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Impressions from a first-time Mac user

loganmarchione.com

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Re: Impressions from a first-time Mac user

#721

Post by mastazi »

yesenadam wrote: post #609
mastazi wrote: post #582

Earlier quoted context omitted.

in my experience, Cmd + left/right arrow behaves like a pgup/down. Goes to the very end of the page, not end of a single line

That's weird. Where do you mean? e.g. in a text editor? in HN comment text entry boxes?

OK I'm sorry I just went back to my Mac and found that my previous comment was incorrect, but the main problem (no way to select a line) still exist.

The issue happens on web (and on web based UIs such as Electron apps) outside of text input fields or textareas.

This is how to reproduce:

1. first we doble click on the first word of the line, to create a selection

2. At this point we expect that Cmd-shift-rightarrow will expand the selection to the rest of the line. But it doesn't because this key combination only works inside a text input or textarea. In every other desktop OS I can do shift-End at this point, and select the rest of the line.

3. option-shift arrow does work, but selects one word at a time so it is cumbersome to use

4. I had been told that I could use fn-shift-arrow in this case, but that selects all text until the end of the page (that's the one I was thinking about in my previous comment)

I just tried and reproduced the issue in Chrome and Safari.

Re: Impressions from a first-time Mac user

#722

Post by CincinnatiMan »

drewda wrote: post #197
olyjohn wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't get used to the fact that I can't alt-tab to a minimized window. Nor can I figure out how to switch to any particular minimized window. You have literally no way of knowing that a minimized window exists other than right-clicking the dock icon, or going to the "Window" menu after you switched to the application. The dock was fine 20 years ago when they released OSX, but they've literally done nothing to make…

I also prefer Windows default behavior to macOS in this respect. I find macOS alt-tab'ing works better for me with the addition of https://contexts.co/

Same here. I would be so slow on my work Mac if I didn't have Contexts.

Re: Impressions from a first-time Mac user

#723

Post by [deleted] »

mastazi wrote: post #721
yesenadam wrote: post #609

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's weird. Where do you mean? e.g. in a text editor? in HN comment text entry boxes?

OK I'm sorry I just went back to my Mac and found that my previous comment was incorrect, but the main problem (no way to select a line) still exist. The issue happens on web (and on web based UIs such as Electron apps) outside of text input fields or textareas. This is how to reproduce: 1. first we doble click on the first word of the line, to create a selection 2. At this point we expect that Cmd-shift-rightarrow w…

[deleted]

Re: Impressions from a first-time Mac user

#724

Post by Maursault »

rwc wrote: post #7
ChicagoBoy11 wrote: post #2

Despite the warning, I didn't find it nearly as "ranty" as the author cautioned, and instead seemed like a fairly comprehensive and fair take on his experience. Having gone through the same thing myself several years ago, the UI aspect of it is something that I'd be curious to see how it develops for the author. I think it is not uncommon for Windows folk to find the windowing experience on macs rather painful, at le…

Not that it's right or wrong, but the behavior dates back to the very first implementations of Mac OS and Windows. Mac OS has always been an application switching interface, and Windows has been a window switching interface. Takes getting used to the paradigm shift.

I believe you are making a generalization to apologize for the author of the article for not figuring out, or not immediately knowing already, how to use keyboard short cuts to cycle through selecting windows. [1]

You're both being silly, but the author is being especially silly to evaluate an operating system mostly based on how he feels about the user interface.

macOS is more than just a user interface, more on that in a bit. That being said, there is no Universe where any Linux user interface nor any user interface developed by Microsoft is superior to Apple's Aqua. Sure, Aqua sucks, but nothing, anywhere, approaches its ease of use (developed for everyone, not just the nitpicky self-proclaimed power users with weird tastes), and the feeling of solidity, like windows, menus and icons have some gravity and aren't just weightless and flat sprites ready to fly off the screen or fail to interact with other graphic elements properly. Frankly, every gui ever has been chasing Apple's guis since 1984. Truth hurts, I'm sure, but those are the facts. NT4 and 2K, very similar, were collectively the best guis Microsoft ever released, and gui-wise, everything since has been an absolute disaster, visually and with interaction, XP and 7 included, just absolute crappy junk of guis, and 10 and 11 are no better. In Linux, I always liked every gui I saw, Gnome and KDE, and really it can be tailored to whatever the user's desire is, can even run WindowMaker for the NeXT feel. But therein lies the problem, no consistency whatsoever and it's not for everyone; it is only for the tinkerers, coders, and Linux admins.

Back to the operating system. macOS is rarely given the credit it deserves for being such a solid stable gui running on top of SUS UNIX. Come' on, the author merely mentions this and says nothing about it, but right there is nearly everything that matters: more software available than any other platform ever plus all the best professional apps (printing, photography, audio, video, etc.) run better on macOS, and massive security benefits right out of the box, default config, but of course it can also be hardened, trivially, and then pretty much forgotten. You can never forget to attend to the security of your Windows machines, update, upgrade, constant, ceaseless, never ending scans, but that is in addition to its catastrophe of a user interface, so there's that.

