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Rare genital defects seen in sons of men taking major diabetes drug

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Re: Rare genital defects seen in sons of men taking major diabetes drug

#201

Post by caeril »

SpodGaju wrote: post #192
nradov wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Type-2 diabetes can't be cured, but it can be put into permanent remission with diet for many patients. Virta Health has peer-reviewed research supporting this approach. https://www.virtahealth.com/resource-type/research

> Type-2 diabetes can't be cured, but it can be put into permanent remission This is such a weird thing to say. If it never comes back you cured it. It's like saying a cold or cancer cannot be cured, but it can be put into permanent remission. It likely takes the agency away from people and apologizes for the failures of the medical industry.

> It likely takes the agency away from people

Everything we do around the topic of obesity is about palliative care for people's feelings. Health At Every Size, societal disdain for fat-shaming, etc. Medicating people with statins and insulin management drugs instead of directing them to put down the fucking fork and move occasionally.

Hundreds of thousands of Americans eat themselves to death every year. It is far and away the leading cause of early death, with COVID years additionally highlighting the fact that the VAST majority of deaths under the age of 60 were among the cohort who think donuts and beer constitute an appropriate dinner.

But instead of trying to save these people's lives, we are trying to spare their precious feelings, with the insane irony of the situation being that obesity itself is a STRONG predictor of depression. As if telling people that chugging a case of Pepsi per day is totally fine because you're beautiful as you are is going to save their mental health from the vagaries of the practically inevitable Zoloft drip they'll need to be on to keep the 9mm out of their mouth.

> and apologizes for the failures of the medical industry.

Our culture around obesity is absolutely batshit insane. And yes, medicalizing the symptoms rather than public hangings for food industry executives and widespread re-adoption of fat shaming is a HUGE factor in this.

edit: Sorry to be somewhat animated about this topic, but I am a former fatass who was, like many many Americans, victimized by the food and advertising industries, and eventually came to hate myself enough to strip off the fat and keep it off for well over a decade. And my "negative self talk" has led to being a MUCH happier person. It drives me INSANE that this culture is killing so many of us and wrecking our mental health, but we choose to make it worse.

Re: Rare genital defects seen in sons of men taking major diabetes drug

#202

Post by SpodGaju »

caeril wrote: post #201
SpodGaju wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Type-2 diabetes can't be cured, but it can be put into permanent remission This is such a weird thing to say. If it never comes back you cured it. It's like saying a cold or cancer cannot be cured, but it can be put into permanent remission. It likely takes the agency away from people and apologizes for the failures of the medical industry.

> It likely takes the agency away from people Everything we do around the topic of obesity is about palliative care for people's feelings. Health At Every Size, societal disdain for fat-shaming, etc. Medicating people with statins and insulin management drugs instead of directing them to put down the fucking fork and move occasionally. Hundreds of thousands of Americans eat themselves to death every year. It is far a…

If I could share with you here the chart of my cholesterol reduction I achieved after drastically changing my omega 6 to omega 3 ratio in my diet... But also the changes to my mood, my Lupus, my kidney function, etc...

And yes, obesity, fat cells are immune cells and they are inflammatory under a poor diet. And this ignorance of the nature of obesity is even more important with SARS2 running around rampant.

I will only say that obesity combined with nutrient deficiency is more important than obesity alone.

https://www.nature.com/articles/d42859-021-00051-w In a healthy body, adipose tissue plays a positive role, serving as reservoir of energy in times of food scarcity. Fat tissue is also full of immune system cells. And in lean, healthy individuals, it secretes factors that are anti-inflammatory and protective.

If, however, the fat tissue becomes unhealthy, as often happens in people with obesity, it can become dysfunctional and secrete hormones and other chemical signals that promote chronic low-grade inflammation.

Re: Rare genital defects seen in sons of men taking major diabetes drug

#203

Post by InitialLastName »

ccalloway wrote: post #187
eMSF wrote: post #180

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A condition which would affect 6e-6%, or 0.000006% of the US population (330M) would affect 20 persons. 200000/330M = 0.0006 = 0.06%.

