Exit interviews are a trap • Hacker News Board

Re: Exit interviews are a trap

#351

Post by ClumsyPilot » Mon, Apr 04, 2022, 11:45 PM UTC

throw1230 wrote: post #246

ClumsyPilot wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"If however, you have this kind of attitude of blame-shifting and finger pointing" They asked him whether anything is wrong, they don't get to complain about the answer. On the other hand, for a senior person to go around town and spread rumours about a (presumably) junior team member is exactly the kind of behaviour I want nothing to do with. This comment is miopic, seems the closer you are to the top the less matur…

None of the feedback OP has given to HR has any substance. If you throw around heavy words like this, you better know how to back your words up. - passive aggressive: This is a personal judgment. He was passive aggressive in what way? - excluded you from the team: How was he excluded? Was he not invited to events? Or did he not get good projects? If you are a temp with potential performance problems, it's normal that…

> "- passive aggressive: This is a personal judgment... missing roadmap because poor design decisions: Again a junior opinion"

So you asked a Junior person for his opinion and you complain that you got Junior's opinion? What did you expect, to get a senior executive's opinion?

It's irrelevant if his opinions are incompetent - let's imagine he got fired for being an complete idiot. Then you asked for his opinion, and complain that it's an idiotic opinion. That means we have at least two idiots!

What in the world are these complains about negativity, is management entitled to love and loyalty from employees it fired? This sounds like a North-Korea style dictatorship, not a company.

If they are too daft to know that fired employees might provide negative feedback, or if their fragile egos can't handle it - that's their problem.

Let me make a parallel that might be clearer:

If someone comes up to me tells me I smell, that's kind of offensive.

But it if I go to someone and spesifically ask them 'do I smell', they might answer 'Yes'.

I don't get to complain that they are not a qualified perfumer, or their judgement is poor - I picked them, I asked them. And I certainly don't get to go around town telling everyone how they are a terrible person.

Re: Exit interviews are a trap

#352

Post by thenerdhead » Mon, Apr 04, 2022, 11:50 PM UTC

If you are fearful of telling the truth in an exit interview or avoiding it entirely out of fear of burning bridges, I think you may have more problems to work through. This is your one opportunity for closure and to say your piece to bring you peace.

The harsh reality is that plenty of people vent about why they are leaving teams, orgs, divisions, and companies. Nothing changes and then more people leave. Then those managers who got all the feedback leave and people start to see the house of cards fall down.

If a single person or company dictates your career for any reason, you have much bigger problems to worry about.

Re: Exit interviews are a trap

#353

Post by TedShiller » Mon, Apr 04, 2022, 11:55 PM UTC

“The pay was too high. I didn’t know what to do with all the money”

Re: Exit interviews are a trap

#354

Post by RhysU » Mon, Apr 04, 2022, 11:57 PM UTC

notch656a wrote: post #297

bradlys wrote: post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like I’ve been at more companies than you and I started in 2013. The fuck. The game is about presenting an image that doesn’t actually exist. It’s about not acknowledging your manager is a toxic piece of shit and your company is completely broken and will likely be bankrupt in a few years while execs milk every ounce from it. It’s about faking positivity and that you’re so excited to join the company because i…

The game still exists in companies that build physical products, but I've found it's not quite as bad there. You're right, SV is the king of lying, along with any publicly traded company. My experience is small privately held businesses that offer physical product are the most pragmatic and 'honest.' The closer you are to the source of income, the less everything but the money matters. I like being only 1-2 steps fro…

This is why I choose to be near a revenue center rather than a cost center.

Re: Exit interviews are a trap

#355

Post by say_it_as_it_is » Tue, Apr 05, 2022, 12:02 AM UTC

You don't need to lie about your work situation. You don't need to tell anyone anything. Just don't go to the meeting.

