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I'm a scam prevention expert and I got scammed

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Re: I'm a scam prevention expert and I got scammed

#151

Post by tempestn »

klik99 wrote: post #21

There's one easy rule that could have avoided all of this - never give out any info on incoming calls. If I get a call or text about fraudulent transactions, I'll keep them on hold while I log into the bank website. If I get a call about a late payment, I'll thank them for the info and ask them to stay on while I pay online. If I get an inbound call with a more complex request, I'll ask them for their employee info a…

This is good advice, despite it being a pain sometimes! I once got a voicemail from the fraud department at my bank, with a number to call back. I googled the number and all that came up were stories about being scammed. So I was 95% sure it was a scam, but called my bank directly just in case. The person who answered assured me they hadn't contacted me, and it was indeed a scam. I later got a follow-up voicemail from the "fraud department", from the same supposed scam number, which I ignored.

Then, the next time I went to use my card, it was blocked. I called the bank again and spoke to someone new, who informed me that the original calls had been legitimate - they had the same reference number and everything - and the card had been blocked due to lack of response!

Obviously a false positive on the scam detector is less of a problem than a false negative, but was still pretty incredible. No idea what was with all the people talking about being scammed from that number online; I can only assume that they (like the first rep) assumed it was a scam, since if the bank needs to call you, they should tell you to call back using the number on your card, not some random number they give you. But apparently that's exactly what they did.

Re: I'm a scam prevention expert and I got scammed

#153

Post by 1270018080 »

rolobio wrote: post #6

I nearly got taken by a scammer because Amazon transferred me to one. I purchased a set of Reolink cameras on Amazon, (they've been great) one of them failed a couple months in. I contacted Amazon customer support (via my Amazon login and in their interface) and they wanted to troubleshoot with their technical team. Eventually the (very helpful) Amazon technician suggested contacting Reolink for support and started a…

Amazon hasn't been usable in a long time for me. It takes more time to find non-counterfeit/trash products than it's worth.

Re: I'm a scam prevention expert and I got scammed

#154

Post by aldebran »

dangus wrote: post #100

The author ("scam prevention expert") was extremely uncomfortable at multiple points in the interaction and just...kept going. I know that this scam is relatively sophisticated compared to others, but I have to think if I was a scam prevention expert that I wouldn't tarnish my own name by putting a story with this much raw honesty out there. They basically violated rule #1 of scam avoidance which is that no legitimat…

I think you missed the point. They said circumstances can make it such that you can get scammed so let’s not blame the victim.

Re: I'm a scam prevention expert and I got scammed

#155

Post by rhizome »

Loughla wrote: post #15
buscoquadnary wrote: post #8

Security theater. I had a situation where I had to buy something online from a company in Europe (owl4thunderbird) I placed the charge and then right after I got a text telling me to call a # for a possible fraud alert. That's a big red flag there. So I try and find the phone # of the fraud dept of Citi because anyone can send a text message. Turns out can't find it anywhere in the official Citi site. So I finally gi…

>It is security theater of the worst degree by incompetents and MBAs and I am getting sick of it. It's security theater giving people exactly what they want. People want to feel secure, but they don't want any amount of actual difficulty in getting what they want from Company A. Like it or lump it, but regular people really don't want actual security. They want the ease and convenience of no passwords at all, and wan…

Of course people want security, how can you say otherwise? What you seem to be talking around is that security researchers have been unable to figure out simpler forms of maintaining a true sense of security, simpler forms of reliability. There is no survey where people say they don't want these things, and if you're relying on the sales figures for Yubi keys or something, that's not a good indicator.

And of course people don't want difficulty! That's why we don't hand-crank to start our cars anymore. Blaming people for wanting faster horses[1] is a convoluted anti-intellectualism where the experts who actually know what's possible are let off the hook. All in all, if you ask me this should be a locus of UI/UX research.

1. https://hbr.org/2011/08/henry-ford-never-said-the-fast

Re: I'm a scam prevention expert and I got scammed

#156

Post by Isthatablackgsd »

klik99 wrote: post #21

There's one easy rule that could have avoided all of this - never give out any info on incoming calls. If I get a call or text about fraudulent transactions, I'll keep them on hold while I log into the bank website. If I get a call about a late payment, I'll thank them for the info and ask them to stay on while I pay online. If I get an inbound call with a more complex request, I'll ask them for their employee info a…

I have the same rule for online chat support.

