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Ask HN: Is switching from VSCode to Vim worth it?

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Re: Ask HN: Is switching from VSCode to Vim worth it?

#31
I probably started using vi in 1989. What I learned then I still use all the time.

On the other hand, I primarily program Android at work, and in 2009 Android recommended I use the Eclipse IDE, so I learned how to use that. Then starting around 2013, Android said they were shifting from Eclipse to Android Studio, so then I learned that. Android Studio has odd keyboard shortcuts - on a Linux (or Windows) box you jump to a line by hitting Control-G - on a Mac you hit Command-L.

The vi on my Mac and Linux seem fairly similar in terms of keyboard shortcuts and what I use now on both of them is what I used in 2013 and what I used in 1989 as well, and I have used it for a host of things. Whereas even in the specialty of Android programming, the recommended IDE switched some years back, and it has differences on different platforms.

Re: Ask HN: Is switching from VSCode to Vim worth it?

#32
post #3
post #2

You don't mention anything about your needs. Vim shines when you need the same editing interface anywhere , on any VM, any server, any machine. If that's not you and VSCode suits your needs, especially around navigating large projects, then I'd say stick with that.

Good point. I’m a Fullstack js web dev and decided I should make the switch after a combination of getting fed up with unpleasant experiences on ec2 instances and creating dozens of custom vscode shortcuts that I later learned do things that basic vim does

With vscode.dev (github.dev) VS Code seems even more "everywhere" that I need it to be than ever before.

I don't know what your EC2 experiences have been like, of course, but there are ways to increase the reach of VS Code even into your EC2 instances. On the one side, are you editing a lot of dotfiles that should maybe be in a git repo and synced anyway? On the other side, maybe something like VS Code's very cool SSH remoting tools are more what you need: https://code.visualstudio.com/docs/remote/ssh

Re: Ask HN: Is switching from VSCode to Vim worth it?

#33
I don't know. My take is, I learned Vim once, and I'll stick to it no matter what kind of text editing I do. Learning Vim is like learning to ride a bicycle. Once I've learned it I can ride a normal bicycle, a modified bicycle, a sports bike, one with a child seat in the back, doesn't matter. I can ride it in the US, in Europe or in China, it's portable and I only have to learn it once. I don't want to learn a mode of transportation that only works in France. I don't want my way of getting around to depend on a cloud service which may disappear, or a company which may stop supporting at some point in the future.

Re: Ask HN: Is switching from VSCode to Vim worth it?

#34
I use coc-nvim [0] for my development environment and love it. The VS Code plugin is a great start to get used to vim movement, but eventually you'll run into some limitations that end up being slightly annoying (albeit this was a few years back and those might not exist anymore!).

Most of my development is in TypeScript, which has a pretty good language server, so I don't feel like I'm really missing out on any of the "IDE" features that I get in VSCode. I am not a "pure vim" zealot, so I have a decent amount of plugins to bring my environment closer to an "IDE" than "just vim" (eg. NerdTree, fugitive, surround, sneak).

I haven't really touched my dotfiles in a year or two outside a few custom keybinds for new workflows I find myself repeating.

Getting good at whatever editor you choose to use for your daily development is a good investment. If you're going to choose one, vim is probably a decent choice for how long it's stayed around.

[0] https://github.com/neoclide/coc.nvim

Re: Ask HN: Is switching from VSCode to Vim worth it?

#35
post #27

> I’m finding myself doubting the amount of time I’m dedicating to configuring/practicing vim If it's not fun, then it's probably not worth it. It really depends on what VIM can do to improve your current workflow. So, you may need to drop the VSCode mindset while you start using VIM. > but now that I’m trying to navigate medium/large projects, I actually have trouble navigating large projects in VSCode. The buffer,…

> Whenever I have to use VSCode (mainly for the live share feature, I find myself pretty lost with VSCode's tab based interface (I usually end up with like 20 tabs cluttering my workspace, and tabs are local to a split, which is jarring for me).

Yes, VSCode definitely has its own model similar to Vim's buffer/tab/window but that is somewhat unique to VSCode. There are some deep keyboard shortcuts that are similar, but quite different to Vim's, and I recall the VSCode Vim plugin tries its best to split the difference, somewhat.

