waste is still not properly solved.

g) Because mining nuclear materials is an ecological disaster. Also, guess who's a big exporter of uranium in Europe? Russia.

h) Because our long-term plan to switch to renewable sources of energy has been in full swing for over 20 years, and is coming along nicely with fossil fuels more and more getting phased out.

Bonus point: It's incredibly funny how the people who complain about us shutting down our nuclear power plants pretty much always come from countries that have a substantially lower share of renewable energy than we do (ours is at around 45% now) and often import more gas from Russia at least on a per-capita basis then we do, too.

Re: Why Germany won’t keep its nuclear plants open

#116
post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're repeating some of the excuses the article addresses. - The author says they studied nuclear in grad school, and are probably therefore an expert. - They quantify the additional risk of meltdown due to delaying new safety regulations. It's negligible compared to operating plants according to the new regulations. - Their proposal would increase Germany's stockpile of nuclear waste by 3%, which is surely within e…

Everything in life is a tradeoff. To me, the risks of keeping the nuclear plants in Germany are much lower than the risks of continuing to fund Russia.

continuing the nuclear power will have almost no impact on the war or dependence to Russia. The biggest issue by far is gas

Re: Why Germany won’t keep its nuclear plants open

#117
Content warning: Be aware that the linked article opens with a large photo of bodies of killed civilians. It is not explicitly "gory" but it is upsetting.

If the author happens to read this: Please consider not putting that front and centre without a warning.

If a mod happens to read this: Please consider adding a content warning or similar to the link title or somewhere else prominent.

Re: Why Germany won’t keep its nuclear plants open

#118
From the article:

1. Legal hurdles. "The previous law was changed to close the nuclear power plants after Fukushima."

2. Safety. "To keep the reactors open in 2023, Germany would need to accept accelerating the risk assessment and maybe living without some retrofittings."

3. Fuel. "The reactors would then need new fuel, which would take 12-15 months to arrive, and would require a doubling of manufacturing capacity."

4. Spare parts. "They also fear that some spare parts would be lacking because there is no further market in Germany for them."

5. Personnel. "People have been retiring and no new ones have been trained, so it would be hard to get the people."

6. Economics. "With lack of clarity on spare parts and personnel, how can we commit to a reliable delivery or energy? We can’t be 100% confident."

7. Energy replacement. "Until the new nuclear fuel is in place, we would make up for the shortage with more electricity coming from coal and gas."

Re: Why Germany won’t keep its nuclear plants open

#119

From the article: 1. Legal hurdles. "The previous law was changed to close the nuclear power plants after Fukushima." 2. Safety. "To keep the reactors open in 2023, Germany would need to accept accelerating the risk assessment and maybe living without some retrofittings." 3. Fuel. "The reactors would then need new fuel, which would take 12-15 months to arrive, and would require a doubling of manufacturing capacity."…

lol completely wrong, the guy in charge of the energy policy in Germany is a major benefactor of GAZPROM so he made Germany entirely dependent on it.

Re: Why Germany won’t keep its nuclear plants open

#120

a) Because it's no longer technically feasible not to shut these plants down. b) Because it's not politically tenable. c) Because nuclear energy has long since been a minor part of electricity generation, and it wouldn't make much of a difference now. d) Because it has nothing to do with imports of Russian gas and oil, which is overwhelmingly used for heating, fuel, and industrial purposes. Gas (not just from Russia)…

Well I'm from Portugal, where renewable power generation percent swings between the low 60's and the high 80's depending on the month and where we don't have any need for gas heating whatsoever. I also personally own and tend to 70 hectares of forest so I'm pretty willing to bet my carbon footprint is way way better than yours. According to your nonsense standard I should be a credible person to make this comment:

How will Germany solve base load generation for power and heating without nuclear or fossil fuels in a country with weather as shit as Germany? Some of your points are reasonable but they are mostly silly, especially without any discussion of the elephant in the room. Anything else is greenwashing garbage.

(lived in Frankfurt for a spell and will never go back. Nuclear-neutral, I dig it but whatever's cheapest is ok for me. Techno-positive on climate change. If you want to be ecological move somewhere tropical, live simple and never leave)

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