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FTC sues Intuit for its deceptive TurboTax “free” filing campaign

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Re: FTC sues Intuit for its deceptive TurboTax “free” filing campaign

#191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems like one could setup an org/corp and get funding from those states to implement tax filing code.

Many states already have ways to file online for free. For example, Illinois: https://www2.illinois.gov/rev/programs/mytax/Pages/il-1040.a...

Definitely true. The goal is to unify the filing so that the user doesn't have to refill in their information for separate state and federal tax application websites.

Re: FTC sues Intuit for its deceptive TurboTax “free” filing campaign

#192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not confident in my ability to get my taxes right (mostly due to my wife and I having owned small businesses plus my day job's stock awards and ESPP), so I've paid a local CPA to do our taxes for years now. He always did an incredible job, was happy to answer my questions for me (tax-related or not), helped us refi our house at an amazing price, and so on. His fees were something on the order of $400 or maybe eve…

It's not like an honest mistake is the end of the world. I've made tax mistakes. You get a letter from the IRS, with the amount you owe or are due back, and you settle up. There are no draconian penalties or full audits unless they suspect intentional fraud.

Yep, that has been my experience. I got pretty freaked out once when I received a large packet from the IRS in the mail. Turns out I forgot to report a stock sale and just owed them a few hundred bucks. The only penalty was having to pay interest on the amount at a rate that was a little high but not egregious.

Re: FTC sues Intuit for its deceptive TurboTax “free” filing campaign

#193

I found out from a friend that she paid $600 to have her taxes done because (presumably) she falls for the dark patterns that TurboTax uses. She's a low paid service worker whose tax return can probably be done for free. And it is a sizable portion of her income because of things like Earned income tax credits, child tax credits, etc. Fuck these companies.

No post body was provided.

Re: FTC sues Intuit for its deceptive TurboTax “free” filing campaign

#194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The government has enough information to process the taxes for most of us or at least publicly make it super easy. TurboTax just lobbies the government to not do so.

About two weeks ago, I got a letter from the IRS telling me that I owe an extra eight-thousand dollars from my 2020 return, with a $1000 fine and $200 interest as a result. [1] I'm not mad about owing the money, but what annoys me is if they have enough information to know that I underreported, then why am I part of this equation to begin with? Clearly they have enough of my tax data to know I screwed up, so why don'…

If it's the first time you've screwed up the return, you might try calling them and ask to have the penalty waived or reduced. That works pretty often on first-time penalties.

Re: FTC sues Intuit for its deceptive TurboTax “free” filing campaign

#195
post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

About two weeks ago, I got a letter from the IRS telling me that I owe an extra eight-thousand dollars from my 2020 return, with a $1000 fine and $200 interest as a result. [1] I'm not mad about owing the money, but what annoys me is if they have enough information to know that I underreported, then why am I part of this equation to begin with? Clearly they have enough of my tax data to know I screwed up, so why don'…

You can file taxes without a software package, if you want. You have to file because they want you to report things they don't know about, and also if you want to claim itemized deductions.

It'd be great if they just billed me and I was on the hook for correcting them however. The current method is doing math homework under penalty of being fined.

Re: FTC sues Intuit for its deceptive TurboTax “free” filing campaign

#196
post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> paying taxes being hard is good because it reminds you how much money you give the government Wouldn't it be the opposite? Having a complicated tax system makes it harder to find out how much you're paying. If things were simpler it would be much more apparent.

As a non-American who's not self-employed or a business owner I get a monthly payslip with my gross pay and the tax deduction. I see that every month, I know exactly how much I pay the government. All my investments also have tax deducted by the provider as well, when applicable. I never have to think about calculating or filing tax, but I always see it and know exactly how much it is.

This is also the case for most Americans, but we're still expected to file every year. For most people, it's verifying what the government already knows. Filing a 1040-EZ with no itemization should be unnecessary.

Re: FTC sues Intuit for its deceptive TurboTax “free” filing campaign

#198

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> But the people you're telling to "Just do this" have already been trained to be terrified of the IRS. Many of them are currently paying huge fines due to missing their returns in prior years. Any small mistake can hang you when you're impoverished, precisely because you don't have any room for error. Why do you say that? I've never encountered people who were terrified nor have I read about it. How many people are…

My wife and her parents. Not her sisters though, admittedly. It's possible that I'm just reacting to a biased sample of people. But my impression was that this is a common mindset for a nontrivial subset of the population. Being afraid of doing something wrong on your government forms isn't really an irrational fear. Anyone who's owned a car in Chicago will tell you that the city's goal is to extract as many thousand…

> Most people don't have a clue what day they need to file by.

That does not at all match my experience, it's widely discussed every year, and I wonder how many returns are late.

Re: FTC sues Intuit for its deceptive TurboTax “free” filing campaign

#199

Good, but the situation is so much worse than just this. Most Americans could just use the IRS Free File system, which the article mentions, instead of ever giving money to Intuit or H&R Block ever again. But we don’t heavily advertise that system, because that would encourage people to use it, and if you’re going that far, you might as well let the IRS build its own tax software with all your information prefilled l…

I was not allowed to use the free file because I made >70k if I recall correctly. It seems really stupid and arbitrary to not allow people above a certain income to access software that helps them fill out govt. forms. Only lower income people deserve help filling out their taxes??! Bizarre.

Re: FTC sues Intuit for its deceptive TurboTax “free” filing campaign

#200
post #101

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a counter-example, sales taxes (and VATs) are very simple, yet almost nobody knows how much they’re paying.

In Europe VAT is a line item on every invoice. And apparently in the US you have to do some mental gymnastics to manually add sales tax to the listed price to figure out how much to pay in the first place. Of course most people have no idea how much VAT they pay for Amazon purchases in a year, but that's mostly a product of them not knowing how much they spend on Amazon in a year. If they know the latter, the former…

In the US, it's still a line item on your receipt. Most places don't include sales tax on the shelf tag or price sticker due to complexity. You can have state, county/area, and/or city taxes that apply. In NYC, for instance, we have a 4% NY State sales tax, a 4.5% NYC sales tax, and a 0.375% NYC metro area sales tax, totaling 8.875%. Clothes aren't taxed in the metro area sales tax so are 8.5% unless they're under $110 and then they're exempt. Most food is exempt except prepared food. Then there's the issue of fractions of a cent as the sales tax is calculated on the total bill not each item individually. There's also the fact that taxes change now and then... they adjust what food it applies to or what the cutoff is for clothes, etc. Some organizations have a sales tax exemption certificate (if they are a business planning to resell for instance) and that must also be taken into account.

Due to complexity, all larger stores with multiple geographic locations would never have separate pricing signage for every single store, so they don't. Other stores do the same. It's all calculated at the register as things are scanned in the computer.

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