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The only thing we should be talking about is the climate crisis

latimes.com

71–80 of 198 posts

Re: The only thing we should be talking about is the climate crisis

#71
post #16

> Nothing matters as much as our bone-headed, mass-suicidal march toward extreme-weather oblivion. Not COVID-19, not the invasion of Ukraine, not even “The Godfather.” Says a reporter living in Los Angeles, the 49th most expensive city in the world to live in. For a lot of people, what they need to talk about is how they're getting their next meal, how they're going to make rent, or survive a current war. Maybe go to…

What are you trying to argue? That we should not care about climate change because there are reporters who live in expensive cities? Or that no-one living in Los Angeles is allowed an opinion?

Well most of the proposed solutions to climate change issues involve making the proles' standard of living worse which is never going to work. Even something as minor as increasing fuel taxes led to the yellow vest protests. How are any of these major curtailing of consumption solutions going to fly globally without leading to massive civil unrest?

Re: The only thing we should be talking about is the climate crisis

#72
post #14
post #2

Here are some of the many of Los Angeles Times’ newspaper headlines that they used to help with their circulations: 1966 - Oil gone in 10 years 1968 - Overpopulation will spread worldwide 1969 - Everyone will disappear in a Cloud of Blue Steam in 1989 1970 - World will use up its natural resources by 2000 1970 - Urban citizens will require gas mask by 1985 1970 - Nitrogen buildup will make all lands unusable 1970 - D…

How did you compile this 14 min after the article was posted?

Lived in Los Angeles Greater Area pretty much most of my life.

Still get that newspaper delivered to my doorstep from way over there.

Re: The only thing we should be talking about is the climate crisis

#73
post #16

> Nothing matters as much as our bone-headed, mass-suicidal march toward extreme-weather oblivion. Not COVID-19, not the invasion of Ukraine, not even “The Godfather.” Says a reporter living in Los Angeles, the 49th most expensive city in the world to live in. For a lot of people, what they need to talk about is how they're getting their next meal, how they're going to make rent, or survive a current war. Maybe go to…

The entire framing of the climate issue as "poor and middle class people need to use less energy, says a bunch of comparatively rich people living in high cost of living first world cities" guarantees political failure.

The only way we will get real traction against this problem is if we stop framing it around shame and austerity and instead frame it as a problem solvable via technological innovation that also frees us from the constraints of fossil fuel dependence.

That framing is also more correct IMHO, as there are numerous reasons to get off fossil fuels other than climate. The most significant of these is political independence and the fact that fossil fuels are a strictly limited declining resource whose depletion threatens our civilization on the supply side.

This is a technical problem not a moral problem. There is no god that is going to punish us for emitting carbon. It's just physics: more carbon, more retained solar heat, weather changes that will disrupt the food supply and threaten a bunch of major population centers.

It's also a problem about human self-interest not saving some mythical shibboleth of "unspoiled nature." Nature just is and we are only spoiling it for ourselves. As George Carlin put it: "Stop saying save the Earth! The Earth will be fine. We're fucked."

Edit: on a final note: yes it is true that we could probably absorb and adapt to even severe climate change. But the cost of non-carbon-based energy is falling rapidly as technology advances and renewable energy is scaled up, while the deferred cost of climate change is rising. These lines almost certainly intersected some time ago. Getting off fossil carbon is cheaper than continuing to make climate change worse. This effect is compounded by the fact that fossil fuels are being depleted and therefore that the more we invest in them the more fossil fuel infrastructure investment will eventually be stranded as worthless. That depletion will probably bite at about the same time as climate change, draining the economy right when that cost hits. When you consider the depletion and stranded investment angles getting off fossil fuels is probably many orders of magnitude cheaper than the alternative path.

Re: The only thing we should be talking about is the climate crisis

#74
Reading the thread, I guess all I need is to buy an EV and compost my food waste and then I won't have to worry anymore, plus have a nice moral ground to complain about climate scientists like the Republicans do.

Honestly, a huge majority of you need to be honest with yourselves: this kind of thing bugs you because you are business people, founders, people broadly trying to make serious investments in some kind of economic future that will (ultimately) lead to your (continued) success. Your aspirations are not bad in themselves, but neither is reporting about climate change, and the honesty comes in when you recognize there is a conflict of interest between the two here.

Re: The only thing we should be talking about is the climate crisis

#76
post #16

> Nothing matters as much as our bone-headed, mass-suicidal march toward extreme-weather oblivion. Not COVID-19, not the invasion of Ukraine, not even “The Godfather.” Says a reporter living in Los Angeles, the 49th most expensive city in the world to live in. For a lot of people, what they need to talk about is how they're getting their next meal, how they're going to make rent, or survive a current war. Maybe go to…

If I told a person in a war zone there was a planetary crisis that would guarantee the death of the children or grandchildren, I don't have a doubt in the world they would care about it. Just because someone living in danger or poverty doesn't make them a fool or a coward.

Given how absolutely hard it is to get people to evacuate in front of an obviously on-coming disaster such as a flood or hurricane, I think your view of people is naive at best.

Re: The only thing we should be talking about is the climate crisis

#77
post #49
post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How did you compile this 14 min after the article was posted?

That account copypastes it into climate threads: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=30258365 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27447861

Is there a way to flag accounts that copypaste talking points into these kinds of topics?

Re: The only thing we should be talking about is the climate crisis

#78
post #2

Here are some of the many of Los Angeles Times’ newspaper headlines that they used to help with their circulations: 1966 - Oil gone in 10 years 1968 - Overpopulation will spread worldwide 1969 - Everyone will disappear in a Cloud of Blue Steam in 1989 1970 - World will use up its natural resources by 2000 1970 - Urban citizens will require gas mask by 1985 1970 - Nitrogen buildup will make all lands unusable 1970 - D…

You are mixing in random headlines that were not the results of my scientific consensus (cellphones and cancer?) and headlines that warned of the bad possibilities if nothing was done. The fact that scientific and other advancements have helped avert some of the issues we were warned about shouldn’t be misinterpreted as a failure of the warning but the opposite.

Re: The only thing we should be talking about is the climate crisis

#79
post #2

Here are some of the many of Los Angeles Times’ newspaper headlines that they used to help with their circulations: 1966 - Oil gone in 10 years 1968 - Overpopulation will spread worldwide 1969 - Everyone will disappear in a Cloud of Blue Steam in 1989 1970 - World will use up its natural resources by 2000 1970 - Urban citizens will require gas mask by 1985 1970 - Nitrogen buildup will make all lands unusable 1970 - D…

[deleted]

Re: The only thing we should be talking about is the climate crisis

#80
post #16

> Nothing matters as much as our bone-headed, mass-suicidal march toward extreme-weather oblivion. Not COVID-19, not the invasion of Ukraine, not even “The Godfather.” Says a reporter living in Los Angeles, the 49th most expensive city in the world to live in. For a lot of people, what they need to talk about is how they're getting their next meal, how they're going to make rent, or survive a current war. Maybe go to…

This is a bad faith argument
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