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One App – Two Worlds: This Is TikTok in Russia and Ukraine

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Re: One App – Two Worlds: This Is TikTok in Russia and Ukraine

#311

Post by NoOn3 »

asveikau wrote: post #222
hermannj314 wrote: post #193

Aggressor nations have the privilege of lying to themselves on the consequences and reality of their wars. The defenders do not get the privilege to ignore that. Americans barely talked about Afghanistan. For 20 years, our internet was full of funny videos, stupid songs, and memes of Osama bin Laden. Sure we bombed civilians targets and committed war crimes too, but we had very smart lawyers that taught us clever wor…

On the other hand... I was really against the Iraq war and nobody ever threatened me with 15 years of jail for it. The architects of that conflict left when term limits were up. (Putin did not.) Don't get me wrong, Iraq was pointless. Afghanistan seemed to have a justification at the start but was mismanaged early on. In terms of culture, wide swaths of the population were brainwashed in a similar way to how we talk…

I don't really think if you will do peaceful express your opinion against war in Russia maybe with single protest you will get a real term in prison only a monetary fine and even this is not always the case.

Re: One App – Two Worlds: This Is TikTok in Russia and Ukraine

#312

Post by sharken »

blaser-waffle wrote: post #251
ec109685 wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This where sanctions could be used. TikTok is profiting by keeping this neutered version up in Russia, so US government could prohibit making money in US until they take it down in Russia.

Tik Tok is Chinese -- and was raged against by Trump for that reason -- and would constitute picking a fight with the CCP. That's a big ole can of worms to open up while running other big-deal sanctions and playing the brinkmanship game with Russia.

Absolutely, it's tempting to go after China as well using the saying, If you're not with us, you're against us.

But the current strategy of appealing to China to at least not help Russia in any way, is the best outcome.

And thankfully China has opted to pursue a rather novel way of fighting COVID, which prevents them from getting stronger economically.

Re: One App – Two Worlds: This Is TikTok in Russia and Ukraine

#313

Post by HatchedLake721 »

cbjoerke wrote: post #8
sdfhbdf wrote: post #4

This article is well made and uncovers very interesting thing. I love how it was technically put together, browsing it on mobile was a great experience, chapeaux bas, i love how great new formats are available to publishers in the digital era outside of serving autoplaying ads. On thing that caught my attention was the supposed USCentric approach since it counted a distance in miles. I also wonder whether it was tran…

Hi! Thanks for your kind words. We have corrected it to kilometeres. All the best, Christian/NRK

Would you consider creating a Russian version of this?

Re: One App – Two Worlds: This Is TikTok in Russia and Ukraine

#314

Post by standardUser »

cabirum wrote: post #172
Zanfa wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Given russian media is legally only allowed to spout government-approved propaganda, it really makes sense to ban them from social media. This does not equal to only allowing pro-Ukrainian media.

Why don't you call pro-Ukrainian media "propaganda"? They did recently ban all but a few pro-gov political parties, and all their media is equally under total government control

The goal is not a media free of bias because it's generally agreed that's simply not a possibility. So instead, the goal is a media that attempts to limit and acknowledge its biases. Western media usually attempts this (with mixed success). Russian media does not attempt this. That is the difference.

Re: One App – Two Worlds: This Is TikTok in Russia and Ukraine

#315

Post by standardUser »

luke_value wrote: post #158
toxik wrote: post #24

The dream of the internet as some sort of great democratizing force is already dead and buried, but for any who still believes, this must surely be the final nail in that coffin. Controlling the narrative is only a problem for existing democracies with press freedom. All bets are off once the threat model includes control of the media. So cherish your freedom of speech, and exercise and defend it. I don’t know what t…

Imagine believing there is freedom of speech in liberal democracies in 2022...

Can you tell us precisely which speech is being silenced by the government in the US in 2022?

Re: One App – Two Worlds: This Is TikTok in Russia and Ukraine

#316

Post by mda »

pydry wrote: post #256
KarlKemp wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s the sort of cynicism RT want you to adopt, yes.

RT didnt fire the director general for not towing the line on Iraqs WMDs.

Oh I am pretty sure any member of RT would face a much more interesting punishment if they decide to go against their owners will.