Re: Exit interviews are a trap

#356

Post by [deleted] » Tue, Apr 05, 2022, 12:02 AM UTC

bsnnkv wrote: post #146

aroundtown wrote: post #99

I made the mistake and told the truth one time early in my career. I got fired, err... I wasn't retained after a multi-month temp period, and was brought in to be fired, then exit interviewed. I was upset, but stuck to the truth. My direct boss was passive aggressive, didn't like me, and excluded me from the team. His code was awful, in the long term wasn't maintainable, and wouldn't be able to meet the needs of the…

I feel like people like this are fair game for naming and shaming.

[deleted]

Re: Exit interviews are a trap

#357

Post by selcuka » Tue, Apr 05, 2022, 12:12 AM UTC

throw1230 wrote: post #246

ClumsyPilot wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"If however, you have this kind of attitude of blame-shifting and finger pointing" They asked him whether anything is wrong, they don't get to complain about the answer. On the other hand, for a senior person to go around town and spread rumours about a (presumably) junior team member is exactly the kind of behaviour I want nothing to do with. This comment is miopic, seems the closer you are to the top the less matur…

None of the feedback OP has given to HR has any substance. If you throw around heavy words like this, you better know how to back your words up. - passive aggressive: This is a personal judgment. He was passive aggressive in what way? - excluded you from the team: How was he excluded? Was he not invited to events? Or did he not get good projects? If you are a temp with potential performance problems, it's normal that…

I guess the main point is they were exit interviewed by the HR, but then the conversation was leaked to their direct manager. That's a no-no regardless of the OP was right in their accusations or not.

Re: Exit interviews are a trap

#358

Post by bradlys » Tue, Apr 05, 2022, 12:12 AM UTC

notch656a wrote: post #297

bradlys wrote: post #289

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like I’ve been at more companies than you and I started in 2013. The fuck. The game is about presenting an image that doesn’t actually exist. It’s about not acknowledging your manager is a toxic piece of shit and your company is completely broken and will likely be bankrupt in a few years while execs milk every ounce from it. It’s about faking positivity and that you’re so excited to join the company because i…

The game still exists in companies that build physical products, but I've found it's not quite as bad there. You're right, SV is the king of lying, along with any publicly traded company. My experience is small privately held businesses that offer physical product are the most pragmatic and 'honest.' The closer you are to the source of income, the less everything but the money matters. I like being only 1-2 steps fro…

I've been really close to the money making side of things and it hasn't changed anything. I think it's all dictated by the culture of the company. Almost every time, I work on the things that are making money and then the politics, the games, and the noise just come through no matter what.

Maybe it works different in the physical goods space but as far as software goes - I see no difference no matter how close you are to the source of revenue.

Re: Exit interviews are a trap

#359

Post by cloudyporpoise » Tue, Apr 05, 2022, 12:14 AM UTC

I've had two exit interviews and I was brutally honest on both, and both times I ended up forming stronger relationships as a result of my brutal honesty. The first time I left for significantly more money, so it's an easy way to leave on good terms. During my exit interview, I gave honest feedback about the pay-scales and where I thought pay should be. After my departure, my entire team and the incoming new hires were given pay raises to exactly what I discussed with the hiring director and manager. While the author may argue that this doesn't benefit me directly, it benefited me indirectly in that my colleagues will remember me as the guy that helped them get more money and my superiors remember me as the guy that gave honest feedback and left for more money.

The second time around, I had a boss who I felt was a terrible leader and micromanager. I actually ended up having 3 exit interviews.. one with my boss, which was very short and I told him how he and his management style was directly the reason I was leaving. The next two interviews were with the CEO and an investor in the company where I was once again brutally honest about my bosses management style and some other negative feedback about the state of the company. While I may have burned a bridge with my direct boss, I formed a good relationship with a CEO and PE investor who even offered to help place me in any of the companies they invest in if I chose to stay with the company.

It's great to give your take on something, but the assertive titles on an opinionated generalization are getting annoying.

Re: Exit interviews are a trap

#360

Post by bb88 » Tue, Apr 05, 2022, 12:18 AM UTC

HR has truly become the most corrupt organization in a company in 2022 -- basically the KGB, and they work like it as well. Information flows in only, but the information needed to protect employees from sexual harassment doesn't flow back to the people who need it most. They only talk openly to management, and they extort the employees into silence through threats.