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I decided to move away from big tech for my children and myself

lof.flounder.online

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Re: I decided to move away from big tech for my children and myself

#201

Post by rglullis »

thr0wawayf00 wrote: post #194
rglullis wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It takes years for newer technologies to get into CS curriculum. The problem is not the technology. The problem is how they are used, and ethics is something that does not change - or at least changes at a much lower pace.

If there's a profit incentive to misuse a particular technology, it will be misused. Ethics is always secondary to profit in a market system. If ethics superseded profit, capitalism never would've taken off.

Ethical violations happen no matter the economic system, and capitalism (market dynamics) at least provide a mechanism for self-correction.

Your response may help you jerk off to your righteousness, but it does not give anything actionable and it does not provide any type of solution to solve the problem. Can you try again, please?

Re: I decided to move away from big tech for my children and myself

#202

Post by em-bee »

that_guy_iain wrote: post #158
em-bee wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

i think the point was that it is scary to know that you are getting stuff recommended based on location. that means that you can assume that more recommendations are from nearby which implicitly reveals the location of the people in the videos. having my kids be seen 100 random viewers world wide is one thing, having the same video shared with all my neighbors is quite another.

So your neighbours can see your kid in Person but seeing a video of them is off? You don't want a friendly neighbourly vibe

there is a big difference between seeing something, and having a permanent recording of it. also, only a few people see what the kids are doing at any given time, and none of them see anything happening at home except the friends coming over. so when something embarrassing happens the difference is between a few neighbors seeing it vs all of them.

there are enough examples of nosy neighbors in the US calling the police on things they don't like. look up free range parenting right here on hackernews.

noone is going to bother about a few kids filming themselves spraying graffiti at the local park, except some people who live at the park.

if an algorithm amplifies local activities to everyone around, then the wrong kind of people will find out.

it's the very definition of gossip that is being facilitated here. the assumption that when something is interesting for a pew people, it's probably interesting for everyone else in the area.

it was probably a similar algorithm that motivated people to turn into lynch-mobs in some places in asia.

it's likely this kind of realization that spooked the OP.

Re: I decided to move away from big tech for my children and myself

#203

Post by dayk995 »

I think all we can do as parents is just educate our children on how to safely use these devices and teach them how to spot red flags: intrusive ads, bullying, scams, catfishing, everything else wrong with the internet.

If you block their exposure and/or don't trust them, they're going to rebel and it'll be counterproductive for everyone.

source: have a 7 year old daughter who does the exact opposite of what I ask her to do.

Re: I decided to move away from big tech for my children and myself

#204

Post by optymizer »

lynguist wrote: post #25

During the Facebook hearing, they said that its internal data shows that Facebook is most harmful for 14 year old girls. I believe that if you can somehow shield your daughter of that age from social media, she will be fine. I had a no display rule for our toddler but during my absence, her mother introduced her to the iPad, and now she watches YouTube on it whenever I’m not around. I know that the American Pediatric…

I eventually gave in and gave my toddler a tablet to watch cartoons on YouTube. I noticed a few things:

1. She keeps it way to close to her eyes (even after I move it further away)

2. She gets way too much blue light

3. She doesn't get tired of watching cartoons if given the chance (e.g. on long road trips)

4. She now wants cartoons to be playing in the background while she plays with toys

I didn't see any improvements after some time, so I decided that the tablet medium must go away. I now cast videos on the TV from my phone and that has solved most of these, since I have better control over what, when, and or how long she's watching cartoons.

