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Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

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Re: Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

#121

Post by gime_tree_fiddy »

detaro wrote: post #94
MereInterest wrote: post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That doesn't really make sense to me. User accounts, whether managed remotely or locally, should be subordinate to administrator accounts. That administrator-level privileges are insufficient to undo a change made with user-level privileges breaks this relationship.

OP didn't mention that the child's account is a secondary account. AFAIK if you log-in with an account the first time on a fresh(ly reset) chromebook, it becomes the "administrator" account - and at the same time if its in an organization (i.e. the school) the orgs policies are applied. No clue how that interacts if you do attempt to login such account as a second account, it's possible the org can require an account…

I think it works similarly on Android phones. Google policy for the Android Corp devices requires you to set it up using corp account, then add secondary personal accounts(if needed).

Re: Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

#122

Post by gime_tree_fiddy »

duxup wrote: post #98
MereInterest wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> That’s pretty much how Chrome OS works. And that's the problem. Signing onto a remote account is a request to access a remote resource, and should not be interpreted as granted the remote actor control over local resources. That Chrome OS works this way implies that Chrome OS is fundamentally flawed.

Maybe there should be more of a notice, but when I tried it with my son’s account I got some notifications. Having said all that the default will be for most school accounts… all or nothing. Don’t allow them to manage it and you won’t get in.

Can't speak for OP, but generally this is mentioned during the sign in process, so it should be laid out. It is effectively all or nothing.

Re: Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

#123

Post by ocdtrekkie »

quadrifoliate wrote: post #116

> I bought him a Chromebook for schoolwork, but also for other private things. When we logged in... This is why you need to pay attention to the technology choices that you make, and that your schools make. Chromebooks are designed from the ground up to be locked-down dystopian spyware once you "log in" to them with a specific Google account. For heaven's sake stop buying any more Chromebooks. The correct solution he…

It's also worth noting that Google is almost undoubtably violating childrens privacy laws, and other states are already investigating this... it's very possible what CPS is doing here isn't even legal. There's a lot of reason that the agreements schools are making to bring Google's platform in should be dragged out into the light.

Source: https://www.theverge.com/2020/2/20/21145698/google-student-p...

Re: Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

#124

Post by spamizbad »

quadrifoliate wrote: post #116

> I bought him a Chromebook for schoolwork, but also for other private things. When we logged in... This is why you need to pay attention to the technology choices that you make, and that your schools make. Chromebooks are designed from the ground up to be locked-down dystopian spyware once you "log in" to them with a specific Google account. For heaven's sake stop buying any more Chromebooks. The correct solution he…

CPS does not really have a traditional school board and it’s not elected either (appointed by one of several mayors who ran on an elected school board and then reneged). OP can shout their complaints out over Lake Michigan for the same effect.

Re: Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

#125

Post by michaelmrose »

MereInterest wrote: post #82
detaro wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They did a factory reset and reconnected the Chromebook to the school account, which configures the device according to the schools requirements. If they wanted to use it themselves, they would reset it, do not connect the school account and all is well. GPs argument seems to support that the school doesn't have to allow to use a school account without the device being put under the schools control. (at least as I un…

That doesn't really make sense to me. User accounts, whether managed remotely or locally, should be subordinate to administrator accounts. That administrator-level privileges are insufficient to undo a change made with user-level privileges breaks this relationship.

You were never the owner of the chromebook in the first place so Google the actual owner just transferred control to the school. They never needed your permission to do this in the first place because you just paid full fare for an unlimited rental of someone else's property.

Re: Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

#126

Post by jabbany »

MereInterest wrote: post #82
detaro wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They did a factory reset and reconnected the Chromebook to the school account, which configures the device according to the schools requirements. If they wanted to use it themselves, they would reset it, do not connect the school account and all is well. GPs argument seems to support that the school doesn't have to allow to use a school account without the device being put under the schools control. (at least as I un…

That doesn't really make sense to me. User accounts, whether managed remotely or locally, should be subordinate to administrator accounts. That administrator-level privileges are insufficient to undo a change made with user-level privileges breaks this relationship.

They are, but there has always been a contention between local admin vs domain admin (managed accounts) and usually the case has been that the domain admin overrules the local but the local admin can un-join the domain.

This is not that different. The moment you join the remote domain, you no longer have top privileges. You can still unjoin at any point but as soon as you join, you're placed under a different hierarchy.

Re: Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

#127

Post by ghostpepper »

xg15 wrote: post #96
duxup wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I logged in with my son’s school account on chrome OS it had some notifications about who owns the account and so on. I don’t think it is as much a mystery as implied. In the end there’s no getting around that mixing device uses like this doesn’t work. It works less and less as the history of computers goes on.

Can the managed account actually access files from the unmanaged account or control which processes are active while the unmanaged account runs? Because, if yes, this absolutely does sound like a security hole: 1) Set up an organisation and add a managed account. Set up policies that install a backdoor on first login. 2) Get hold of victim's Chromebook. 3) Log into the Chromebook using the account from (1) 4) Chromeb…

Does a chromebook allow you to have more than one user account? It sounds like a factory reset was necessary to allow enrollment

Re: Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

#128

Post by xattt »

spamizbad wrote: post #124
quadrifoliate wrote: post #116

> I bought him a Chromebook for schoolwork, but also for other private things. When we logged in... This is why you need to pay attention to the technology choices that you make, and that your schools make. Chromebooks are designed from the ground up to be locked-down dystopian spyware once you "log in" to them with a specific Google account. For heaven's sake stop buying any more Chromebooks. The correct solution he…

CPS does not really have a traditional school board and it’s not elected either (appointed by one of several mayors who ran on an elected school board and then reneged). OP can shout their complaints out over Lake Michigan for the same effect.

The next step would be to approach a local news station and have OP report what he found, again emphasizing his own credentials.

Spyware and children in the same sentence easily bring up unpleasant thoughts.

Re: Tell HN: My kid's school installed spyware and I can't remove it

#129

Post by quadrifoliate »

spamizbad wrote: post #124
quadrifoliate wrote: post #116

> I bought him a Chromebook for schoolwork, but also for other private things. When we logged in... This is why you need to pay attention to the technology choices that you make, and that your schools make. Chromebooks are designed from the ground up to be locked-down dystopian spyware once you "log in" to them with a specific Google account. For heaven's sake stop buying any more Chromebooks. The correct solution he…

CPS does not really have a traditional school board and it’s not elected either (appointed by one of several mayors who ran on an elected school board and then reneged). OP can shout their complaints out over Lake Michigan for the same effect.

A few minutes of Googling showed me this upcoming meeting https://www.cpsboe.org/meetings/details/2329 on April 27th, 2022. It seems to be a Chicago Board of Education meeting, and seems to have options for public participation.

Do I have this wrong? I'm not from Chicago or Illinois, so that's quite possible.

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