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Tell HN: Recruiters are lying about remote positions

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Re: Tell HN: Recruiters are lying about remote positions

#221

Post by bumbledraven »

calvinmorrison wrote: post #159
ShakataGaNai wrote: post #137

Ask the people you're talking to where the teammates are, the expectations of return to office. Ask them in the very first call. Either they'll be offended because they probably have nefarious plans (dodged a huge time waste), or they'll happily explain how their team is spread across 4 timezones and could never return to the office since there isn't one. Sadly "remote" is just a buzzword to a lot of people. But on t…

At my last role, I got all the way to the "signing your hiring paperwork" to find out that vaccines were mandatory for all new hires. Seeing as that's 30% of the workforce or so who isn't, and this being a senior level position, and a year more after they were first available (meaning, anyone who wanted to get a vaccine - probably would have already)... you'd think they'd bring that up day one. I about flipped shit o…

If it's that important to you, it probably wouldn't hurt to get a prospective employer's vaccine policy in writing before accepting an offer. You can ask for that without revealing your own views on the subject.

Re: Tell HN: Recruiters are lying about remote positions

#222

Post by [deleted] »

MivLives wrote: post #131
vasco wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

+1 On this. Find somewhere that was remote before pandemic or that shifted fully. I've worked fully remotely for the same company for almost 6 years now. Having worked in an office before, one belief I've formed over the years is that working at a place that doesn't have remote at the core and that has staff that's remote and staff that isn't, would create a two-tier system and I'd be very afraid of trying it. In fac…

The company I'm working for is struggling with this. They firmly believe in no remote. They won't entertain it for juniors, and generally to get approval you need to be pretty vital. But at the same time they've also opened up multiple offices (that are all in different geos, timezones). What the end result is that in my section of the company I'm effectively remote working from the off as my team has a remote contra…

[deleted]

Re: Tell HN: Recruiters are lying about remote positions

#224

Post by bachmeier »

throwaway787544 wrote: post #176
mystickphoenix wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Focusing on remote-only, remote-first, remote-from-scratch companies is how I ended up at my current, and literally best company I've ever worked for, gig. Obviously the pool of such companies is smaller than in-person and they tend to have more competition for roles, but my unscientific guess is that pool is growing larger. Bonus points for those companies because they didn't have to "figure it out" or change upper…

I am still flabbergasted that more companies have not gotten it through their skulls yet. Even if you keep an office, all-remote is simply a better model. Not only do you have access to a global labor pool (including the best candidates), the communication is better and work is more flexible (which literally everyone appreciates), you can lower overhead or even hire people for less based on location. The only major d…

A funny thing in this regard is that companies using an open office to save money are often not willing to go remote because they are worried it will hurt productivity.

Re: Tell HN: Recruiters are lying about remote positions

#225

Post by kurthr »

You could have stopped with "Recruiters are lying"... however if the hiring manager said it was for a remote position that is still a verbal contract with a Deep Pockets entity. You're still not hired (and it's At Will), but if they require to show up on-site after hiring without telling you they could open themselves up to legal liability. If you (or your friends) are "quitting" anyway, it may be worth letting HR know the liability position they are putting the company in. Especially, if multiple people all file against the same company with the same complaint, they become more likely to settle out of court (for PR reasons) than fight.

Unlikely that you'll keep the jobs, though.

Re: Tell HN: Recruiters are lying about remote positions

#227

Post by snorkel »

ShakataGaNai wrote: post #137

Ask the people you're talking to where the teammates are, the expectations of return to office. Ask them in the very first call. Either they'll be offended because they probably have nefarious plans (dodged a huge time waste), or they'll happily explain how their team is spread across 4 timezones and could never return to the office since there isn't one. Sadly "remote" is just a buzzword to a lot of people. But on t…

Good advice, and should also ask if the team was mostly WFH before Covid because old habits die hard.

Re: Tell HN: Recruiters are lying about remote positions

#228

Post by jrd259 »

aaomidi wrote: post #90
cheeze wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And?

https://www.inc.com/jason-aten/amazons-controversial-hire-to... I don't think most of us want to go for the lottery. Also: Majority of amazon alumni I've had experience with (to be fair it's not a lot) has been extremely toxic and a they've been a jerk. I don't blame the individuals. They are probably required to be a jerk to survive at Amazon and unlearning that is hard as fuck.

That report is nonsense. For one thing, hiring takes a lot of work. No manager is going to invest the time in hiring someone just to have an expendable on the team to sacrifice. No manager is going to accept the drag on the team that arises by having a below-standards person on the team. Everyone here is clear that we'd rather do without than have a low-performing co-worker. Finally, even if some misguided manager did want to do this, each Amazon hiring loop has an independent person to enforce the policy that each new hire be better than half the people in a similar role.

It's true that some people leave, and sometimes you're not sorry to see them go. This is true in every line of work.

Re: Tell HN: Recruiters are lying about remote positions

#229

Post by BLO716 »

This is exactly the experience you get with a military recruiter, but on some other deep level of cohesion and intimidation. It's like the used car dealer of legend that your dad (or mom, to be fair) told you about and never to trust them much like the class of mechanics that were (and some if not most?) dishonest about what you were being sold as a service or job detail.

I remember going through the Air Force wanted para-rescue CC (specifically the path to get there, not the direct application into) and man was a sold a bill of goods. Grades amazing, physically (at that time not an software developer [slowly slouching fat sloth profile in 2022]) fit, and ready for a career in the service.

The promises that dude that recruited me were legendary. My pops was a military and the whole family basically, and even he was amazed at what I was offered. He eventually said to go to college and if you wanted it go to OCS school.

Point being, this is not new in times of great demand on talent - in my case, it was retention of and callbacks that active duty members trying to retire were experiencing during the first decade of our involvement in the Iraq/Afghanistan conflicts.

Its insane, how some talent is scouted in this way. But .. if its on paper, through the process its grounds for legal action. Will it ever happen? depends, but most likely not.

Just walk into the interviews with open eyes and be authentic, and most importantly honest on some level about this in specific going forward. I'd say use it for all relationships you want professionally, because well - "it's just business" in the end.

Re: Tell HN: Recruiters are lying about remote positions

#230

Post by toomuchtodo »

bialpio wrote: post #219
spaniard89277 wrote: post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dude, you're an employee. If management doesn't respect you, look elsewhere. You're working in IT, it's not like you can't change work. You'll risk getting less money, but if you're happier who cares?

Small note: there are people who cannot change work in IT because it would affect their visa or immigration status.

H1-B transfer is possible if your potential new employer will perform the transfer with USCIS.

(Edit: typo corrected, thanks kaapipo)

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