The deformity in the general population affects 0.24% of male babies, so 0.12% of the population.

GGP is still 4 orders of magnitude off.

Re: Rare genital defects seen in sons of men taking major diabetes drug

#204

Post by belorn »

msrenee wrote: post #148
belorn wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

From what I recall reading about epigenetics, diabetes is caused by a too fast change in diet towards high calorie. After several generations the metabolism thriftiness goes down if the diet level remain the same, and thus diabetes rates will go down. Same concept happens in reverse when there is periods of famine.

That's quite a claim. Do you have some sources for that?

My guess is that I read it in a book by Robert Sapolsky titled Why Zebras Don't Get Ulcers, but I won't reread the book just to give you the exact page number. It could also be one of the youtube talks by him where he go through epigenetics.

What I will do is a simple web search: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/18197594/ and https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6463748/

To quote the later study: "Given that risk for diabetes and its complications is linked to both genetic and environmental factors, it is not surprising that there are now more than 1,000 articles that address the intersection of diabetes and epigenetics or epigenomics"

The case study that I remember was studies done on Indigenous populations when they got introduced to a west-style diet by being integrated into west society. The following generations had higher rate of type 2 diabetes compared to children of existing demographics. There has also been a plentora of studies done on children born after the dutch hunger winter (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transgenerational_epigenetic_i...), where one of the finding was increased risk of glucose intolerance in adulthood.

Re: Rare genital defects seen in sons of men taking major diabetes drug

#205

Post by giantg2 »

SpodGaju wrote: post #194
giantg2 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow, if they aren't suggesting dietary and exercise based solutions first, that's a huge red flag. Find a new doctor.

You will be hard pressed to find a doctor that talks nutrition. It took me four years to force my doctor to test my serum zinc levels. When she did they found I was deficient. She did not know what to do, nor did it even seem to impact or shock her. Zinc sulphate gave my life back to me. (Lupus, mood disorder) You would think that my doctor would share this with everyone. But no.

Interesting. A family member was having memory issues and the doctors were very supportive of our idea to look at the possibility of testing blood levels and taking supplements or changing diet based on the findings.

Re: Rare genital defects seen in sons of men taking major diabetes drug

#206

Post by SpodGaju »

giantg2 wrote: post #205
SpodGaju wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You will be hard pressed to find a doctor that talks nutrition. It took me four years to force my doctor to test my serum zinc levels. When she did they found I was deficient. She did not know what to do, nor did it even seem to impact or shock her. Zinc sulphate gave my life back to me. (Lupus, mood disorder) You would think that my doctor would share this with everyone. But no.

Interesting. A family member was having memory issues and the doctors were very supportive of our idea to look at the possibility of testing blood levels and taking supplements or changing diet based on the findings.

Medical care is not distributed evenly in the U.S.

I think my issue was I was already disabled and on Medicare diagnosed with Bipolar disorder which is caused by my immune disregulation, probably Lupus.

https://apm.amegroups.com/article/view/60122/html

Anyway, it is difficult for the doctors to get medicare to cover these tests. I also insisted she perform a serum amino acid test which revealed several high amino acids including all of the branched chain amino acids. She had to make up reasons to get them to cover the tests even though I have all these issues, including poor kidney function.

There is defiantly a stigma with how they treat people with mood disorders. Any physical complaint was always treated as it it were something I was imagining. I was only luckyy that my mother and brother has Ankylosing Spondylitis because even though I still had to fight to get an MRI for my lower back pain and they found I was in the early stages of the disease as well.

She said now that she had the nutritional results she did not know what to do with them and she could not even send me to a specialist.