Re: One App – Two Worlds: This Is TikTok in Russia and Ukraine

#317

Post by bacan »

ShivShankaran wrote: post #266
bacan wrote: post #219

This is exactly what happens when algorithms tailor what people see on their newsfeed. They will push narratives. One of the main reasons I prefer Reddit is the existence of r/All. Provides a very balanced view

reddit is one of the absolutely most gamed social media on the internet. Don't forget that the "head of content" that was hired few years back is from NATO with no technical background. Reddit is on harcore mode right now deleting entire subreddits and permabanning people that even slightly critique NATO or Ukraine. /r/all is nauseatingly full of "russia bad, ukraine good" with mindless flinging of feces. Yall be bla…

I would suggest watching Death of Stalin (2018) to understand why Russia bad

Re: One App – Two Worlds: This Is TikTok in Russia and Ukraine

#318

Post by bacan »

goldenchrome wrote: post #243
bacan wrote: post #219

This is exactly what happens when algorithms tailor what people see on their newsfeed. They will push narratives. One of the main reasons I prefer Reddit is the existence of r/All. Provides a very balanced view

If you think Reddit isn’t highly curated too, you’re wrong. Perhaps you could make that argument 10 years ago but no longer. In the last few years Reddit has taken on hundreds of millions of dollars of funding to morph the site into a more mainstream advertiser-friendly offering. They’ve silenced lots of controversial communities by outright banning them or neutered them with “quarantines”. Over the years, Reddit has…

Curated sure.

Tailored to individual tastes - absolutely not

Kinda like a newspaper

Re: One App – Two Worlds: This Is TikTok in Russia and Ukraine

#319

Post by qiskit »

KarlKemp wrote: post #279
qiskit wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The BBC funding is primarily through TV licensing fees, so it's essentially an optional tax. That's a long-winded and highly convoluted way of saying government funded. You have to admire the BBC. They've done such a good job brainwashing people that they jump through all kinds of hoops to hide the fact that the BBC is government funded state propaganda. BBC is what RT aspires to be one day.

No, see, that's but one example of how your unwillingness or inability to accept any complexity or nuance gets in the way of thinking. The TV license system is set up specifically so that the institution is somewhat isolated from day-to-day politics. It's a completely different situation if the PM can decide on a whim to fund you or not, or if there's a difficult-to-change law that sets the fees that you get for a de…

> No, see, that's but one example of how your unwillingness or inability to accept any complexity or nuance gets in the way of thinking.

Or maybe I've heard the "tv license" excuse for many years now. Nothing you wrote is new to me. Surprised you didn't post a link to BBC edited wikipedia article.

> If you insist that everything is the same and all politicians are corrupt and all media are lying then you're just giving away any power you might have.

No. I insist that propaganda is propaganda. I've no problem saying RT is state propaganda because that's exactly what RT is. I've no problem saying that BBC is state propaganda because that's exactly what they are. I've no problem calling putin a corrupt politician. Just like I have no problem calling zelensky or biden or trump a corrupt politician.

What you are saying is my corrupt politician isn't corrupt because he is on my team. My favorite propaganda outlet isn't propaganda because they are on my team. That's the difference between you and me.

> That's why RT loves cynicism and tries to amplify exactly that work view: it's a self-fulfilling prophesy.

Where did I hear that from? Oh that's right, it's the anti-RT propaganda. Funny how that works huh? Funny how propaganda say X and people just repeat it endlessly? You are the one amplifying propaganda you heard not me.

But believe what you want. BBC is a government created and funded state propaganda. This is a historical fact. You can invent all kinds of excuses if it helps you sleep at night. But it doesn't change reality. How crazy is it that only our enemies have propaganda? Only russia, china, north korea, etc have propaganda. We don't have propaganda. Nope. Your comment is proof that we have the best propaganda.

Re: One App – Two Worlds: This Is TikTok in Russia and Ukraine

#320

Post by VincentEvans »

Westerners should stop projecting their culture and values on Russians when trying to make sense of what is going on. Russians are not these poor bamboozled fools. Support for Putin is real. Denial of atrocities and justification for war is not rooted in ignorance, but pride.

For years Kremlin cultivated in Russians a sense of injured pride, something akin to the “straight white male” victimhood and persecution complex you see in US fringe groups. Russians were told of greatnesses of their achievements of the past, and how it was stolen from them, how the West is weak, gullible, and corrupt, and is trying to sabotage the inevitable rise of Russia to it’s destined glory.

Russians have enough access to sources of truth, but their world view simply does not compel them to believe those sources that create dissonance with their righteous cause - they can’t be brother killing monsters that rape mothers in front of their children, crush people with tanks, bomb maternity hospitals - so it’s obviously all lies. And since everyone is accusing them of this - then it simply means that everyone is lying and will get what is coming to them.

How do I know this? I was born in Soviet Union, am Russian-speaking and I am unable to explain my anger and grief over what is happening to my own father who thinks that I am a fool to believe in propaganda staged videos full of crisis actors manufactured by Western media.

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