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3,599,040,600 € wired by Germany to Russia since the invasion of Ukraine

stopgas.org

51–60 of 240 posts

Re: 3,599,040,600 € wired by Germany to Russia since the invasion of Ukraine

#51
post #3

Ok, so what is the solution you propose? Quit russian gaz cold turkey, today? Let people in Berlin freeze to death tonight? (Temperatures are 0 degrees C at night)

Just honesty and that the German government states this clearly at the same time that says “we are fully with Ukraine”.

You can just say “we are with Ukraine up to the russian gas.” But that would just be true not beautiful.

Re: 3,599,040,600 € wired by Germany to Russia since the invasion of Ukraine

#52

Quoted post unavailable.

instead of banning Russian oil, I would first start with banning sending weapons to Ukraine and demand 240 hours non-stop negotiations to stop the war sooner. 10 days of not leaving anywhere unless consensus has been reached

There won't be consensus. This war started over one party having lots of demands and not even recognizing the other party as sovereign and the other party just wanting to be left in peace. How the fuck should a compromise look like here?

It's like being robbed at gunpoint and negotiating a deal with the robber about how much you might keep.

Re: 3,599,040,600 € wired by Germany to Russia since the invasion of Ukraine

#53
post #46

I wouldn’t doubt, given the nefarious consequences for Germany, that this site is Russian INFOSEC campaign. Germany cannot function without Russian gas right now. Simple there isn’t enough BTU’s. Why did Germany put itself into this strange Russian dependency is also very strange. Perfectly fine and environmentally friendly nuclear power plants for dependency from Russian natural gas. Why?

> Why did Germany put itself into this strange Russian dependency is also very strange.

Because they wanted to go green but also have a really, _really_ bad case of NIMBY.

Re: 3,599,040,600 € wired by Germany to Russia since the invasion of Ukraine

#55
post #3

Ok, so what is the solution you propose? Quit russian gaz cold turkey, today? Let people in Berlin freeze to death tonight? (Temperatures are 0 degrees C at night)

It is not comfortable but inside houses you do not freeze to death like that. Sleep in your clothes, buy an electric heater next to your bed, get an electric blanket etc. I slept for quite a long time like that in the Netherlands because my mates squat building had no heat. That was during one of the coldest winters where all canals in Amsterdam were frozen enough to skate on. So yeah, not comfortable but freezing to…

Living can be intolerable real fast. It does not have to be death. I think the OP was not saying literally.

Also, if the majority of the population is losing heating and need to do your suggested preparation, I wouldn't bet my luck on successfully getting a heater and a electric blanket. There was a freaking toilet paper shortage in covid because of panic buying. These and whatnot will be gone in minutes.

Re: 3,599,040,600 € wired by Germany to Russia since the invasion of Ukraine

#56
The environmentalists did this. They killed nuclear. They killed wind in Bavaria. This is the price of all that. Europe has destroyed her nature over the centuries, and now Europe won't do her part. If Russia has Germany by the balls, it's their own fault.

Re: 3,599,040,600 € wired by Germany to Russia since the invasion of Ukraine

#57

Maybe I'm naive but I can see why Western countries tried to get Russia on board the world capitalism gravy train. Obviously the context has changed massively in the past month, maybe even since 2014. In any event, less reliance on fossil fuels is a good thing, and at the moment, less reliance on Russian fossil fuels in the EU is probably a good thing.

The context changed in 2008 when they invaded Georgia.

Re: 3,599,040,600 € wired by Germany to Russia since the invasion of Ukraine

#58
post #47

If you double-down on renewables, then you double-down on natural gas. Germany decided to close down their nuclear and coal generation, so the only thing that is left is natural gas for base load (and to augment renewable intermittency problems).

Or on batteries, or on liquid salt thermal storage upgrades for old fossil plants, or on hydro storage, or on salt cavern pneumatic pressure, or on hydrogen, or on regenerative iron dust cycles, or... The idea that it's nuclear or fossil for baseload is a false dichotomy, that ingores the dozens of intermediary storage solutions. Solar is currently the cheapest source of energy with a margin. Add storage to an overpr…

> The german failure to finish the "energiewende" is a political one,

And that is one of the reasons that the most recent election led to the elevation of the Green Party.

Re: 3,599,040,600 € wired by Germany to Russia since the invasion of Ukraine

#59
post #46

I wouldn’t doubt, given the nefarious consequences for Germany, that this site is Russian INFOSEC campaign. Germany cannot function without Russian gas right now. Simple there isn’t enough BTU’s. Why did Germany put itself into this strange Russian dependency is also very strange. Perfectly fine and environmentally friendly nuclear power plants for dependency from Russian natural gas. Why?

> I wouldn’t doubt, given the nefarious consequences for Germany, that this site is Russian INFOSEC campaign.

Is this a variant of poe's law? In other words, a campaign is considered so ridiculous that it couldn't possibly legitimate, and must be part of a foreign disinformation campaign?

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