The only thing we should be talking about is the climate crisis • Hacker News Board

Re: The only thing we should be talking about is the climate crisis

#161

Post by bobsmooth » Fri, Apr 08, 2022, 3:29 PM UTC

goodgoblin wrote: post #82

I'm sorry, but this is utterly unhinged. There is no evidence of weather patterns of any kind, much less indications that we are about to face "extreme-weather". What caused the weather which led to the dust-bowl? What caused the ice-age? The climate of the earth has changed for millions of years w/o humans, and while certainly greenhouse gases impact the current trends, they aren't cause for apocalyptic concern. I r…

And there are no consequences to thinking that because the users of this site will be the last to be affected by climate change.

Re: The only thing we should be talking about is the climate crisis

#162

Post by wbsss4412 » Fri, Apr 08, 2022, 3:31 PM UTC

vasco wrote: post #150

wbsss4412 wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is climate change “whining about their own problems?”. The LA times author was making the point that, to him and his readers, nothing matters as much as climate change. While what is happening in Ukraine is absolutely terrible, in his mind it does not reach the level of concern that climate does. Parents response was “oh you’re so privileged”, and my point is that just about everyone on this site is. Frankly, the…

My point is that they are not suffering at the levels I compared it to, yet have the gall to tell everyone else not only what to talk about - but that they shouldn't even be talking about anything else. I may not be suffering either, but I'm not telling anyone that I know better then them what "the real problem is". I thought this would've been understandable, but maybe the clarification helps.

While I don’t agree with the author that climate change is the _only_ thing we should talk about, his premise that there are many issues and crises that compete for our attention is valid, and, further, his point that there needs to be a discussion about what to prioritize is a valid one as well.

Saying “oh you don’t suffer therefore you don’t have any right to tell people what to do!” is classic derailing and it is what the opposition has done with climate change for decades. I don’t doubt that you had good intent with your comment, though.

Re: The only thing we should be talking about is the climate crisis

#163

Post by haunter » Fri, Apr 08, 2022, 3:31 PM UTC

cogman10 wrote: post #62

mrfusion wrote: post #9

I’m a full on believer. I even own an EV but I think this alarmism is just making people numb. I think there’s a whole generation out there that never read “the boy who cried wolf”.

The big issue with climate change is it's gradual. There will never be a point where "Oh shit, everything has exploded!". Instead, it will be every year that deserts will get bigger, it will rain a little less, and a few more extreme weather events happen. This will happen just a little bit more year by year. There won't really be a point where you can say "This was the year climate change became really bad!" instead…

>There will never be a point where "Oh shit, everything has exploded!

Never say never

The Clathrate gun hypothesis pretty much about this where inside one human generation the temperatures can rise beyond any expactations

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clathrate_gun_hypothesis

Re: The only thing we should be talking about is the climate crisis

#164

Post by blisterpeanuts » Fri, Apr 08, 2022, 3:31 PM UTC

goodgoblin wrote: post #82

I'm sorry, but this is utterly unhinged. There is no evidence of weather patterns of any kind, much less indications that we are about to face "extreme-weather". What caused the weather which led to the dust-bowl? What caused the ice-age? The climate of the earth has changed for millions of years w/o humans, and while certainly greenhouse gases impact the current trends, they aren't cause for apocalyptic concern. I r…

It seems like technological innovations and lifestyle trends are already reducing human greenhouse gas production:

- Residential and commercial buildings with solar panels;

- electric vehicles (albeit, the production of EV batteries is reportedly very dirty);

- more efficient consumption of oil/gas;

- CO2 capture and sequestration;

- backyard farming (raising chickens, composting, vegetable gardening);

- growing preferences for alternatives to red meat;

- work-from-home that reduces use of the roads and highways;

- widespread acceptance of plastics recycling;

and others.

I don't understand the use of the term "crisis" when we're already implementing pretty much every possible solution, and with some other cool solutions in the pipelines such as vastly improved batteries, better and safer nuclear fission reactors, electric aircraft, better and more efficient agriculture; better recycling of plastics, etc.

