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Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

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Re: Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

#291

Post by staticassertion »

ryan_j_naughton wrote: post #284
gernb wrote: post #246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Agreed, domain admins can also lock down Windows, iOS, Android, and MacOS. The school is effectively making the computer a terminal into their system. Their system, their rules. I know the OP won't like this answer but the OP should buy their kid another computer for their non-school activities. Of course they could also complain to their school/district to change the polices. Personally, I'm used to it. I have a per…

That corp computer is owned by your employer. If instead you are a consultant who does work for several clients on your own machine, then it would be unreasonable for them to lockdown your personal machine. Instead, if they want you to use a more secure solution, they should provide the computer.

Right, but if you add your account to their organization so that you can get onto their network dont be surprised when they push policies.

Re: Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

#292

Post by staticassertion »

SamBam wrote: post #234
fiddlerwoaroof wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One solution could be to setup the laptop with a personal email account and configure the school email address to forward everything.

If the student needs to use a Chromebook for school, that won't work. On my daughter's Chromebook, every app and website is tied to the account. It's not just a question of forwarding email.

You can have multiple accounts on a Chromebook.

Re: Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

#293

Post by hedora »

evilDagmar wrote: post #173
quadrifoliate wrote: post #116

> I bought him a Chromebook for schoolwork, but also for other private things. When we logged in... This is why you need to pay attention to the technology choices that you make, and that your schools make. Chromebooks are designed from the ground up to be locked-down dystopian spyware once you "log in" to them with a specific Google account. For heaven's sake stop buying any more Chromebooks. The correct solution he…

> Chromebooks are designed from the ground up to be locked-down dystopian spyware once you "log in" to them with a specific Google account. Nonsense. They were designed to implement required policies when someone logs into a managed domain. Unless you're logging into something like that (where disclosures have been made and consent has been obtained) then there's no "dystopian spyware" involved. Absent any domain man…

> consent has been obtained

Has it been, in this case? If a parent says 'I do not agree to this', then what? Will the school district swap the system out for one that doesn't require end users to waive their legal rights? Has that ever happened when a parent objected to one of these EULAs, even once?

Re: Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

#294

Post by 0des »

yeetsfromhellL2 wrote: post #46
deathanatos wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> to your kid being a minor in school which means they don't have full legal rights, and the interpretation of 4A is likely up in the air here anyway IANAL, either. Just because the student is a minor, I don't see how that gives the school the right to pwn a private laptop (were the laptop a school laptop, my opinion would be different here); at best, this would seem to be the parent's machine, or right to decide, at…

pwning the laptop was a req for doing school work, like how you essentially give prior consent to a field sobriety test when you get a drivers license. I'm not saying it's right, but that likely the school district's argument in court, and I'm sure it's buried deep in a EULA or privacy policy somewhere.

> you essentially give prior consent to a field sobriety test when you get a drivers license

If USA, this is false.

Re: Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

#296

Post by alexb_ »

n8cpdx wrote: post #134
quadrifoliate wrote: post #116

> I bought him a Chromebook for schoolwork, but also for other private things. When we logged in... This is why you need to pay attention to the technology choices that you make, and that your schools make. Chromebooks are designed from the ground up to be locked-down dystopian spyware once you "log in" to them with a specific Google account. For heaven's sake stop buying any more Chromebooks. The correct solution he…

> Call into the school's board meeting during public comment, and make it loud and clear that the school is installing spyware on students' Chromebooks. Share your technical credentials and the method by which you found this. Just some comments on the political aspect of this, since the HN crowd tends to not be so good at that part: - Following this advice and using a tone that even resembles the tone of the comment…

The biggest thing is that if you are calling to complain, then you will IMMEDIATELY be discredited. They don't have any reason to keep you happy, so complaints mean absolutely nothing. You cannot come with complaints - you must come with a solution, already prepared, such that it is easier for them to implement the solution than to not. People will always, 100% of the time, take the path of least resistance - actually make the path not resistant at all and it's the only way you can convince anyone to do anything.

Re: Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

#297

Post by amatecha »

I find this stuff so disheartening. It's like, "how early can we indoctrinate kids into being comfortable being watched and having their every move tracked?" I don't even care what the justifications are. Preventing cheating? Before everyone had personal computers and the internet, people could just copy each others' work.

This kind of crap is fundamentally a violation of students' right to privacy. They deserve to grow up in a safe environment away from the prying eyes of crappy adults.

I mean, to that point, how secure is GoGuardian? Who has access to the administrative tools/etc.? What APTs have gained access to its systems? A system breach of any online system is effectively inevitable, or at least impossible to rule out. Do you think everyone with a Verkada camera thought hackers around the world are going to be tuning into their video feed?[0]

Anyway, stop buying tech that force you to give up your right to privacy to use it. You don't have to go 100%, but at least start looking at these kind of things before you shell out your hard-earned dollars.

[0] https://www.theverge.com/2021/3/9/22322122/verkada-hack-1500...

Re: Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

#298

Post by amatecha »

Root_Denied wrote: post #235
indymike wrote: post #227

I fought this with a suburban school system in Indiana and won. The spyware was installed on Chromebooks I bought. Before contacting the school, I monitored network traffic for about 1 HR and found a an ad fraud click bot and logging being sent to India. When I contacted the school my ask was they remove the spyware from my Chromebooks. The first answer was, no. I asked again via the superintendent, and got a call fr…

That's great for your situation - what about the rest of the people in your district? Did you reach out to other parents and make this problem known publicly, along with your solution, so that other parents could decide for themselves (individually or collectively) what their response should be? Seems like this would be a slam dunk of a local news piece for some newspaper/website.

Yup, stuff like this should be on the local news. While most parents will go "ehhh I trust the government and if my kid is doing something bad I want to hear about it", the ones who actually care about their kids' rights will raise a huge stink and the district is more likely to not only be more upfront about this stuff but also probably make opting out easier.

Re: Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

#299

Post by raldi »

Even if you send your kid to school with a paper notebook, the staff has always had the legal power to seize and read it. If anything, the school shootings era has expanded that authority even beyond the broad latitude it was granted before: https://www.ascd.org/el/articles/the-right-to-search-student...

(Before replying, please note that I'm not expressing any opinion about whether this is good or bad; it's just how it is.)

Re: Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

#300

Post by imduffy15 »

My bet is you could remove the user. Do some DNS messing about either on your router or hosts file to drop all communications to goguardian and then resign into your sons account.

The end result will be that the school management scripts will still run but they’ll be unable to fetch and install goguardian.

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