Last week, I cancelled my Netflix subscription and been trying to remove my credit card details from my account to prevent surprise reactivation in the future. There wasn't an option to do it online, so I went in their chat support and ask them to remove my CC information from my account. Then they asked me to provide my CC number to validate who I am. I told the rep that I am not comfortable sharing my CC information over the chat and prefers only give out my service code or alternative information. This rep kept ensuring that it is secured and they can't see what I am typing in. I asked them to initiate it and I will decide if it is trustworthy to put it down. I got the prompt and it asked for a full CC number. I declined the prompt and told them that I'm not comfortable doing that. And it didn't help that the rep are unintentionally behaving like a scammer. I shared my concerns about the rep behavior and remarks that scammers can say those things. The rep understand my concerns and asked for other information like the email address that is linked in the account and what are two recent activity on the device I uses. I gave out the information and validated I am the accountholder. Then the rep processed my request and I see my CC information is removed from my Netflix account.

Re: I'm a scam prevention expert and I got scammed

#157

Post by AnIdiotOnTheNet »

otterley wrote: post #26

Scam reports like these really frighten me. If someone of above-average intelligence like the author can nearly be taken for a ride, imagine how easily our friends and family -- who are often far more vulnerable -- can be taken advantage of. As the people most capable of remediating the vulnerabilities in our telecommunication and banking systems, I think we ought to close ranks and insist that our employers do a bet…

Why do you assume the author is of above average intelligence just because they work in a technology profession? I work in this industry, and I've met a lot of people even dumber than me in it, so intelligence can't be much of a requirement.

Re: I'm a scam prevention expert and I got scammed

#158

Post by TedDoesntTalk »

> opened a claim for the fraudulent transaction (frustratingly, there's no immediate reversal; have I mentioned yet that I loathe this bank?).

That’s because you have a debit card instead of a credit card. Get rid of the debit card. There are Zero consumer protections.

Re: I'm a scam prevention expert and I got scammed

#159

Post by feoren »

paxys wrote: post #71

I expected some crazy new attack vector that was so sophisticated it could fool this Scam Prevention Expert, but this post is laughable. They fell for textbook "scamming 101" that my grandma knows to avoid. Here's one tip for this expert – if you get a 2FA code over text or email that clearly has the line "we will never contact you for this code over phone or text" right under it, DON'T give it to a "support agent" o…

I agree. I nodded along to the part about not assuming it's the victim's fault, and then this "expert" falls for an extremely basic, obvious attack. "Wells Fargo will not contact you by phone or text to request this code." -- maybe that should have been bigger and bolder, but it was there. This guy should not be allowed to call himself a "scam prevention expert" anymore.

Re: I'm a scam prevention expert and I got scammed

#160

Post by jameshart »

Phiwise_ wrote: post #135
camtarn wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For the people who are confused: this is a fairly common thing on landlines in some countries, where the telephone exchange doesn't drop the connection until both ends have hung up, or in some cases when the caller hangs up but not the callee. So it's possible to put your own phone down, but when you pick it up again your phone is still connected to the scammer's telephone. If they play a convincing dial tone, then c…

Even already knowing about this I'm still mystified that landlines work this way on every occasion that I'm reminded of it. Does anyone know if there is, or at least was, a justification for this mode of operation? Was it at least of any use to anyone back around the 1900s or whenever or is it just another "we do it because that's how we've been doing it" residue that hasn't been cleaned yet?

Back in the day, folks would have more than one phone in their house.

Someone would call and all the phones would ring (or you might turn off the ringers on some of them so only one main phone actually rings). So someone might pick up the phone in the entrance hall and the caller would ask to speak to Becky, and Becky’s mom would yell up the stairs ‘BECKY PHONE’ and then put the receiver back down while Becky runs into her big sister’s room to grab the upstairs phone, and carry the whole phone, trailing on its wire, into her bedroom, slamming the door on the wire for privacy, before she picks up the receiver to answer.

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