Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

You’re muted – or are you? Videoconferencing apps may listen when mic is off

news.wisc.edu

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

331–340 of 353 posts

Re: You’re muted – or are you? Videoconferencing apps may listen when mic is off

#331

Post by rapnie »

e40 wrote: post #184
ghostpepper wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"They found that all of the apps they tested occasionally gather raw audio data while mute is activated, with one popular app gathering information and delivering data to its server at the same rate regardless of whether the microphone is muted or not." The way I read that is, only one of the apps actually sends audio data to the server when the mic is muted. I'm not sure why they don't say which one, and I'm not sur…

> I'm not sure why they don't say which one Yeah, that's very annoying. Zoom, for example, will tell you, when you are muted and you begin to speak. It's a very nice thing. I have a microphone (that wasn't expensive) that has a hardware mute. I use it when I really want to make sure I'm not heard, even for "speaking" detection.

> Zoom, for example, will tell you, when you are muted and you begin to speak. It's a very nice thing.

Zoom was discussed 2 months ago in "Why is the Zoom app listening on my microphone when not in a meeting?"

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30266894

Re: You’re muted – or are you? Videoconferencing apps may listen when mic is off

#332

Post by hutzlibu »

sushisource wrote: post #203
toyg wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Zoom, for example, will tell you, when you are muted and you begin to speak MS Teams has that feature too. TBH I'm not surprised: when you mute the mic in an app, you're still letting the app in control. If you really want to be safe, you need to mute at OS level or in hardware. That's why cameras have a hardware cover in modern laptops.

Precisely, this is why I think the earlier comment's suggestion: > How about we not make the default that companies can do whatever they want and users have to take steps like a hardware-muted mic (which isn't always an option) to ensure a basic expectation of privacy? Sounds nice on the surface, but is ultimately silly. Sure, it'd be nice if everyone did the right thing, but you can never guarantee that, and hence i…

Well, I have hardware buttons, too. But without some basic trust, this society could not operate anymore.

And the increasingly (or is it just perceived?) shady behavior of big companies are not helping.

Re: You’re muted – or are you? Videoconferencing apps may listen when mic is off

#333

Post by numpad0 »

LadyCailin wrote: post #273
coldtea wrote: post #253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or, you know, keeps your ass safe from being sued...

Anybody can sue you at any time for any reason. For libel and slander cases though, telling the truth is a valid defense.

In theory, but assholes often aren’t creative, and justice system is as it always had been, so,

Re: You’re muted – or are you? Videoconferencing apps may listen when mic is off

#334

Post by zauguin »

andmarios wrote: post #329
andrei_says_ wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

MacBook pros already have a mute-speaker button. It would be so nice to have a mute-mic button which lights up when muted.

Quite interestingly the only laptops I've seen with such a feature (button to mute and LED to display the mic is muted) are huawei's matebooks. Some of them also have the camera under a keyboard button, extremely weird angle but when the camera is hidden you can be 100% sure you are not being recorded. The mic mute button of course works at the OS level but still...

Also controlled by the OS, but many ThinkPad's have such a button and light too.

Re: You’re muted – or are you? Videoconferencing apps may listen when mic is off

#335

Post by chopin »

hutzlibu wrote: post #332
sushisource wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Precisely, this is why I think the earlier comment's suggestion: > How about we not make the default that companies can do whatever they want and users have to take steps like a hardware-muted mic (which isn't always an option) to ensure a basic expectation of privacy? Sounds nice on the surface, but is ultimately silly. Sure, it'd be nice if everyone did the right thing, but you can never guarantee that, and hence i…

Well, I have hardware buttons, too. But without some basic trust, this society could not operate anymore. And the increasingly (or is it just perceived?) shady behavior of big companies are not helping.

>But without some basic trust, this society could not operate anymore.

I am afraid this eludes our leaders across the board.

Re: You’re muted – or are you? Videoconferencing apps may listen when mic is off

#336

Post by greyhair »

I have two different headsets I use for conferencing, on a USB with a mid-cable control for volume and mute, and a BT headset with physical buttons on the ear cups. I have messed with both, under Linux and Windows 10, and when they are muted, they are really muted.

I have not disassembled them, I am certain that the USB HID is inside the mid cable control unit, but the headsets themselves must be muting the audio stream.

If you use the mute button on the conferencing app? Then I assume all bets are off, but with controls on an external headset, I would assume all behave similarly.

Re: You’re muted – or are you? Videoconferencing apps may listen when mic is off

#337

Post by greyhair »

month13 wrote: post #288
Gigachad wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The touch bar is like an idea that works really well in your head. It has so many theoretical cool uses. But in reality I end up never using it for anything.. I would have been happy if the new one had the touch bar and the function keys, but that would have been extra cost for a feature people just aren't using.

After using a stream deck for some odd automation, I think the real flaw was having the touch bar be so contextual, and replacing the existing function keys. Had both existed, and and allowed the user to extend their customisation; say buttons for common actions, siri suggestions, shortcuts it may have been perceived differently, and more of power user tool. Most of the actions just duplicated existing UI elements.

I think one thing that makes an external stream deck work, is that it is a separate context sensitive device, that is mentally separated from the keyboard.

So when you go to the deck to perform an action, you mentally context switch away from the keyboard, so your brain is looking for different clues.

So even with a touch bar + function keys, the function keys stay in keyboard context, but the touch bar requires that switch in any case. Maybe taking your eyes to the touch bar is enough of a context switch, mentally.

Re: You’re muted – or are you? Videoconferencing apps may listen when mic is off

#338

Post by pahae »

This is one of the reasons I bought a USB hub were I can switch connected devices off and on (disconnects their power lines). If you're lazy like me you can plug another USB hub into one of the ports so that can switch multiple devices (webcam and mic) with one button press instead of two :) Searching for "usb hub power switch" should get you a few hits.

Re: You’re muted – or are you? Videoconferencing apps may listen when mic is off

#339

Post by greyhair »

notreallyserio wrote: post #189
ghostpepper wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"They found that all of the apps they tested occasionally gather raw audio data while mute is activated, with one popular app gathering information and delivering data to its server at the same rate regardless of whether the microphone is muted or not." The way I read that is, only one of the apps actually sends audio data to the server when the mic is muted. I'm not sure why they don't say which one, and I'm not sur…

There's a weird culture around reporting problems without reporting names. You see it a lot here on HN and occasionally in media. I'll never understand. Why bother talking about corporate misbehavior (or etc) and not back it up with the basic, minimal data you could provide?

I have said negative things about someone's favorite product and then abandoned a thread (not here on this site) because the stream of hate that followed drowned out the original message.

People can be irrationally attached to the things they use.

As a farm kid growing up, you didn't step between two guys arguing the merits of I-H and J-D farm equipment (1970s...)

Post reply on HN