Re: Rare genital defects seen in sons of men taking major diabetes drug

#207

Post by nradov »

SpodGaju wrote: post #199
nradov wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think your might not understand the medical terminology. There is a distinct difference between curing an acute infectious disease versus putting a chronic condition into remission. In the majority of cases, cancer can't be cured either; it usually isn't possible to eliminate 100% of malignant cells so if the patient survives long enough then the same cancer will eventually return. While a low-carb diet can often p…

What I am saying the medical terminology is the problem. > if the intervention is removed then the condition will return. If the interventions preventing covid are removed the condition will return. Do you get that? On cancer; we all have malignant cells, all the time. everyone right now has cancer cells in their body. https://news.cancerresearchuk.org/2018/04/18/science-surgery... Not smoking is an intervention agai…

I don't understand your point. Most people including me don't engage in daily ongoing interventions to avoid COVID-19. Everyone can expect to get infected with SARS-CoV-2 (probably multiple times) but only a subset of those infections will cause clinically significant COVID-19 symptoms.

https://www.medpagetoday.com/opinion/vinay-prasad/94646

Good lifestyle choices can usually prevent type-2 diabetes, but prevention is different from curing an existing condition. That's just medical reality and changing terminology wouldn't impact that.

The zinc deficiency hypothesis is interesting but remains unproven, and can't possibly explain large increases in diabetes. This would be a good area for further research.

Re: Rare genital defects seen in sons of men taking major diabetes drug

#208

Post by giantg2 »

SpodGaju wrote: post #206
giantg2 wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting. A family member was having memory issues and the doctors were very supportive of our idea to look at the possibility of testing blood levels and taking supplements or changing diet based on the findings.

Medical care is not distributed evenly in the U.S. I think my issue was I was already disabled and on Medicare diagnosed with Bipolar disorder which is caused by my immune disregulation, probably Lupus. https://apm.amegroups.com/article/view/60122/html Anyway, it is difficult for the doctors to get medicare to cover these tests. I also insisted she perform a serum amino acid test which revealed several high amino aci…

Ah, true, coverage can be an issue. We were willing and able to pay out of pocket for tests, if needed.

So were they hesitant to do the test at all, or was it that they didn't know how to order it for your insurance to cover it? That would be a big difference in my mind. Most doctors don't fight having blood tests done if there's at least some rationale for why to do it. They're so common and low risk.

Yeah, I have had doctors just totally dismiss things when they know nothing about them (like saying things that are unsupported and contrary to new research). I have also had doctors say they didn't know but would do some research (good sign, but less common).

Re: Rare genital defects seen in sons of men taking major diabetes drug

#209

Post by bladley »

AmericanChopper wrote: post #138
imtringued wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>a direct outcome of a person’s intentional choices. You mean like a politician promoting obesity inducing foods? If it is really about individuals then obesity shouldn't be going up in African nations that quickly.

No food is specifically obesity inducing, and you personally are responsible for everything you choose to eat, not a politician.

> No food is specifically obesity inducing

This is false. Of course certain foods are metabolized in ways that are more likely to lead to obesity than others.

Re: Rare genital defects seen in sons of men taking major diabetes drug

#210

Post by SpodGaju »

giantg2 wrote: post #208
SpodGaju wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Medical care is not distributed evenly in the U.S. I think my issue was I was already disabled and on Medicare diagnosed with Bipolar disorder which is caused by my immune disregulation, probably Lupus. https://apm.amegroups.com/article/view/60122/html Anyway, it is difficult for the doctors to get medicare to cover these tests. I also insisted she perform a serum amino acid test which revealed several high amino aci…

Ah, true, coverage can be an issue. We were willing and able to pay out of pocket for tests, if needed. So were they hesitant to do the test at all, or was it that they didn't know how to order it for your insurance to cover it? That would be a big difference in my mind. Most doctors don't fight having blood tests done if there's at least some rationale for why to do it. They're so common and low risk. Yeah, I have h…

She was hesitant because of my mood disorder diagnosis. She frankly admitted that. What I feel changed her mind is that I asked here what caused my mood disorder. She said she did not know. So I asked why she is not doing everything to help me find out.

But all this too extensive logging, research, and persuasion on my part.

To emphasize the issue I have had with doctors on medicare; I had IBS-D, a flare up so bad, for over a month. I went to a doctor, they took one fecal test which showed nothing. They did not reply to my continuing issue so I went back to them. The doctor said exactly this; "What do you want me to do about it?" I lost it. Yelled at him so loudly others came into the office. They never sent me to a gastro doc. I need up curing it on my own by using my understanding of my genetics and diet changes.

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