I would advocate continued and improved support for these approaches through tax incentives, research grants, and education. Also, we should spur economic growth, without which we can't afford to do any of the above. We can solve this without the need to panic.

Re: The only thing we should be talking about is the climate crisis

#165

Post by jefurii » Fri, Apr 08, 2022, 3:33 PM UTC

titzer wrote: post #116

tuatoru wrote: post #86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For people on six figure salaries, owning an EV is costless virtue signalling. Do something that costs you, and you have better credibility. Here's my litmus test: commit to never flying anywhere ever again.

We could have carbon-neutral aviation, and not with electric jets. We would need to develop an infrastructure capable of producing jet fuel from other sources, e.g. nuclear power. I don't think we'll ever get energy density from batteries even close to what liquid hydrocarbons offer. We just can't get said hydrocarbons from fossil sources.

Better yet: airships or even ship ships with decent internet connections and coworking spaces. You could work on the way and the extra travel time wouldn't use up your vacation days.

Re: The only thing we should be talking about is the climate crisis

#166

Post by SideburnsOfDoom » Fri, Apr 08, 2022, 3:33 PM UTC

user982 wrote: post #128

SideburnsOfDoom wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is there a way to flag accounts that copypaste talking points into these kinds of topics?

Click the post's timestamp and tap "flag" and/or email concerns to hn@ycombinator.com.

I know about flagging posts, and that account's posts of this guff have been flagged before.

I asked about flagging accounts

Re: The only thing we should be talking about is the climate crisis

#167

Post by wbsss4412 » Fri, Apr 08, 2022, 3:34 PM UTC

fullshark wrote: post #145

wbsss4412 wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is climate change “whining about their own problems?”. The LA times author was making the point that, to him and his readers, nothing matters as much as climate change. While what is happening in Ukraine is absolutely terrible, in his mind it does not reach the level of concern that climate does. Parents response was “oh you’re so privileged”, and my point is that just about everyone on this site is. Frankly, the…

So basically you think the person is hypocrite and that makes their point invalid. I think you should consider how we are going to achieve climate goals which require political consensus given the point OP makes personally, but noted.

I don’t think Ukrainians are the ones holding back political consensus on climate change.

Privileged people arguing with each other about who has standing to put it forward as an issue certainly is though.

Re: The only thing we should be talking about is the climate crisis

#168

Post by antattack » Fri, Apr 08, 2022, 3:34 PM UTC

vasco wrote: post #16

> Nothing matters as much as our bone-headed, mass-suicidal march toward extreme-weather oblivion. Not COVID-19, not the invasion of Ukraine, not even “The Godfather.” Says a reporter living in Los Angeles, the 49th most expensive city in the world to live in. For a lot of people, what they need to talk about is how they're getting their next meal, how they're going to make rent, or survive a current war. Maybe go to…

Notably this opinion was published in entertainment and arts section.

Re: The only thing we should be talking about is the climate crisis

#169

Post by egberts1 » Fri, Apr 08, 2022, 3:34 PM UTC

all2 wrote: post #131

egberts1 wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And maintained by me, an avid reader of printed newspapers to this day.

I'd love to see copies/scans of all of these articles. That would make for fascinating reading.

Yeah, probably should do a web page containing all these news snippets.

Re: The only thing we should be talking about is the climate crisis

#170

Post by adrianN » Fri, Apr 08, 2022, 3:35 PM UTC

phkahler wrote: post #34

Isinlor wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We are nowhere near exaggerating it. We should be simple executing what was agreed in the Paris Agreement as it reflects our best evaluation of the cost to benefits ratio. But current policies are aiming at 1.5 degree higher than what we evaluated as the optimal solution.

>> We are nowhere near exaggerating it. If you want to talk about the "climate crisis", I'm going to keep pointing to the lack of good modeling in regard to water vapor and air travel (which has a specific phase relationship with sunshine that must be taken into account). I'll also try to dig up that graph correlating the rise in air travel with temperatures. I'll insist that even if I accept human cause of these cha…

The lack of good modelling is no reason to do less to reduce emissions. Poor modelling can mean that the problem is worse than the models predict. Every time we improve our models the predictions seem to get worse.