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Ask HN: What are the next internet infra problems?

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Re: Ask HN: What are the next internet infra problems?

#211
I'd like to see more movement away from client-server model to peer-to-peer model, with the easiest and most obvious example being file distribution via torrents for free-to-the-end-user files and downloadables, with the company or whoever seeding constantly but being helped by others who also seed the same files. It would reduce server loads and make file hosting easier and cheaper to the company/host, compared to the traditional server-client model.

That's not the only thing peer-to-peer could be good for, nor is it the only implementation possible, but I'm using torrenting as an example because it's a good peer-to-peer technology that works and has been working well for at least 10 years (whenever trackerless torrents and less reliance on trackers became standardized into the standard)

Re: Ask HN: What are the next internet infra problems?

#212
post #192
post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If you write it in Go and package it as a single binary. ... > You can't if you write it in a scripting language that requires tons of programs to already exist on the system You are close, but you are not exactly right. If consider real case of application, which create some value (I don't mean just money, may be for example community value or scientific), you will need to depend on some libraries or tools. This i…

> If consider real case of application, which create some value (I don't mean just money, may be for example community value or scientific), you will need to depend on some libraries or tools. > This is how our civilization works, we don't create all things from scratch every time, but instead, we take ready parts and construct something new from them, possibly adding our new parts. This is very dubious. If all you d…

> If all you do is compose parts that already exist, then anyone can do it and your value add is almost nothing.

Looks like you believe to Marx theories, that anybody could JUST make value. I mean, on such markets, you really could start sells from zero or with very limited resources.

But this is true only for very early stages of market, when competition does not matter. - On developed markets, competition is very significant, so to make moderate success, you have to use external resources - grants, credits, crowdfunding, etc.

What Marx don't said, that people divided to two big groups - passionaries (mostly entrepreneurs), and ordinary humans. They different in very important thing - passionaries have from nature need to change world (ordinary does not have such need at all), and on some moment of passionary life, earlier better, he switches to famous circle: 1. accumulate resources. 2. invest resources to some project to change environment. 3. when project on 2 approaches to some endpoint, have strong signs of success or failure, return to 1.

Ordinary people just satisfy their needs of mostly lowest levels of Maslow pyramid, they don't accumulate resources, they don't try to invest, and so they have not any success in projects, even when I agree, that many projects need very little resources to start profitable business.

Only exception, when ordinary human face some very easy to enter and extremely profitable opportunity, which does not include any risks or responsibility, than greed could defeat laziness.

But such things don't happen frequently. As I said before, most real opportunities include risks, include need to build circle of trust (so people will give their resources for free), or just get somewhere resources with conditions, like credits from financial entities.

So, return to our technical things, you are right, that exist totally free things, which could use anybody, but in most cases, they are not enough to make value, in many cases they are useless or they used to create barrier to enter this business.

I even must accent, I've been involved in few opensource projects, and in near all successful projects, their lead constantly made decisions, which features will not include in free version, to motivate people pay for them.

Most known example of free project, created as barrier - Eclipse IDE, which destroyed really big markets where lived lot of businesses - Borland, Watcom, Tiny C, etc, and when appear Eclipse, they become unprofitable.

So, life is struggle, but I repeat - technically you are absoultely right, in that near anything possible, if somebody else pay for it :)

Re: Ask HN: What are the next internet infra problems?

#213
post #202
post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then we should really be focusing on getting IPv6 everywhere so that the firewall can be a single click "expose website from this computer".

It's not just a matter of exposing the service to the internet. That's only part of the solution. The usability difference between consuming web content via browsers and creating/exposing it via web servers is vast. Most web users wouldn't even know where to start with today's tooling, and what's worse: even if such tooling existed, you'd have to convince them why they should use it in the first place. This is partly…

Idk about web hosting and web servers, but a significant portion of the population at some point used torrenting software.

I feel like at the very least it should be possible to make tutorials for how to make and seed torrents (and why you might want to), and people can send or post torrent files or at least magnet links in places that already exist, like telegram (the app, not telegraphs from before phones were common) or email or sms text messages or forums or qr codes or anywhere that you can post at least a magnet link.

I feel like if people want bad enough to share and receive large files they can learn the basics of using torrent programs (and I've also seen more than one Android app (Libretorrent being one of them, and you can get it on the free/libre/open source Fdroid store if you want to))

Another thing to consider is that irc and matrix exist and I think they claim to be peer-to-peer, but I'd suggest taking a good look at whether that's true and what their limitations are, with irc seeming particularly limited when I tried it years ago (what do you mean it doesn't keep any history? I can't see what the convo was right before I showed up? That's dumb. Oh, and I can't see any messages somebody was trying to send me if I wasn't online and in that irc room at the time? That's super dumb. And where's the edit button? You mean I can't edit what I sent if I did a typo or sent a message before it was ready or something? And I can't even delete a sent message so I can redo it and replace the messed up message? What decade was this written in? Oh, like decades ago? Ok, maybe that makes some sense, but we have standards for our communication apps today) Oh, and it was very obviously made by people with a commandline-first mentality, and you either know what command to tell it or you don't, and if you don't and you don't understand any help text there may or may not be, you're at the mercy of whoever introduced you to irc, especially if you're not used to thinking the way hardcore/old programmers think (which makes help text less than helpful).

No, I think those aren't exactly what I'd be looking for

Re: Ask HN: What are the next internet infra problems?