[1] https://www.businessinsider.com/how-to-switch-between-window...

Re: Impressions from a first-time Mac user

#725

Post by yesenadam »

mastazi wrote: post #721
yesenadam wrote: post #609

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's weird. Where do you mean? e.g. in a text editor? in HN comment text entry boxes?

OK I'm sorry I just went back to my Mac and found that my previous comment was incorrect, but the main problem (no way to select a line) still exist. The issue happens on web (and on web based UIs such as Electron apps) outside of text input fields or textareas. This is how to reproduce: 1. first we doble click on the first word of the line, to create a selection 2. At this point we expect that Cmd-shift-rightarrow w…

> no way to select a line

Hmm yeah I never noticed that. Fastest way to select a line I know is: click at the start of the line, then Shift + down arrow.

Re: Impressions from a first-time Mac user

#726

Post by mastazi »

yesenadam wrote: post #725
mastazi wrote: post #721

Earlier quoted context omitted.

OK I'm sorry I just went back to my Mac and found that my previous comment was incorrect, but the main problem (no way to select a line) still exist. The issue happens on web (and on web based UIs such as Electron apps) outside of text input fields or textareas. This is how to reproduce: 1. first we doble click on the first word of the line, to create a selection 2. At this point we expect that Cmd-shift-rightarrow w…

> no way to select a line Hmm yeah I never noticed that. Fastest way to select a line I know is: click at the start of the line, then Shift + down arrow.

Good one! It might select the first word of the next line in some cases, but it's easy to deselect it with the left arrow. Thank you!

Re: Impressions from a first-time Mac user

#727

Post by mastazi »

mastazi wrote: post #583
Destiner wrote: post #488

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Cmd + left/right works everywhere for me (except the terminal)

doesn't work for me https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31000315

I'm sorry, the comment that I linked above was inaccurate, but the issue still persists for me, see here https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31009239

Re: Impressions from a first-time Mac user

#728

Post by DrStartup »

brimble wrote: post #107
divbzero wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What I miss most in macOS is Super + Left and Super + Right to tile windows left and right..

I've used Spectacle with the defaults, for years. It's not actively developed but still works. There are actively-maintained alternatives, but since it has zero times done anything weird or glitchy for me, even with multiple monitors, I've not switched yet. "brew install spectacle", start it, give it accessibility permissions it needs in the Settings panel, set to start at login (check a checkbox in Spectacle's setti…

I've used Moom for years now - https://apps.apple.com/us/app/moom/id419330170?mt=12 - it has all the things, menu access, window snapping, short cuts, custom configuration, and saved layouts

Re: Impressions from a first-time Mac user

#729

Post by jayd16 »

lwkl wrote: post #201
jayd16 wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is Apple UX in a nutshell. Hidden power tools are not intuitive.

How is this Apple UX specific? Windows UX and Linux UX work the same way. I'd argue a lot of power user feature are more accessible on macOS than on Windows. The shortcuts and gestures for macOS can be found in the system settings and you can change the shortcuts. How are you supposed to find them on Windows? I think people see macOS as more intuitive because it doesn't offer as much customization and is relatively c…

>The shortcuts and gestures for macOS can be found in the system settings and you can change the shortcuts.

Can they? Where can I find the shortcut to copy the current path in Finder?

Re: Impressions from a first-time Mac user

#730

Post by kemayo »

mkl wrote: post #233
kemayo wrote: post #48

I actually like the command+tab behavior, and miss it when I use Windows. I'll explain: if you have a lot of windows open, I think it's nice to silo them. When I have ten Firefox windows and six Sublime windows and three iTerm windows, and a few other random applications, it's generally easier to go first to the app I want and then find the window inside it, rather than always having to shuffle through 19 different w…

It's nice to silo windows when you have lots open, but I think grouping all browser windows together is not a sensible way to do it. Some browser windows go with my IDE, some with spreadsheets, some terminals, etc. Grouping all browser windows (including web apps, email, etc.) because they happen to use the browser is like grouping all windows whose title starts with "A" or something.

This is true, but my Windows experience suggests that the one-set approach to window-switching doesn't help me maintain that grouping. You do get quick switching between recently-used windows, but if I have more than a few (or multiple sets I need to switch between) then they rapidly get jumbled together for me.

What I actually do on macOS, which I felt was too opinionated to mention in my initial comment, is use Spaces (macOS' virtual-desktops feature) to split things up by task. Normally pretty high-level -- a "work" space and a "relaxing" space always exist, but making task-specific ones to focus on is trivial. Then once you're inside a given space, all the tab shortcuts only switch between windows on that space.

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