Re: I decided to move away from big tech for my children and myself

#205

Post by jasonladuke0311 »

basedgod wrote: post #198
PeterBarrett wrote: post #10

I don't have kids yet but it is something that has been discussed about my nieces and nephews. As you say, you don't want your kids to become social pariahs but you also don't want to give them smart phones, in this day and age it looks like the two are intrinsically linked, which is disappointing. I would like to say that we can teach kids to have a healthy relationship with the internet and social media but sites l…

ah yes the whole "Coca Cola corp. says you can't just ban your kids from drinking and eating sugar !!! then when they turn 18 they'll fall off the wagon and eat nothing but sugar ! better to have them eat it throughout their childhood so they KNOW how to avoid it" do you people ever try to have an independent thought outside of the propaganda of big business ? what kind of nonsense of this, that children should be ex…

This comment is hilarious. I've known like a dozen people who have experienced the exact scenario you mentioned.

Re: I decided to move away from big tech for my children and myself

#206

Post by kradeelav »

PeterBarrett wrote: post #10

I don't have kids yet but it is something that has been discussed about my nieces and nephews. As you say, you don't want your kids to become social pariahs but you also don't want to give them smart phones, in this day and age it looks like the two are intrinsically linked, which is disappointing. I would like to say that we can teach kids to have a healthy relationship with the internet and social media but sites l…

It's interesting, of all the points being made in this thread, "making kids be more resilient with (and even enjoying) time alone" feels like an area of opportunity that hasn't been mentioned, not something to shut down and banish.

My circumstances were a little unusual (only child with physical disabilities) but not once did I feel like a social pariah what with books, games, books again, one or two loyal friends, pets, exploring the accessible parts of the backyard and digging up insects ...

There's a happy middle as far as giving into Big Tech vs not, basically.

Re: I decided to move away from big tech for my children and myself

#207

Post by devney »

The main point to remember is that the fones we carry aren't for us. They are data-gathering tools for various spy enterprises. Any utility we get out of our fones is largely incidental, or at best it's bait to get us into the trap.

It's interesting that most of the replies here focus on the children aspect, while the same spy-device paradigm applies as much or more to adults.

The bottom line is I just don't get enough utility out of my devices to justify spending all that privacy on them. Plus ads make the internet unusable on them. I'll just use my laptop because it's more convenient.

Re: I decided to move away from big tech for my children and myself

#208

Post by throwaway787544 »

It's sad that people are having this fearful response to technology. Yes, companies are tracking you, manipulating you subconsciously, and making money off you. But you don't have to take it as a threat. You still have agency over your life and you can decide how much you interact with tech and when. You don't have to run screaming.

In terms of being opted-in by somebody else: yeah, that sucks, and has been a danger ever since Facebook started auto tagging faces from pictures at parties. But we need to pressure them to add controls, not just pull ourselves away from society.

Re: I decided to move away from big tech for my children and myself

#209

Post by yunwal »

rglullis wrote: post #201
thr0wawayf00 wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If there's a profit incentive to misuse a particular technology, it will be misused. Ethics is always secondary to profit in a market system. If ethics superseded profit, capitalism never would've taken off.

Ethical violations happen no matter the economic system, and capitalism (market dynamics) at least provide a mechanism for self-correction. Your response may help you jerk off to your righteousness, but it does not give anything actionable and it does not provide any type of solution to solve the problem. Can you try again, please?

There are other methods of self-correction (e.g. social pressure) that have been much more effective over the long run. Now you might say, "there's nothing interfering with social pressure in capitalism, you can have competitive markets with social pressure". But often, companies must either accept ethical violations or be out-competed in a competitive marketplace.

Re: I decided to move away from big tech for my children and myself

#210

Post by nonrandomstring »

urlwolf wrote: post #176
nonrandomstring wrote: post #114

Well done. Your children will definitely thank you for reasons not even apparent today. Teaching children about technology, rather than letting them be taught by technology is the key here. This is the new tobacco. As research accumulates on detrimental effects (individual cognitive impact and societal damage) it's going to get easier to do the right thing for your children. It's hard right now in 2022, as seen in th…

The author of the book 'digital vegan', the most impactful thing I've read in at least a year, responded to my post. I'm fulfilled :)

For real? Stoked! I've kinda considered that one a "failure" and moved on to "Ethics for Hackers" for Routledge - which I promise will pull no punches. :)
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