Something I find very helpful with VSCode tab management in complex scenarios is the "Open Editors" pane. By default it is at the top of the Explorer panel. I think it defaults to minimized in fresh installs, though, but deep in the past it was the "only" tab management interface and a little bit more central to early VS Code workflows so some of us learned to rely on it early and others coming into VS Code fresh don't notice it at all. It's still one of the easiest places to do more complex tab and split management when the vertical tab bars are too cramped to be as useful as a horizontal list of opened tabs/splits.

Re: Ask HN: Is switching from VSCode to Vim worth it?

#36
If you're already comfortable with an editor (such as VSCode), don't worry about learning another one unless you inherently enjoy the journey (which it seems that you don't). Instead, invest some time learning features, keyboard shortcuts, and configurations of your current editor.

Also, if you use languages for which an IDE provides significant value - continue using whatever IDE you are using (... if you don't enjoy the vim/shell lifestyle). Vim is not an IDE, though it can eventually be configured to act like one. If you mainly program in C for example, an IDE provides minimal value beyond what a lightly configured Vim would provide.

Source: Near-full time vimmer and terminal tools user. I found joy in the journey as an end in and of itself.

Re: Ask HN: Is switching from VSCode to Vim worth it?

#37
post #27

> I’m finding myself doubting the amount of time I’m dedicating to configuring/practicing vim If it's not fun, then it's probably not worth it. It really depends on what VIM can do to improve your current workflow. So, you may need to drop the VSCode mindset while you start using VIM. > but now that I’m trying to navigate medium/large projects, I actually have trouble navigating large projects in VSCode. The buffer,…

> Whenever I have to use VSCode (mainly for the live share feature, I find myself pretty lost with VSCode's tab based interface (I usually end up with like 20 tabs cluttering my workspace, and tabs are local to a split, which is jarring for me). Yes, VSCode definitely has its own model similar to Vim's buffer/tab/window but that is somewhat unique to VSCode. There are some deep keyboard shortcuts that are similar, bu…

Awesome! This will make my liveshare sessions so much more bearable. I also found a plugin[1] that enforces single editors per tabs.

[1]: https://marketplace.visualstudio.com/items?itemName=martybeg...

Re: Ask HN: Is switching from VSCode to Vim worth it?

#38
post #20

4-5 years ago I was all about the editors with pretty UIs (VS Code, Brackets, Atom, JetBrains IDEs, etc). I thought Vim was dumb and outdated. Boy was I wrong. I eventually decided to try out Emacs, and settled on Spacemacs, which comes with Evil mode pre-installed (a Vim emulation layer on top of Emacs), so I basically had to learn some Vim bindings. Now I'm on Doom, which uses them even more heavily. And boy do I r…

> jumping through UIs and pointing and clicking. That's strange, most code editors have advanced keyboard shortcuts for almost everything you can do with pointing and clicking. You just have to learn the combos.

[deleted]

Re: Ask HN: Is switching from VSCode to Vim worth it?

#39
post #19

I know the feeling. I flirted with vim and later neovim for a few years on-off, but kept going back to vscode because i wasn't as fast in vim. I did stick with the vim keybinds in VSC though and, over time, each foray into vim lasted longer until the time came where I finally stuck with it. I'd recommend using one of the pre-baked configs (LunarVim, Astro, NvChad) to get a taste for what a batteries included vim buil…

> it does exactly what i want it to

It's difficult to describe how incredibly valuable this is. Pretty much my entire software stack[1] is scriptable, which means I can sand every corner as soon as it becomes an issue. The impact to my productivity from reduced mental load is honestly incalculable, and I'm pretty sure I couldn't concentrate nearly as deeply on complex things without it.

[1] I've started scripting my browser to behave better too, but that's the main holdout at this pt

Re: Ask HN: Is switching from VSCode to Vim worth it?

#40
post #31

I probably started using vi in 1989. What I learned then I still use all the time. On the other hand, I primarily program Android at work, and in 2009 Android recommended I use the Eclipse IDE, so I learned how to use that. Then starting around 2013, Android said they were shifting from Eclipse to Android Studio, so then I learned that. Android Studio has odd keyboard shortcuts - on a Linux (or Windows) box you jump…

This is the right perspective. Not “what can it do for me today”, but rather “what will it do for me over my entire career”.

The future of vim is more vim. I have been using vi and its descendants for over 30 years, and the core behavior is the same as it has always been. It has done all I ever needed, and it works everywhere and over slow connections.

The future of VSCode is at the mercy of Microsoft, and that absolutely will change under you without warning. They control the value of the skills that you learn. Why would you take that risk?

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