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Windows needs a change in priorities

den.dev

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Re: Windows needs a change in priorities

#351

Post by sandGorgon »

banana_giraffe wrote: post #44
segphault wrote: post #22

Like every Windows user, I have had a lot of frustrating experiences with the abusive behavior and dark patterns that have taken over the platform. Like when they started having Skype silently run in the background logged in with the user's Microsoft account without any notice or human intervention, and removed the setting to disable it from launching at startup so that it couldn't be prevented. I had to completely u…

Even stuff like WSL is loosing it's shine now for me. I've personally hit a bug on multiple computers that I can reliably repo a blue screen if I attempt to update a specific package. The github bug for this issue last had activity from MS 4 months ago. Kinda makes it hard to take it seriously if such a major blocker is treated with such low priority.

wsl2 has been very very stable for me. in fact, i have spent a lot of time in the last 6 months on wsl2 (FYI - fedora is my main)

i really recommend trying out wsl2. you now can install it from the window store.

Re: Windows needs a change in priorities

#352

Post by at_a_remove »

GekkePrutser wrote: post #314
MarkSweep wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s not quite Windows 2000, but the LTSC edition has much of the bullshit stripped out. It does not support the store therefore Candy Crush is not installed by default. And I don’t think it’s quite $1000, if you can figure out how to buy it.

The latest LTSC actually doesn't have as much stripped out anymore. Telemetry choices are the same now and also MS accounts are there. I was really disappointed when I tried it.

Hold up. Windows 11 LTSC forces you to use Microsoft accounts, you can't go local at all? Not doubting, just need clarification.

Re: Windows needs a change in priorities

#353

Post by jiggawatts »

userbinator wrote: post #347
jiggawatts wrote: post #259

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dead end.

I wouldn't say that, it's basically what keeps Windows alive.

Win32 is on life support. Many new features added since Vista don't work with it at all, or require complex code to enable in Win32 apps.

Re: Windows needs a change in priorities

#354

Post by Gigachad »

ryandrake wrote: post #297

There's been a big shift in the whole software industry from "enable what the user wants to do" over to "we want the user to do this". Back in the '90s, we would go out, talk to customers, find out their needs, gather requirements, and write software that enables them to do what they want to do. Now, in a lot of software companies, it's the opposite. Product leadership starts with "What do we want users to do?" and t…

The skype thing kinda makes sense. People want software which just works without configuration. When you sign in to an iphone or macbook, it immediately sets up facetime which is always active waiting for a call in the background. No one complains because this is expected and it has always happened.

But then Microsoft wants to give their users the same conveniance as Apple users get with their "just works" setup and people call it user hostile and malware. It makes perfect sense that users would like a way to call other windows users in a way that doesn't involve installing things and fiddling around with more accounts/configuration.

Re: Windows needs a change in priorities

#355

Post by killjoywashere »

Windows can only deprecate things at the rate people retire, so it ends up looking like a house that four generations of a family live in. Junior’s flashing the lights in the hall in time with Bassnectar using a programmable lightbulb he wired to an arduino while grandma is playing pinochle on the back porch with a couple of birds from church. Mom’s in the kitchen counting her blessings, enjoying her circa 1997 gas stove while Dad’s trying to figure out if he has to pony up for a new laptop for daughter to finish her homework, or is her problem that the latest Word won’t run Java applets? Did Word ever run applets? Meanwhile, Junior barely knows pinochle is a thing, but Grandma is convinced he has summoned demons. Kids these days.

Re: Windows needs a change in priorities

#356

Post by zaphirplane »

ryandrake wrote: post #297

There's been a big shift in the whole software industry from "enable what the user wants to do" over to "we want the user to do this". Back in the '90s, we would go out, talk to customers, find out their needs, gather requirements, and write software that enables them to do what they want to do. Now, in a lot of software companies, it's the opposite. Product leadership starts with "What do we want users to do?" and t…

It’s probably driven by all the unicorns and massive tech companies that got where they are by building what they think the customers will want.

Not defending, but I do recall the ford quote of “If I’d asked customers what they wanted, they would have said ‘a faster horse’”

Re: Windows needs a change in priorities

#357

Post by bruce511 »

sgjohnson wrote: post #210
khaledh wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is that Windows with all its warts now is still far ahead of the competition in that department (desktop GUI). Whether that's due to monopoly or being actually better, it doesn't matter. The fact is competition is almost non-existent.

In what ways is Windows desktop GUI better than macOS? The only thing Windows has going for itself is backwards compatability.

That's a pretty big thing.

I'm still using programs daily that I acquired in the 90's,some of which was last updated in the 90s.

Updating the OS is one thing, there will be change, and none of us likes change, but it doesn't cascade down to having to change every detail of my work flow.

So maybe it's the only thing Windows has, but for me anyway it's a pretty big "only".

Re: Windows needs a change in priorities

#358

Post by devmunchies »

srvmshr wrote: post #336
ryandrake wrote: post #297

There's been a big shift in the whole software industry from "enable what the user wants to do" over to "we want the user to do this". Back in the '90s, we would go out, talk to customers, find out their needs, gather requirements, and write software that enables them to do what they want to do. Now, in a lot of software companies, it's the opposite. Product leadership starts with "What do we want users to do?" and t…

That misguided notion of product features and integration, where the user has minimum role, started out at Apple. The standard pattern used to be talking to OEMs and discussing what users wanted from them. That review phase generated update ideas for next release and so on. Apple turned that question on its head and made it "the one last thing" show business. We have employed a generation of PMs now who idolize Steve…

> We have employed a generation of PMs now who idolize Steve Jobs' mantra: "Users dont know what they want until you show it to them".

just because a bunch of dumb PMs are pushing hot garbage to the user doesn't mean that statement is false. There almost always IS a way to improve and innovate a user experience—a new experience that the user hasn't thought of before. Its just that the PM incentives aren't aligned with the users these days.

Re: Windows needs a change in priorities

#359

Post by banana_giraffe »

sandGorgon wrote: post #351
banana_giraffe wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even stuff like WSL is loosing it's shine now for me. I've personally hit a bug on multiple computers that I can reliably repo a blue screen if I attempt to update a specific package. The github bug for this issue last had activity from MS 4 months ago. Kinda makes it hard to take it seriously if such a major blocker is treated with such low priority.

wsl2 has been very very stable for me. in fact, i have spent a lot of time in the last 6 months on wsl2 (FYI - fedora is my main) i really recommend trying out wsl2. you now can install it from the window store.

Yep, I know people love it. It sent my machine into a boot loop till I could uninstall it in safe mode.

I'll live with a dedicated VM for now.

Re: Windows needs a change in priorities

#360

Post by knighthack »

NeutronStar wrote: post #272
GekkePrutser wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't agree. KDE in particular feels more well rounded than ever before. I use it on FreeBSD but I use Linux on servers and I'm also very happy with that. Windows 10 is stable for me too though I was hit with the eTPM stutter bug (I use my Windows box exclusively for gaming, in particular VR which I didn't feel like figuring out in proton). But the windows dark patterns are surely there and I hate them. But as it's…

I don't even use a desktop environment. Gonna be using a window manager for ever. Most of everything is run on the command line anyway.

How do you browse the Internet then?
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