#214
post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> asymmetric There's no technical reason for this to be the case. ISPs adapted to the needs of the web, not the other way around. > lack upload bandwidth This is relative to each user. The vast majority wouldn't require much upload bandwidth, and there could be technical solutions to address this (caching nodes, data expiration, P2P, etc.). The biggest technical challenges of large web services are because of the sca…

The key functionality of the major tech platforms is to convey data to other people. Almost none of the data we give them is private or proprietary in the sense you’re suggesting. We only give it to them because we want e.g. our friends to have it. Now it is unfortunate that the service provider also gets it in the process, but that’s more an issue of end to end encryption than centralization per se. We can have high…

Some websites even track exactly how you move your mouse and can have a pretty good guess of your age and they can track how many times you click something that doesn't do anything (apparently older people tend to zero in on buttons and click on things that aren't clickable more often. I heard this on older episodes of the Level1news on the Level1 Techs youtube channel, which I recommend listening to for tech news that might be up to a week out of date)

It's not just the data you obviously fill in yourself

and that's before considering cookies other than letting you auto login to a specific site you already logged in to before

Also, isn't Whatsapp owned by facebook now? Don't trust facebook or anything they own

Re: Ask HN: What are the next internet infra problems?

#215
post #8

Interesting question. Do we still have Internet infrastructural problems left? Akamai solved POPs (point of presence). Equinix solved DC. Both are matching towards table stakes in the context of internet infrastructural. (Not business models). We have lots of under-sea cables / international expansions on-going and planned. And it is now more of a cost efficiency problem, not an infrastructural problem . We have a de…

of course there's always the problem of IPSs and big companies and others being assholes, and there's at least a category of laws that should be gotten rid of, and people and society need to be nicer in general, and everybody needs to stop treating digital things that are abundant as if they're scarce (get rid of artificial scarcity of digital things and embrace the opportunities that abundance brings)

Re: Ask HN: What are the next internet infra problems?

#217
post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why? Honest question. I fully appreciate owning your own data and hosting it somewhere, but no idea why we need to host anywhere but hyper-connected data centers. I’d like to own my social graph, my profile, my permissions for who can contact me and read my data. But no reason for that to execute on my phone or home server. Have service providers do it, compete, scale and specialise. Let me host at home if I want to,…

Because it's my data. I should decide who can access it, when and on what terms. Relying on someone else to do it for me is an unnecessary middle man that exists for the only reason web developers haven't made a good technical solution that would be simple, secure and reliable enough for everyone to use. For goodness sake, we've had to come up with laws for how companies can use our data instead of solid technical so…

But then you could run some open source server that does it, just not typically from your home. It’s the home part that won’t work, just as most people don’t serve their web apps from home. And non tech people can still outsource and move between competing providers rather than have an oligopoly of social media companies.

Sadly publishing goes towards the lowest friction service. Was websites, then blogs, now Twitter. The backgrounds and themes weren’t as important as simple content. I’m not sure home hosting has any chance to beat that trend.

Re: Ask HN: What are the next internet infra problems?

#218

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, really. https://forums.att.com/conversations/att-fiber-equipment/pos...

Yes, shit happens. Use another device. Or another ISP. Or get a bizniz line where you can spec a device of your choice? Or move? Or use StarLink? (Did you notice the source in my link?(at all?))

> Use another device.

I did. It has its own slew of problems.

> Or another ISP.

ISPs hold monopolies in many areas of the US.

> Or get a bizniz line

Not always available. Too expensive when it is.

> Or move?

Is this a joke?

> Or use StarLink?

Waiting list. Expensive. Latency.

> Did you notice the source in my link?(at all?)

Did you really expect me to read the source code from a bunch of patches for a french modem and gain some kind of magical insight?

Re: Ask HN: What are the next internet infra problems?

#219
post #212
post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> If consider real case of application, which create some value (I don't mean just money, may be for example community value or scientific), you will need to depend on some libraries or tools. > This is how our civilization works, we don't create all things from scratch every time, but instead, we take ready parts and construct something new from them, possibly adding our new parts. This is very dubious. If all you d…

> If all you do is compose parts that already exist, then anyone can do it and your value add is almost nothing. Looks like you believe to Marx theories, that anybody could JUST make value. I mean, on such markets, you really could start sells from zero or with very limited resources. But this is true only for very early stages of market, when competition does not matter. - On developed markets, competition is very s…

I love how you make a faulty assumption and then go on a huge rant disproving it as if that matters.

Re: Ask HN: What are the next internet infra problems?

#220

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, shit happens. Use another device. Or another ISP. Or get a bizniz line where you can spec a device of your choice? Or move? Or use StarLink? (Did you notice the source in my link?(at all?))

> Use another device. I did. It has its own slew of problems. > Or another ISP. ISPs hold monopolies in many areas of the US. > Or get a bizniz line Not always available. Too expensive when it is. > Or move? Is this a joke? > Or use StarLink? Waiting list. Expensive. Latency. > Did you notice the source in my link?(at all?) Did you really expect me to read the source code from a bunch of patches for a french modem an…

> Did you really expect...

Err, nope? I just posted that link to show you that it doesn't have to be like you said, especially not for the device in question.

> ISPs hold monopolies...

They did, and sometimes still do elsewhere too.

I don't give a shit, since I don't live in "free 3rd-worldistan with nukez, carz, and screaming lunatics on crack, or whatever else".

> Is this a joke?

Not at all. Totally serious. It's the thing to do, to escape learned helplessness.

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